Holset Turbos, PART 7

[1gDSM4g63]

Here is a little sneak peak of our setup for next year guys. Ended up getting a twin scroll manifold (still needs wastegate flanges welded on), twin scroll 18cm hot side HX40.

A 16cm is probably the biggest housing you can put on a bottom mount manifold. It forced me to go side exhaust to avoid preposterous bends.

But you'll be very please on the spool rate.

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[Kevin TSI]

Do you think the 16cm or 18cm would be better for us on our top mount?

 

[SpeedAddict62]

Try both, and post logs of MAP, during a 3rd gear pull or something. Even better, dyno to measure power differences, and measure backpressure.

 

[knochgoon24]

I had a random idea pop into my head today. Do you think the stock BCS system could be used to effectively control a VGT using a normal internal WG actuator to control the vanes? With Link or EcuFlash, I don't see why not.

I can only speak for the Evo 8 Ecu platform, but we can:
-Change the duty cycle of the BCS based on rpm, load, psi, and/or gear.
-Use TPS signal to do WGDC correction. You could possibly get it to open a bit extra under cruise.

Am I completely delusional, or is reasonable control over VGT based turbo finally possible? Our cars can be setup to monitor everything that the diesel trucks these came off of do. You might not get ECU control over EGT, but you can monitor it with a gauge and reprogram the tables in the ECU as necessary.

From what I hear you still need an external wastegate, since even with the vanes fully open, which yeilds a 25+ cm^2 housing, you still can't keep the boost under 25-30psi. Plus, it works like a safety net. Just run it off a MBC.

If could be fun to mess around with, if my car wasn't my DD.

 

[1gDSM4g63]

Do you think the 16cm or 18cm would be better for us on our top mount?

Why would a top mount be better? My bottom mount was significantly cheaper costing me only $700 instead well over a grand, has shorter and more consistent runners which lead to faster spool, and can probably dissipate heat better than having it float up top. My 16cm fitted and that's that but then again it's 2 cent thinking...

 

[DraginX]

Can someone take a few measurements of the overall diameter of the compressor housing and turbine housing of their HX52. I need to know before I build my manifold as I have a feeling I will upgrade from the hx40 in the near future.

 

[dsm-onster]

You're sure your going to be making 650whp (to max out the hx40)?

 

[1gDSM4g63]

Can someone take a few measurements of the overall diameter of the compressor housing and turbine housing of their HX52. I need to know before I build my manifold as I have a feeling I will upgrade from the hx40 in the near future.

Depends on the housing you get, but I'll measurement my HX52 with 16cm tomorrow. Although I don't think it'll be that accurate with it already bolted on. You made want to PM slippi84 for a more accurate measurement for it with a 16cm housing.

 

[DraginX]

You're sure your going to be making 650whp (to max out the hx40)?

I won't be this year for sure, I just want to build the manifold with enough clearance so I don't have to do it again when that time comes.

 

[Kevin TSI]

Why would a top mount be better? My bottom mount was significantly cheaper costing me only $700 instead well over a grand, has shorter and more consistent runners which lead to faster spool, and can probably dissipate heat better than having it float up top. My 16cm fitted and that's that but then again it's 2 cent thinking...

I think you are confused by my post. I was asking which of the two housings you think would be better. We already have the top mount and downpipe so i'm not switching back to a bottom mount. Plus I got an amazing deal.

 

[1gDSM4g63]

I think you are confused by my post. I was asking which of the two housings you think would be better. We already have the top mount and downpipe so i'm not switching back to a bottom mount. Plus I got an amazing deal.

Ah... sorry, my mistake. I don't know how much difference 2cm can make in spooling on a divided manifold and housing setup, but I'd say the smaller size you can go is better especially on a HX40.

 

[Weapon-X]

I'd think the 16cm^2 housing would make for a good combination of quick spool and great top end flow.

 

[JWoodley]

I think you are confused by my post. I was asking which of the two housings you think would be better. We already have the top mount and downpipe so i'm not switching back to a bottom mount. Plus I got an amazing deal.

Pictures of this setup or ban.

 

[Weapon-X]

Pictures of this setup or ban.

Post #172

 

[JWoodley]

Post #172

That looks awesome. Kevin what does the downpipe look like? Side exit or factory style?

 

[Kevin TSI]

That looks awesome. Kevin what does the downpipe look like? Side exit or factory style?

The downpipe is set up factory style but we will be making t side exit since the car is mainly a race car. It is all stainless, full 3.5" I am in the process of changing the flange to a v band to match the turbo and I will put up a few more pictures. Also keep an eye out for my blogs to see detailed updates of the rest of the car. We just finished the roll cage yesterday.

Here is a picture of the turbo actually mounted to the manifold for mock up. Like I said its an 18cm housing. Hot side still needs to be blasted and ceramic coated.

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Also a picture of the downpipe and old T3 manifold.

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I will stop hijacking this thread now.

Since we are using a divided manifold I know we are supposed to use dual wastegates. Since we are going to be running high boost do you think we could get away with a single 44mm wastegate? I just wanted to know your thoughts about this.

 

[kawboy]

The point behind dual gates is to keep ALL exhaust flow SEPERATE. Nothing to do with what boost you're running.

 

[1gDSM4g63]

Kawboy is right, the amount of boost you're running has absolutely nothing to do with the number is wastegate you use.

The true divided setup has 2 wastegate, if you're only using one than it's not a 100 percent divided because the wastegate tube connects both the divided sides.

And save yourself the money, 38mm wastegates is good enough.

 

[Kevin TSI]

Gotcha. Sorry I was a little thrown off when I saw divided set ups with 1 wastegate. I already have a 44mm so I'll guess i'll find another one. Thanks for clearing that up for me.

 

[1gDSM4g63]

Gotcha. Sorry I was a little thrown off when I saw divided set ups with 1 wastegate. I already have a 44mm so I'll guess i'll find another one. Thanks for clearing that up for me.

If you're going to add another wastegate make sure it's identical to the other wastegate and has the same spring.

If you're going to ceramic coat the hotside you may as well do the downpipe too. By the way, why did you put the second o2 sensor that far down after the dump tube?

 

[JWoodley]

Kev, I'm serious about wanting a downpipe.

Also, hurry up and get that beast ready to go. I'm interested in the spoolup characterisitics and airflow.

 

[Kevin TSI]

I am interested how it will work out as well. Now that winter is here there will be a lot more time to work on it. Expect the car to be finished by May (crosses fingers) with all summer to have it dialed in just the way we want it. There is a lot left to do. But we will have it at the shootout this year even if I have to go without sleep from now until then in order to finish it.

 

[Gooberlog]

Gotcha. Sorry I was a little thrown off when I saw divided set ups with 1 wastegate. I already have a 44mm so I'll guess i'll find another one. Thanks for clearing that up for me.

Ouch, those 44mm gates are pricey. I've been looking one for my o2 housing i picked up. I really should have gone with a bolt on o2 housing that fits a 38mm as they're much cheaper.
BTW: Awesome work on the DP, i really like how the waste gate dump is welded back into the Down pipe. Looks very clean.

 

[dsm-onster]

You can run a single gate and you will have no contamination IF you run a divider in gate passage up to flush with the gate valve. It will work properly.

However, the below is NOT what you want to do:

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[frankozz]

Well I just bought a H1C T3 v band for $200 with minimal shaft play.

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