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Holset Turbos, PART 6

Posted by Morphius, Mar 4, 2009

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  1. dsm-onster

    dsm-onster DSM Wiseman

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    Bloxom, Virginia
    Yep, that's the nice thing about the 7blade hx35 vs. the 8blade hx35. You have enough total turbo with the bolton housing to better a 20g or 50trim. Then when you want more, you can just upgrade to a t3 manifold and put the original t3 hx35 turbine housing back on (radiusing the divider), and have about another 80-100whp potential. Just need a t3 manifold and customize an o2 housing. . .
     

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    1990 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    manual · 1G DSM
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  2. Gooberlog

    Gooberlog Proven Member

    1,104
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    Joined Dec 30, 2002
    Westminster, Maryland
    So is the 8 blade HX-35 not a T3 hot side? I thought the only differences between the HX-35 7 & 8 blade models were the compressor wheels?


    Viperlp01- thanks for the tech write up on the install, sourcing out the turbo isn't that bad but all of the little parts to make it work on the car seems to the trick. This will help quite a bit once one makes it way to my door step.
     

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    1992 Plymouth Laser RS Turbo AWD
    11.180 @ 127.000 · 1G DSM
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  3. dsm-onster

    dsm-onster DSM Wiseman

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    Bloxom, Virginia
    Holset doesn't make turbos with MHI flanges :)

    What I'm saying is that when you buy your 7blade hx35 and want to run a bolton setup for now, don't sell the hx35 turbine housing just yet. you may want to go for more down the road and that housing will let you see the potential of the 7blade wheel easier.

    Now the 8blade hx35 is still an incredible turbo. flows 52lb/min (3-4 over the 50-trim and 20g). Yet in the bolton configuration spools faster. Considering how abundent they are and how affordable they can be had, they are a perfect option to those thinking about from an evo3 16g/18g/20g/50trim/fp3052. Very nice option.

    Running out and buying the 7blade hx35 and then getting the FP race manifold is kind of self defeating. No offense intended to those whove done this. Why get such a high flowing compressor (and paying more since usually the 7blade hx35 costs more) then limit your self to a bolton housing because you spent $300 on an FP manifold.
     

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    1990 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    manual · 1G DSM
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  4. Wicked95AWD

    Wicked95AWD Proven Member

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    Joined Sep 26, 2005
    Fayetteville, Arkansas
    Sweet! We just got an E85 station here in Fayetteville! :D I'm gonna see what the HX40 pro can do on this stuff. I only wish I would have opted for bigger injectors. According to a post I read last night my 1200cc PTE injectors are only good for 67lb per min on E85. Any idea if that number is accurate? I may bite the bullet and take the car to Nate at TPG for a good E85 tune. Should I go with bigger injectors, or can I max out this turbo on E85 with my 1200s?
     

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    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    manual · 2G DSM
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  5. dsmmatt28

    dsmmatt28 Proven Member

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    That sounds about right. Do you have twin fuel pumps. CAuse your going to need that for sure.
     

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    1990 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    manual · 1G DSM
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  6. Wicked95AWD

    Wicked95AWD Proven Member

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    Joined Sep 26, 2005
    Fayetteville, Arkansas
    Yes, I'm running dual 255lph pumps w SS feed to the rail.
     

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    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    manual · 2G DSM
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  7. dsm-onster

    dsm-onster DSM Wiseman

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    You're going to need 1600s. The hx40 can flow enough for 650whp. If you're serious about pushing this turbo to the limit, you'll need more injector.
     

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    1990 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    manual · 1G DSM
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  8. Wicked95AWD

    Wicked95AWD Proven Member

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    Fayetteville, Arkansas
    I would prefer not to push my current injectors to 100% IDC but if I did, shouldn't my PTE 1200cc injectors (which are estimated to flow enough for 67lb per min on E85) be enough for me to make over 650whp on ethanol without upgrading to 1600s? As far as I know the HX40 pro is only capable of 69lb per min and the average lb per min horsepower output for these cars is around 10whp per lb per min. Right? What boost level, A/f ratio, and timing would likely be ideal to push the HX40 pro as far as possible on my current setup with ethanol until I can afford an injector upgrade?
     

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    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    manual · 2G DSM
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  9. dsmtalontsi95

    dsmtalontsi95 Proven Member

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    glenvile, Pennsylvania
    Well I went out and did some more tunning. Temp was at about 65'. I hit 55.9 lb/min at 28 psi, also 70-90 times at 1.8
     

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  10. My1GLaser

    My1GLaser Proven Member

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    Bartow, Florida
    Hmmm...please don't take this as criticism, but I have an HX-35 ready to go on and am really hoping for a good increase from what I currently have.

    Your car should be faster if you are flowing 55 lb/min. I get 1.7-1.8sec 70-90 on my 18g, and I am only flowing 42lb/min @ 28psi. Something doesn't add up. It doesn't look like your clutch is slipping either, but something is holding you back or your MAF is wacky. Your boostest is pretty good though, so I am at a loss.

    You are a little rich, you need some more timing, but I won't include a bunch of tuning stuff b/c thats not on topic. I still don't think it can be all tuning related though.

    It is nice to see full boost hit at the same time as my little 18g. It will be a nice upgrade for me over the winter.
     
    Last edited: Oct 29, 2009

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    1992 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    11.420 @ 121.980 · 1G DSM
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  11. ApexVIII

    ApexVIII Proven Member

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    Modesto, California
    yea i dont think your really hittin 55.9 Lb/min

    i have a HX35 7 blade, and @28psi with meth in getting 50 lb/min and im in SD so i know its correct.

    your probably close to 50 lb/min im gettin 1.9 70-90 times @28psi and 18/19* up top
     
  12. dsm-onster

    dsm-onster DSM Wiseman

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    Bloxom, Virginia
    SD is the act of guessing what the air flow is :) MAF meters actual airflow.

    I don't know. His maf is calibrated. His boostest lines up. No boost leaks. A/F ratio seams not wildly off if he's using gas. This looks like a lagit airflow reading. . . What are all your modifications?

    But your Hertz count is very bouncy. I've seen that before. I'd look at the graph and picture it smoothed (average curve between the counts). Doing that, it looks more like you're really flowing around 53lb/min. Still phenominal for a bolton housing and the t31 size hx35 turbine wheel.
     

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    1990 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    manual · 1G DSM
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  13. dsmtalontsi95

    dsmtalontsi95 Proven Member

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    glenvile, Pennsylvania

    I started a new thread about this in the tunning section. If some one wants to lend some advise I would appriciate it.
     
  14. ApexVIII

    ApexVIII Proven Member

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    Modesto, California
    Hrm, but SD uses the Ideal Gas Law so it should be more accurate then a MAF, because it is not effected when the air temp changes.
     
  15. dsm-onster

    dsm-onster DSM Wiseman

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    Bloxom, Virginia
    It is affected by air temp changes. SD requires an IAT like a maf car. The maf on our cars uses the ideal gas law too. PV/T = nR. Preturbo maf: baro, volume flow (hz), IAT. SD, which is post turbo: map, volume flow (VE X RPM), IAT. Both need the P, V, and T to get the nR (moles or mass).

    Actually metering the volume flow is better for the sake of measurement than takeing a calulated guess with yur assumptions (accurate assumptions) of VE. SD requires you to find ve by secondary means, not actual measurement itself. maf cars directly measure the volume flow. So no assumptions. Either works once you have control over the fuel perameter, so it doesn't really matter. But when you really want to know what the airflow actually is, it's better to use an instrument that actually measures it directly. But then you get an intake restriction. And can't get as far on the compressor map where most want to measure the airflow.

    Like above, he wants to know if we can get to the end of the map with the bolton housing. It would be easier to do it with an SD system that guess airflow, but then is the VE curve that would be 'educatedly assumed' accurate? It could mean the difference of 2-3lb/min. That's 40ish whp at this level.
     

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    1990 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    manual · 1G DSM
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  16. viperlp01

    viperlp01 Proven Member

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    Im going to the track tomorrow armed with 110 and a holset... We will see how many v8s I kill
     

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    1997 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    9.737 @ 140.310 · 2G DSM
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  17. Gamble97

    Gamble97 Freelancer

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    small town, Illinois
    I'm thinking about switching to a hx40. But I don't know how many blades I should look for. I am flowing right now 51lb/min
    And the fp manifold is awesome, no matter what the configuration. There is a 9sec talon around here running a t4 35r turbo with an fp manifold.
     
  18. thecman02

    thecman02 Proven Member

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    Joined Feb 18, 2005
    Kalamazoo, Michigan
    Does he just have a flange adapter? I'm confused on t4 with dsm flanged manifold?

    Anyways I guess I should check your mods list, but the "best" hx40's are the 6,7 blade 60mm compressors. They will net you 69lb/min with a t3 manifold and turbine housing. The Bolton housing will net you ~60ish lb/min so you won't be able to see max flow out of the compressor. The 8 blade 58mm is good for 60lb/min which is a pretty good match for the bolt on housing. Since your already flowing 51lb/min you'd probably want to get a worthwhile upgrade so I'd look for the 6 or 7 blade. Make sure it is 60mm though because they make a 7 blade 56mm compressor that falls well short of 69lb/min.
     
  19. nytescion

    nytescion Proven Member

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    Joined Jun 25, 2007
    Woodbridge, Virginia
    Well Im' rejoining the ranks just picked up my hx40w. 6-blade billet wheel with a stainless steel exhaust housing. I haven't gotten a chance to measure the wheel but here are a few pictures. 1030091356.jpg 1030091357.jpg 1030091357a.jpg

    One question i did have. should i keep that beveled piece in the inlet of the turbo or take it out?
     

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    1990 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    manual · 1G DSM
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  20. viperlp01

    viperlp01 Proven Member

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    Kalamazoo, Michigan
    I can't see the pics but it is the silencer ring and yes take it out.. Unless you like quiet turbos..
     

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    1997 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    9.737 @ 140.310 · 2G DSM
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  21. nytescion

    nytescion Proven Member

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    Joined Jun 25, 2007
    Woodbridge, Virginia
    I have one other question (sorry). On this hx40 the oil feed is not threaded. instead there are threaded holes on each side of the feed hole. Feed hole is .40". What fitting should i be using? Would this work?
     

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    1990 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    manual · 1G DSM
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  22. kp116

    kp116 Proven Member

    491
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    Joined Mar 25, 2009
    Janesville, Wisconsin
    I am flowing 66-67lbs/min with a 6-blade hx40 with the bolt-on housing with a stock intake on 39psi..
     
  23. gbradley

    gbradley Proven Member

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    Terry, Mississippi
  24. Weapon-X

    Weapon-X Proven Member

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  25. TsiBoosted4g63

    TsiBoosted4g63 Proven Member

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    Cherry Hill, New Jersey
    i am looking to upgrade to a holeset where is a good place to find them for a good price?
     
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