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Holset Turbos, PART 3

Posted by Morphius, Nov 14, 2007

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  1. Slippi84

    Slippi84 Proven Member

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    Gotcha:thumb:
     

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    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    manual · 2G DSM
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  2. JWoodley

    JWoodley Proven Member

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    So the general consensus is that a 38mm external WG will adequately control boost on the HX40? I don't mind saving a couple hundred bucks by not having to get a 44mm, but I don't mind it either.

    I will be running the 38mm off the 02 housing, but I'm unsure if I would run the 44mm from there or switch to a different exhaust manifold with proivisions off of the collector.
     

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    1998 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    manual · 2G DSM
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  3. dnhieu

    dnhieu Proven Member

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    on my old setup i was running 23psi just fine, and it held it all the way to redline. i am currently running a ebay 38mm wastegate also. its recirculated off the o2 housing.

    im currently running 20psi with my new setup (have not tuned it yet) and its running just fine also...
     

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    1999 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    manual · 2G DSM
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  4. dsm-onster

    dsm-onster DSM Wiseman

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    Be sure to post some results after a tune if you can.
     

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    1990 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    manual · 1G DSM
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  5. Slippi84

    Slippi84 Proven Member

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    Just got my hx40 in the mail this thing is one nice turbo. For $560 I def got a steal. it's not some beat up used one off ebay it was remaned and it looks brand new. Has verrrrrry minimal play like you woudl see on a new turbo and doesn't touch the sides and spinns so freely it's not funny. I had a dual BB turbo that when you spun it it didn't spin this long. I will post pics when I get home but running the t3 divided 18cm housing is def out the question LOL. The ocnpressor cover is good size about the same as a to4s cover but with a 3" vband outlet which I will be using a vband connector but the exhaust housing is huge and way too long. It's a vband and all but it comes out like the ebay ones that have a vband adapteron them like they weren't meant to be vband originally. Anyway should be good times with this thing :thumb::rocks:
     

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    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    manual · 2G DSM
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  6. 1gDSM4g63

    1gDSM4g63 Proven Member

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    In your case running 24 psi the 38 mm wastegate is fine. Don't waste your money on a big wastegate. It'll do you no good except boost creep.
     

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    1990 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
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  7. Slippi84

    Slippi84 Proven Member

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    WTF How is a bigger wastegate going to create boost creep. If anything I would think it would make the car spool slower and make the turbo work harder. This is assuming both have the same spring of course.
     

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    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    manual · 2G DSM
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  8. aero_sallee

    aero_sallee Proven Member

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    He just forgot to add preventing or something similar to the sentence.
     

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    13.348 @ 104.460 · 2G DSM
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  9. Slippi84

    Slippi84 Proven Member

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    Well even so that's a big thing! That's like saying all a timing belt does is keep your engine timed up no biggie. The whole purpose of a wastegate is to alow you to run a set boost level and keep it there. Saying all going bigger will do is a lot you to do that is like syaing all it will do is it's job.:confused:
     

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    manual · 2G DSM
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  10. Mr Peepers

    Mr Peepers DSM Wiseman

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    It won't have any adverse side effects besides likely being overkill at that psi. The general rule with wastegates is the larger you go the less boost you can run without creeping.
     

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    1991 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    10.082 @ 132.21 · 1G DSM
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  11. dnhieu

    dnhieu Proven Member

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    will do. i can tune the car myself but i think im going to pay someone to dyno tune it for me. i hope to put down around 450 awhp at around 30psi on a dyno that usually produces very low numbers. ill post the results then...
     

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    1999 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    manual · 2G DSM
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  12. JWoodley

    JWoodley Proven Member

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    I intend on pushing 30-36psi on this setup. I'm currently building my motor: 2.0 6 bolt Eagle/Ross combo, stock port 1G head, *BC 272s or BC280s*, JMF Race SMIM, and the supporting fuel mods are already there.

    So will a 38mm Tial do the job? I will be dumping it. The 38mm internal has held 26psi fine so I'm not sure how that will correlate with the external setup.
     

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    1998 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    manual · 2G DSM
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  13. Slippi84

    Slippi84 Proven Member

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    I wouldn't even attempt to use a 38mm for 36psi on a tubro this size. You realise at 36psi this turbo is more 650whp capable. If your going bolt on ssautochrome makes a half descent(yes I said ssauto and half descent together) 46mm o2 housing with recirc turb built into it vbad housing. This would obviously only be good for a bolt on style hosuing but still. If I didn't have a 40mm off the collector which is the best place for a wastegate I would have gotten it.
     

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    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    manual · 2G DSM
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  14. Mr Peepers

    Mr Peepers DSM Wiseman

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    A larger wastegate is needed to run a lower psi without creeping because you are bypassing more exhaust gas to maintain that lower psi.

    650whp capable yes, but you are sending most of that exhaust flow through the turbine instead of bypassing it through the wastegate at those power levels. You should be fine with the 38mm Tial.

    With that psi, there will inherently be a greater pressure differential across the turbine. A smaller wastegate will be less likely to blow open and when it actually is open it will flow more anyway because of the greater pressure difference.
     

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    1991 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    10.082 @ 132.21 · 1G DSM
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  15. 1gDSM4g63

    1gDSM4g63 Proven Member

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    ^^^
    llllllllll

    As unbelievable as it may seem at least someone agrees with me.
     

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    1990 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    manual · 1G DSM
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  16. JWoodley

    JWoodley Proven Member

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    Alright, so the 38mm is the ticket.

    But now do I just let the 38mm flapper...umm 'flap' or should I try to remove it completely?

    ORRRRRRRR

    Should I get a non wastegated turbine housing?

    Pros and cons of each?
     

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    1998 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    manual · 2G DSM
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  17. 1gDSM4g63

    1gDSM4g63 Proven Member

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    Weld the external controller so that it keeps the flapper shut or get a FP race manifold.

    [​IMG]
     

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    1990 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    manual · 1G DSM
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  18. Steve93Talon

    Steve93Talon Proven Member

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    You'll want to remove the flapper and port the hell outta the wastegate passage, and make sure to work alot on the entry to create a smoother transition to the gated area. Pics:

    http://homepage.mac.com/stevestrzempek/.Pictures/Tort Stuff/IMG_2167.JPG

    http://homepage.mac.com/stevestrzempek/.Pictures/Tort Stuff/IMG_2168.JPG
     

    Drag Race Build 920  24

    1991 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    369.5 whp · 403.2 lb/ft · 1G DSM

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    1993 Eagle Talon TSi
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  19. SpeedAddict62

    SpeedAddict62 Proven Member

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    I would say to remove it completely. The less things in the way the better. I don't see how you could run a wastegate off the 02 housing with a non wastegated turbine housing...unless you are talking about running a wastegate off the collector.

    1gDSM4g63, he doesn't want to block off the flapper hole, he wants to keep it open to use a 02 housing mounted wastegate. And a FP Race mani would do nothing - it doesn't even have any provisions for a wastegate off the collector.
     
  20. JWoodley

    JWoodley Proven Member

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    I currently have an FP Race Mani. Thats why I'm going with an 02 mounted wastegate.
     

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    1998 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    manual · 2G DSM
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  21. Slippi84

    Slippi84 Proven Member

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    Your right about the blowing open but that's why I said with said with the same spring even though I should have been more specific and said spring tension because the tension needed to keep a 40mm closed at 30psi will be slightly more than a 38mm closed because of more surface area. Even with that said though you won't divert enough exhaust flow away from the turbine at high rpms with a 38mm at 36psi. Hell most people at the 650-700whp area run 2 wastegates.
     

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    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    manual · 2G DSM
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  22. Slippi84

    Slippi84 Proven Member

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    My weapon of choice just arrived today :rocks:

    7 Blade HX40w
    ajtd3c.jpg

    whjplx.jpg

    18cm housing ishuge and heavy it was def made for a truck it would probably snap my little manifold in half quick LOL
     

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    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    manual · 2G DSM
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  23. 1gDSM4g63

    1gDSM4g63 Proven Member

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    I have seen people run turbos at 34 psi with a 38mm which ran fine. And in order to run 2 wastegate you need to have a twin scroll turbo housing and manifold for less lag.
     

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    1990 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    manual · 1G DSM
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  24. Slippi84

    Slippi84 Proven Member

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    Every setup is different and there will always be people that beat the norm but a 38mm isn't ideal for 36psi on a hx40 is all I"m saying if you can I would get either a 40 or that 46mm setup that I talked about a couple post ago. A 38mm off the manifold like say a collector maybe we're talking about off the o2 housing. ut it like this is a 38mm was fine then fp wouldn't be using a 40 or 46 whatever size it is that gets attached right to the exhaust housing on some of the most popular and successful dsm turbos around the fp30 series.
     

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    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    manual · 2G DSM
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  25. dsm-onster

    dsm-onster DSM Wiseman

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    A non-wastegated BEP housing still has the hole. When you get the wastegated version, you're paying for the flapper, arm, hole drilled for the arm, and welding time. The 38mm wastegate hole is always there.
     

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    manual · 1G DSM
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