Holset Turbos, PART 8

[nightracer91]

Wow! Now those are numbers I wanted to hear!

Is that with a divided manifold?

 

[talonDSMerr]

Mr. Peepers on here is one of the few that have actually done a complete divided manifold with twinscroll housing. He has a video on youtube or posted in this thread somewhere where he tests the spool and street manners. You may need to run two external wastegates, one for each divided side of the manifold. The BEP housing with FP mani is actually what I run right now, but I'm saving up for a divided manifold for my next setup.

If you need proof of whether twinscroll with divided manifold works or not, just look at the Theta II 2.0T in the new Hyundai Sonata. 274hp and 268lb-ft of torque from 1800-4500rpm. Its got a lot of new technology helping it, but the twinscroll turbo is a BIG contributor to that.

 

[Calan]

Hey man your set up looks really nice! How accurate do you think the HP estimation is in DSMlink? I just been wondering how much luck people have had with that hp estimation log vs real dyno results

Thanks...

I personally feel it's probably pretty close based on airflow, 70-90 times, etc. BUT... I don't get too wrapped up in it. I use it to compare setups or between changes on my car, everything else being equal. So in that sense, it's a good indicator of whether or not I'm moving in the right direction. FWIW, I've also heard people that have compared it to dyno numbers say it's usually pretty close...maybe they will jump in here.

As for the HX40, I got the leak fixed at the drain (I think), but I'm having fuel issues. It looks like the Wally 255 just isn't keeping up once I go past 28 psi of boost. No matter what I do with target AFR's, fuel sliders, MAFComp, etc.... it starts going lean. IDC's are still ok and AFPR is changing 1-to-1, so it looks like the fuel pump. I'm going to do some testing on it tomorrow, and will probably swap it out with a spare to see what happens. (I think I saw something once upon a time over on NABR or somewhere about modifying the relief valve in the wally's...anyone know what I'm talking about?)

I've been able to get just enough out of it at this point to know I WANT MORE...and it's gonna be fun.

 

[nightracer91]

Mr. Peepers on here is one of the few that have actually done a complete divided manifold with twinscroll housing. He has a video on youtube or posted in this thread somewhere where he tests the spool and street manners. You may need to run two external wastegates, one for each divided side of the manifold. The BEP housing with FP mani is actually what I run right now, but I'm saving up for a divided manifold for my next setup.
QUOTE]

What kind of numbers is your car making

 

[LiquidX]

Along with Craig, I got my HX40 installed yesterday. It literally took all day to do with a lot of issues I was running into. My biggest issue was the oil drain. To start, I ended up tapping and plugging 3 water ports. 2 for the FIAV and one on the water pipe since I have a 2g head on a 6 bolt I need the 2g water pipe. It was a close...

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

I have 2 45* swivel push lock fittings and they both needed to be ground down to have a somewhat proper fit from the CHRA to pan.

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

Original looked like this

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

Basically took a rib out of each and shortened hose.

My other issue was getting the lower IC pipe on AND have it stay on the compressor cover. Turns out the LICP from the VRSF FMIC kit (version 1) has a 2" start then flares out to 2.5. I needed to get another piece of silicone to put over the 2" and then tighten down the 2.5" coupler over top of that.

I have a major wastegate issue and I'll see what happens down the road. It's the Punishment Racing MVS recirculated o2 housing and I have the Mishimoto radiator and fan shroud.

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

Yes, the wastegate is inside the fan shroud. No it does not touch the blades. I might be needing to get rid of that fan, weld up the hole and run a single fan. I don't want to but if this starts melting then I'll need to.

After many hours and 2 lunches from a local Chinese place I got it all together. Threw on my new valve cover with SS bolts and my Mishimoto black coolant hoses came in as well. I ordered the wrong silicone elbow at the TB so I couldn't replace that with a black hose yet.

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

(Mike's hand 90TSI717)


I had a E316g on before


I used the 0.75" eBay restrictor and the ExtremePSI oil feed kit. I currently have not coolant or oil leaks. I did however blow off a coolant hose last night after a quick drive while I was idling. I think I forgot to tighten down a clamp. Also my wideband is going haywire now and I believe I either need to do another free air calibration or something got on the sensor. (Car was started without sensor plugged in so I don't know if that did something to the controller?)

This turbo is LOUD!

Edit:
Yes I know I don't have a cam gear cover. The shop never put the 2 plates on that attach to the block that allow the cover to be screwed onto the lower cover. The cam gears need to come off for that but I'll try and get something today.

Edit #2:
I found out that my oil pan is leaking as well as something else. Not quite sure yet but I'm calling the garage that built the motor and telling them to fix it.

I went out for a pull and blew off the coupler that attaches the LICP to the compressor cover. It actually blew off the compressor and not the double silicone connection. I'm going to have the shop weld on a new pipe end to make it all 2.5" and do something with the compressor cover so I don't have more issues. So far no melted fans and I got a cam gear cover on as well.

I'm believe I'll need to redo the oil drain and use 2 straight fittings but I'm honestly going to leave that to the shop since they will be working down there and they can deal with it .

I have taken note that my lower rad hose touches my intake pipe. I'm not sure if that's going to cause a larger increase of IAT or not seeing as the compressor cover gets a lot hotter. I might wrap the lower section of the intake pipe with some thermal wrap to keep the heat off of it.

Still getting used to the increased lag and currently driving with the turbo disconnected from the LICP until that pipe gets fixed. Speed density FTW...damn slow car

 

[-red97rum-]

Thanks...
(I think I saw something once upon a time over on NABR or somewhere about modifying the relief valve in the wally's...anyone know what I'm talking about?)

I've been able to get just enough out of it at this point to know I WANT MORE...and it's gonna be fun.

Here you go, saw this the other day on the ds-map board, hope it helps:

The pump flow charts for walbro pumps are made with the stock pressure bleed off port. It's made to open around 75psi, which is why you see flow drop off above that pressure. It's easy to tighten the spring so it holds pressure a little better at high boost (30+ psi) All you have to do is use a thin screwdriver to push down on the 3rd silver hole in the top of the pump. The first hole is right next to the positive terminal, the second hole is next to the negative terminal, and the 3rd hole is off by itself. Just push it down a little, 2 or 3mm. That's it!

 

[Calan]

Thanks Dustin...that's what I was referring to.

 

[nightracer91]

So many manifold discussions and they all are legit. I'm just so torn of what housing I want to run.

 

[GORBS88]

"liquidx"

I have been told from a few decent sources that powering up the WB controller with no sensor attached WILL indeed wreck it. That's NOT from MY experience but from what has happend to a few buddys of mine..

BTW set-up looks great!!

 

[nfernotalon]

So my hx35 is no good and was looking around for another holset and saw the hx50. Does anyone have any idea what spool time is on the 2.0? I would eventually go stroker but not til next year.

 

[jrohner]

So my hx35 is no good and was looking around for another holset and saw the hx50. Does anyone have any idea what spool time is on the 2.0? I would eventually go stroker but not til next year.

What size exhaust housing?

 

[Gooberlog]

So many manifold discussions and they all are legit. I'm just so torn of what housing I want to run.

For your goals of 450hp and 500 hp on race gas, i think you can reach those with the BEP .55 A/R housing. For fitment it seems people have best luck with the FP manifold. People have hit just over 500 whp with the bolt on BEP .55 housing.

 

[LiquidX]

"liquidx"

I have been told from a few decent sources that powering up the WB controller with no sensor attached WILL indeed wreck it. That's NOT from MY experience but from what has happend to a few buddys of mine..

BTW set-up looks great!!

Thanks for the comment on the setup.

The LC-1 controller just needed to be reset. If you run the car without the sensor plugged in for more than 20 seconds the calibration is reset at the controller. No damage will be incurred. What you may be thinking is not having the sensor plugged in and running the car as the sensor needs to have the heater on to function properly.

 

[nightracer91]

For your goals of 450hp and 500 hp on race gas, i think you can reach those with the BEP .55 A/R housing. For fitment it seems people have best luck with the FP manifold. People have hit just over 500 whp with the bolt on BEP .55 housing.

Alot of the local guys are saying to run the twin scroll with a true divided housing...

 

[Gooberlog]

Alot of the local guys are saying to run the twin scroll with a true divided housing...

Not a bad idea, but for you goals, you could get there with the .55 bolt on housing.

 

[nightracer91]

The BEP set-up seems a little more cost effective also.

 

[jrohner]

The BEP set-up seems a little more cost effective also.

Only because divided t3 manifolds are so stupidly expensive. If there were some reasonable priced ones, the stock turbine housing would be the perfect setup.

 

[nightracer91]

Only because divided t3 manifolds are so stupidly expensive. If there were some reasonable priced ones, the stock turbine housing would be the perfect setup.

So your a fan of the stock housing? Because I was talking with my buddy today about my set-up and he said we could use his tig welder and make a manifold to utilize my stock housing for only the cost of parts! So I think I may do this, which leads to the single or dual wastegate debate.

 

[doesitonall4rs]

Hey guys I just have a quick question. I posted pictures of a holset powered s2000 that my friend and I just put together.

Anyways long story short we put together the exhaust system for it last night, we had it started up for about 15mins for it to warm up. I looked in the engine bay and noticed while the car was idling the turbo had stopped spinning....I told him to turn off the car so I could see if the turbo is messed up. I checked the turbo and nothing was wrong at all. So he started it back up and the turbo was spinning then after idling for a minute or two the turbo stopped spinning again. He reved the car up and it started to spin fine. It appears to be boosting just fine, anyways I did a quick google search and brought up these few threads, but nothing on DMStuners.

Turbo stops spinning at idle? - Supraforums.com

http://forums.bimmerforums.com/forum/showthread.php?t=580763

http://forums.g2ic.com/showthread.php?116241-Turbo-stops-spinning-at-idle
Has anybody else had this happen on a DSM? Is it bad for oil to be going through the bearings while they are no spinning? I would think that it would mess up the seals but I am not 100% sure.

Let me know what you guys think! Thanks for any help!

 

[Gstclipse69]

So your a fan of the stock housing? Because I was talking with my buddy today about my set-up and he said we could use his tig welder and make a manifold to utilize my stock housing for only the cost of parts! So I think I may do this, which leads to the single or dual wastegate debate.

Yea if twin scroll manifolds were more readily available then that would definitely be the way to go with the stock holset 12cm housing. You can run an open t3 manifold with it and radius the divider some but the spool up will suffer. The open manifold has still put down some nice numbers too however. If you have access to make a twin scroll manifold then go for it, but for it to be a true twin scroll then it does need two wastegates.

 

[jrohner]

So your a fan of the stock housing? Because I was talking with my buddy today about my set-up and he said we could use his tig welder and make a manifold to utilize my stock housing for only the cost of parts! So I think I may do this, which leads to the single or dual wastegate debate.

with an open manifold it sucks ass, but with a twin scroll setup it should be amazing.

 

[kp116]

So your a fan of the stock housing? Because I was talking with my buddy today about my set-up and he said we could use his tig welder and make a manifold to utilize my stock housing for only the cost of parts! So I think I may do this, which leads to the single or dual wastegate debate.

If you have a source that is willing to make you a twin scroll manifold I would go that route. You can still use just a single wastegate, just make sure its completely divided all the way up to the wastegate flange.

 

[nightracer91]

If you have a source that is willing to make you a twin scroll manifold I would go that route. You can still use just a single wastegate, just make sure its completely divided all the way up to the wastegate flange.

Would running, for instance, a 44mm wastgate off of the 2-3 collector only cause the flow into the turbine to suffer since at full boost that side would theoretically see a rising and dropping in pressure as the wastegate fluctuates?

 

[Mr Peepers]

The wastegate will find a happy medium pretty quick and gradually move to maintain a certain psi. It's not an open/close/open/close thing.

The problem would be those two cylinders having much less backpressure and likely running leaner than the rest because of it. It may work but I really don't like the thought. The factory holset turbine housing is set up like this but they only really get away with it because it's a diesel and isn't nearly as picky about "afr." Same debate goes for running it off #1 cylinder on an open manifold, but it at least isn't blocked off almost completely like a twin scroll.

One wastegate, divide it to the base of the wastegate valve or the best you can. Otherwise use two wastegates.

 

[thilaksharma]

so unfortunate, i finally found a hx40 billet on the classifieds, got the seller to give me the specs, he sent to me saying its a 60mm/84mm billet wheel brand new, got it for 600 bucks, i finally got it on my hands, its actually a 56mm wheel , hmm , what a huge disappointment

im gonna fit in a twin .82 garrett T3 turbine housing with divided manifold , will wait for the outcome, home to atleast hit 500whp on it