1. Join the Community!

    DSMtuners is a massive archive of DSM information - but more importantly, it's a COMMUNITY! Join in and participate with other DSMers, and invite all of your DSM friends to make this place their home. Chat with others, create a build thread, post questions and answers. Get involved! Logging in will also remove many of the advertisements, along with this notice. ;)

ECMlink How much did NLTF shave off your 1/4 mile?

Posted by tk106, Jul 15, 2019

Please Support Feal Suspension
Please Support ExtremePSI
  1. tk106

    tk106 Supporting Member

    1,341
    257
    Joined Sep 11, 2017
    Cincinnati, Ohio
    I'm in love with the NLTS feature especially from 1st to 2nd. Haven't been to the track yet and don't plan to until it gets a little cooler. It's been in the 90's here in Southwest Ohio.

    How much time did nlts shave off your 1/4 mile time?
     

    88  3

    2000 Jeep Cherokee Sport - Classic
    awd · automatic · Misc Vehicles

    116  4

    93 Civic 4 Door -sold-
    fwd · manual · Misc Vehicles

    Street Build 2K  6

    1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    12.625 @ 111.42 · 1G DSM
    Loading...
  2. ist dwa

    ist dwa Proven Member

    243
    81
    Joined Nov 5, 2009
    Centerville, Ohio
    Better question is how much life do you shave off of your tranny using Nlts?
     
  3. tk106

    tk106 Supporting Member

    1,341
    257
    Joined Sep 11, 2017
    Cincinnati, Ohio
    That a question for transmission specialists. IDK. I’ve read the threads and that’s a hot topic for debate. All I can say is it’s shift perfectly fine and smooth “right now”. I still slip it a little for the 1-2 shift and slam the 2-3 and 3-4.
     

    88  3

    2000 Jeep Cherokee Sport - Classic
    awd · automatic · Misc Vehicles

    116  4

    93 Civic 4 Door -sold-
    fwd · manual · Misc Vehicles

    Street Build 2K  6

    1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    12.625 @ 111.42 · 1G DSM
    Loading...
  4. tk106

    tk106 Supporting Member

    1,341
    257
    Joined Sep 11, 2017
    Cincinnati, Ohio
    Better better question is did you finish the 5.6% to get your damn car running?
     

    88  3

    2000 Jeep Cherokee Sport - Classic
    awd · automatic · Misc Vehicles

    116  4

    93 Civic 4 Door -sold-
    fwd · manual · Misc Vehicles

    Street Build 2K  6

    1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    12.625 @ 111.42 · 1G DSM
    Loading...
  5. Tyeler18

    Tyeler18 Proven Member

    2,064
    76
    Joined Dec 16, 2008
    Casa Grande, Arizona
    I dropped .3 off my time in my evo with the only change being NLTS. I also botched 2 gear changes that run which would've easily dropped more time off. I've never had a clean run in the car, but all things basically equal aside from NLTS activation was a .3 second drop. The trans has been NLTS for the past 15k miles and still shifts butter smooth, I've yet to kill a trans in any dsm FROM NLTS, but i did bend a shift fork on a 2-3 power shift when NLTS didnt activate.
     

    Drag Race Build 558  1

    1991 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · automatic · 1G DSM

    Road Race Build 642  0

    1990 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    manual · 1G DSM

    Autocross Build 808  0

    1998 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    manual · 2G DSM

    Road Race Build 1K  0

    1991 Mitsubishi Galant VR-4
    manual · Galant VR-4
    Loading...
  6. tk106

    tk106 Supporting Member

    1,341
    257
    Joined Sep 11, 2017
    Cincinnati, Ohio
    That’s good to hear. I’ve read .4 on one thread so that’s not too far off. I’m sure someone has trashed a trans using the nlts feature. Whether it was driver error or it was actually damaged from the feature, who really knows??? Only guys that work on transmissions would be able to tell where and why it broke. All I can say is that it feels smooth to me and I don’t feel like I’m abusing the car. I’ll inspect the fluids in 15000 miles.
     

    88  3

    2000 Jeep Cherokee Sport - Classic
    awd · automatic · Misc Vehicles

    116  4

    93 Civic 4 Door -sold-
    fwd · manual · Misc Vehicles

    Street Build 2K  6

    1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    12.625 @ 111.42 · 1G DSM
    Loading...
  7. gofer

    gofer Moderator

    5,480
    965
    Joined Feb 18, 2006
    South Gilbert, Arizona
    Its up for debate but I believe its better for the trans because of loading/unloading when lifting on the throttle causes. Imagine how hard the engine rotates forward/back when shifting at 7k+, especially if you have factory mounts/roll stops. The trans rolls forward with the engine when you shift and stretches the shifter cables which causes mis-shifts, grinding, or breaking shift cables. NLTS keeps the engine rotation to a minimum so theres hardly any movement so you can hit the next gear cleaner (which is why most notice how smooth it goes into gear) besides the fact you keep the car in boost between gears and run faster ETs and traps speeds.

    Between gears and running NLTS boost goes from 30psi to 20psi, w/o NLTS I see 30psi to -20inHg of vacuum between gears and boost has to build back to 30psi when I hit the next gear.
     

    Street Build 15K  11  61

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    11.634 @ 126.050 · 2G DSM

    2K  0

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse N/T
    manual · 2G DSM
    Loading...
  8. ist dwa

    ist dwa Proven Member

    243
    81
    Joined Nov 5, 2009
    Centerville, Ohio
    It basically wears the synchros much faster, missed shifts grind the gear but the most common failure is bent rails and broken forks.
     
  9. Vegas smith

    Vegas smith Proven Member

    2,585
    1,180
    Joined Dec 2, 2002
    Houston, Texas
    Ahh, this is what's frustrating about the internet. One guy says it's good for the trans, another guy says it's bad. One guy says his trans lasted 100,000 miles while NLTSing his 1500hp DSM every mile while another guy says NLTS killed his trans in one pull. Who's to know the real answer?
     

    Street Build 3K  10

    1993 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · manual · 1G DSM
    Loading...
  10. tk106

    tk106 Supporting Member

    1,341
    257
    Joined Sep 11, 2017
    Cincinnati, Ohio
    +1 Vegas. That’s why I’d like to hear from a trans expert. So if nlts isn’t good for the trans, doesn’t that mean rev matching on downshifts is also bad for the trans??? :argue: :idontknow::ohdamn:
     

    88  3

    2000 Jeep Cherokee Sport - Classic
    awd · automatic · Misc Vehicles

    116  4

    93 Civic 4 Door -sold-
    fwd · manual · Misc Vehicles

    Street Build 2K  6

    1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    12.625 @ 111.42 · 1G DSM
    Loading...
  11. tk106

    tk106 Supporting Member

    1,341
    257
    Joined Sep 11, 2017
    Cincinnati, Ohio
    I’m calling shep tomorrow and get this phenomenon resolved once and for all.
     

    88  3

    2000 Jeep Cherokee Sport - Classic
    awd · automatic · Misc Vehicles

    116  4

    93 Civic 4 Door -sold-
    fwd · manual · Misc Vehicles

    Street Build 2K  6

    1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    12.625 @ 111.42 · 1G DSM
    Loading...
    1990TSIAWDTALON likes this.
  12. tk106

    tk106 Supporting Member

    1,341
    257
    Joined Sep 11, 2017
    Cincinnati, Ohio
    ***RESOLVED***

    Sheptrans (330) 832-2366

    As long as the clutch is working, engages & disengages properly, NLTS does NOT wear the trans prematurely or cause any damage.
     

    88  3

    2000 Jeep Cherokee Sport - Classic
    awd · automatic · Misc Vehicles

    116  4

    93 Civic 4 Door -sold-
    fwd · manual · Misc Vehicles

    Street Build 2K  6

    1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    12.625 @ 111.42 · 1G DSM
    Loading...
  13. Vegas smith

    Vegas smith Proven Member

    2,585
    1,180
    Joined Dec 2, 2002
    Houston, Texas
    You're listening to that bum?
     

    Street Build 3K  10

    1993 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · manual · 1G DSM
    Loading...
  14. tk106

    tk106 Supporting Member

    1,341
    257
    Joined Sep 11, 2017
    Cincinnati, Ohio
    Why? Is there something I should know?
     

    88  3

    2000 Jeep Cherokee Sport - Classic
    awd · automatic · Misc Vehicles

    116  4

    93 Civic 4 Door -sold-
    fwd · manual · Misc Vehicles

    Street Build 2K  6

    1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    12.625 @ 111.42 · 1G DSM
    Loading...
  15. Vegas smith

    Vegas smith Proven Member

    2,585
    1,180
    Joined Dec 2, 2002
    Houston, Texas
    No, it was sarcasm.
     

    Street Build 3K  10

    1993 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · manual · 1G DSM
    Loading...
  16. tk106

    tk106 Supporting Member

    1,341
    257
    Joined Sep 11, 2017
    Cincinnati, Ohio
    :tease::aha:
     

    88  3

    2000 Jeep Cherokee Sport - Classic
    awd · automatic · Misc Vehicles

    116  4

    93 Civic 4 Door -sold-
    fwd · manual · Misc Vehicles

    Street Build 2K  6

    1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    12.625 @ 111.42 · 1G DSM
    Loading...
  17. ist dwa

    ist dwa Proven Member

    243
    81
    Joined Nov 5, 2009
    Centerville, Ohio
    Tony, why don't you go out and make 20 passes using nlts every time all the gear changes and when done report back how well the trans shifts. Why take other people's words when you can conduct the experiment yourself?

    REV MATCHING on down shifts is great because your matching the speed of the gear with the speed of the engine and then shifting. Nlts doesn't match the two, it just holds engine speed at a certain rpm and what ever the gear is spinning at you just have to cram it in there.

    I would agree with John on a fresh double synchro trans it wouldnt be hateful......but most trans are stock pos, if the synchro is even kinda questionable.... forget it.

    And every time you mis shift it grinds the gear.... crunchy gears to quickly ensure and then of course nlts wont even work.

    Nlts are for glory passes and record et stuff, buy a dogbox if you wanna nlts, if you run a synchro trans just lift.
     
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2019
  18. tk106

    tk106 Supporting Member

    1,341
    257
    Joined Sep 11, 2017
    Cincinnati, Ohio
    I’m no expert that’s why I called them. They’ve been doing this for a long time as you know. Plus the trans I have is their stage 3. Again, I’ve read multiple threads and it seems to be 50/50 on whether or not it bad for the trans. This is one of those topics where people will have their own opinion and that’s fine. I don’t have experience with it so all I can do is try it. And if it breaks, it breaks. Oh well. I’ll look for a trans
     

    88  3

    2000 Jeep Cherokee Sport - Classic
    awd · automatic · Misc Vehicles

    116  4

    93 Civic 4 Door -sold-
    fwd · manual · Misc Vehicles

    Street Build 2K  6

    1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    12.625 @ 111.42 · 1G DSM
    Loading...
  19. bastarddsm

    bastarddsm Supporting Vendor

    4,399
    981
    Joined Aug 26, 2003
    Mendota, Illinois
    I beat the piss out of my trans using nlts at 9500+, and I still have the same synchros I bought in 2009. I also have a clutch that releases, an I know how to drive.

    I get ~300ms 1-2 shifts with an act 2900 and a street disc. That's measured off the upper clutch switch, from the rpm trace, it's more like 175. On my tilton carbon it's about 75ms quicker.

    The DSM trans shifts great and does hold up great. Its lame owners doing sh** work, and junk clutches that cause the problem.

    Nlts is hard on it, if your jamming gears, but it might not be any harder in it than lifting. I have more problems trying to lift shift quickly. The biggest thing is make sure your close to rev matched with 4 gear. 4 will not take any shock loading.....
     

    Showcar Build 5K  1

    1991 Eagle Talon N/T
    9.805 @ 144.00 · 1G DSM
    Loading...
  20. jstoned1

    jstoned1 Probationary Member

    25
    1
    Joined Aug 14, 2010
    oak hills, California
    Shaved around .3 off my 1/4
     

    Street Build 677  5

    1991 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    12.5 @ 115 · 1G DSM
    Loading...
  21. Steve93Talon

    Steve93Talon Proven Member

    1,445
    91
    Joined Jan 20, 2005
    Philly Burbs, Pennsylvania
    Synchros? What is this, the dark ages? I had my trans faceplated by Liberty and I'm never going back! :p
     

    Drag Race Build 768  24

    1991 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    369.5 whp · 403.2 lb/ft · 1G DSM

    2K  7

    1993 Eagle Talon TSi
    11.784 @ 115.120 · 1G DSM
    Loading...
  22. tk106

    tk106 Supporting Member

    1,341
    257
    Joined Sep 11, 2017
    Cincinnati, Ohio
    Out of curiosity what did that cost you?
     

    88  3

    2000 Jeep Cherokee Sport - Classic
    awd · automatic · Misc Vehicles

    116  4

    93 Civic 4 Door -sold-
    fwd · manual · Misc Vehicles

    Street Build 2K  6

    1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    12.625 @ 111.42 · 1G DSM
    Loading...
  23. Steve93Talon

    Steve93Talon Proven Member

    1,445
    91
    Joined Jan 20, 2005
    Philly Burbs, Pennsylvania
    Just under $1300 shipped for the gear work, then whatever you'd spend on a trans refresh, diff, forks, bearings, seals... (minus new synchros obviously)
    14699630_1338107166229845_1063132382_o.jpg
     

    Drag Race Build 768  24

    1991 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    369.5 whp · 403.2 lb/ft · 1G DSM

    2K  7

    1993 Eagle Talon TSi
    11.784 @ 115.120 · 1G DSM
    Loading...
  24. tk106

    tk106 Supporting Member

    1,341
    257
    Joined Sep 11, 2017
    Cincinnati, Ohio
    That’s beeeeefy! Hope I won’t need it. Time will tell and I’ll start fattening my piggy bank for face plated gears.
     

    88  3

    2000 Jeep Cherokee Sport - Classic
    awd · automatic · Misc Vehicles

    116  4

    93 Civic 4 Door -sold-
    fwd · manual · Misc Vehicles

    Street Build 2K  6

    1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    12.625 @ 111.42 · 1G DSM
    Loading...
  25. bastarddsm

    bastarddsm Supporting Vendor

    4,399
    981
    Joined Aug 26, 2003
    Mendota, Illinois
    If your clutch works, faceplated isn't any faster, and it just lets you break stuff easier. Don't jam 4th.
     

    Showcar Build 5K  1

    1991 Eagle Talon N/T
    9.805 @ 144.00 · 1G DSM
    Loading...

Share This Page

Support Vendors who Support the DSM Community
Archer Fabrication ECM Tuning ExtremePSI Feal Suspension Fuel Injector Clinic Jacks Transmissions JNZ Tuning Kiggly Racing Morrison Fabrications OHM Racing RockAuto SouthBay Fuel Injectors STM Tuned Track Decals Track Sculptures VR Speed Factory WheelWell.com White Shed Speed