Holset HX-35 Oiling

[Black_Bullet]

I dont run an oil cooler either. Just remember that your coolant will warm up faster then your oil. Just because your coolant is up to temp doesnt mean that your oil is. Ill be switching to 0w40 this season. At a certain temp, there really isnt much difference in thickness of the different weights though. I dont have an oil temp gauge in my car, but thinner oil will cool easier. The only way to know for sure that your oil isnt getting too degraded is by having it tested. I havent tested any of mine in a while because i dont drive my car much anymore, so i usually just change my oil every few months or so which might only be 1000-2000 miles.

Yea but how does the thinner oil fair without a oil cooler on extended high way drives, or say a autocross were your up at rpm for a minute or a road race etc.

 

[GST95]

Yea but how does the thinner oil fair without a oil cooler on extended high way drives, or say a autocross were your up at rpm for a minute or a road race etc.

You should read my previous posts. The second number is the weight of the oil. 0w40 is a 40 weight oil so it is thicker then what our oiling system is designed for stock. Since not running a cooler is going to most likely cause higher then stock oil temps, the 40 weight oil being above 200* will thin out and flow around the same as 30 weight oil at stock temp. The first number isnt the weight of the oil. It represents how well it flows when the oil is cold. Lower the number, the closer it is to its operating temp (200*) flow when its cold. 0w40 and 15w40 are going to flow about the same at 200*, but at 0* the 15w40 is like molasses compared to 0w40. Ever hear anybody say that most of an engines wear occurs at startup? Part of the problem is the oil is too cold to flow enough volume to lubricate properly.

For road racing and maybe even some auto-x tracks id add a cooler, but for high way drives there isnt much need for a cooler, IMHO. Your oil will still be cooled by the engine coolant, but not directly. If you run mineral oil, then that is a different scenario and id run a cooler regardless of the situation.

 

[talonDSMerr]

0w40 and 15w40 are going to flow about the same at 200*, but at 0* the 15w40 is like molasses compared to 0w40.

In that case, what is the advantage of running 15w40 over 0w40, if there is one? I hear guys running 10w30, 10w40, 15w40, but why don't they just run 0wXX?

 

[dsm-onster]

Cold weather starting. As already mentioned, that first number is basically how much modifiers are in the oil to keep the viscosity down in cold weather. The lower the number the closer the viscosity at a cold start is to the viscosity at warm running. But remember, the more modifiers are in the oil, the sooner the oil will break down. The beauty of synthetic is that you can run more modifiers and the oil will break down less than dino oil. 0w-30 synthetic will break down at a similar rate as 10w-30 dino oil assuming the same use conditions.

 

[Black_Bullet]

So to recap on this real quick, am I better off with 0w40 or 10w40 (full synthetic)?... I still want to stay 40 weight if anything Idk if they have 0w50 or 10w50? . I just always feel I need thicker oil on these motors that are making power, and spun at high rpms a lot, especially since I dont have the oil cooler and I live in FL it gets hot. Unless you change your oil a lot, you have to keep in mind on a turbo charged car, especially one running a lot of boost, when raced, the oil can break down real easy and that 40 weight you started could now be less than 30 wt after 1500miles, and possible even less when its broken down AND hot? But with your info I guess that with running 15w50, I have been hurting the motor at cold startup ( even though I always let it reach operating temp before getting on it) ... Does the thicker oil moving to slow apply true for slowly damaging the turbo on cold starts?

 

[Morphius]

I wouldn't take Dr. Hass's posts as bible. Remember he's a surgeon. And just because he has a ferrari, a lambo and took a class that covered blood viscosity doesn't make him the end all of knowledge on the topic.

 

[GST95]

So to recap on this real quick, am I better off with 0w40 or 10w40 (full synthetic)?... I still want to stay 40 weight if anything Idk if they have 0w50 or 10w50? . I just always feel I need thicker oil on these motors that are making power, and spun at high rpms a lot, especially since I dont have the oil cooler and I live in FL it gets hot. Unless you change your oil a lot, you have to keep in mind on a turbo charged car, especially one running a lot of boost, when raced, the oil can break down real easy and that 40 weight you started could now be less than 30 wt after 1500miles, and possible even less when its broken down AND hot? But with your info I guess that with running 15w50, I have been hurting the motor at cold startup ( even though I always let it reach operating temp before getting on it) ... Does the thicker oil moving to slow apply true for slowly damaging the turbo on cold starts?

I know that Eneos makes a 0w50. Im not sure if any other brands have that weight or not though. You might need to be running 250*-275* or somewhere close to that to really need that thick of an oil though, IMHO.

I wouldn't take Dr. Hass's posts as bible. Remember he's a surgeon. And just because he has a ferrari, a lambo and took a class that covered blood viscosity doesn't make him the end all of knowledge on the topic.

He does work on his own cars though. Hes not just a surgeon that drives high dollar cars. A lot of what ive read that he has written is from info that is recommended by Ferrari. Engine manufactures are also starting to recommend thinner oils then they use to as well as synthetics in some cases. Its not just 1 class of blood viscosity that he is drawing his knowledge base from. Im not saying that what he says is the bible, but what he says is backed up by fluid dynamics. It doesnt matter if its oil, blood, or honey. The same principles of flow apply.

Ive seen similar information elsewhere that say close to the same things he does. Heres another article that is worded to be easy to follow.Motor Oil Viscosity Grades Explained in Layman's Terms

 

[majik2k5]

Here's my situation. I'm running my HX35 off of the oil filter housing with the existing stainless steel lines that were on the car. They're -4AN with an Earls in-line oil filter in the middle and a SBR -4AN restrictor in the inlet of the turbo. I also have no balance shafts. Yet, my gauge reads extremely low oil pressure, even when cruising around it seems as though my autometer gauge barely wants to climb off of that 0 mark. Anyone have any suggestions for me before I go tearing into it?

 

[donniekak]

You should read my previous posts. The second number is the weight of the oil. 0w40 is a 40 weight oil so it is thicker then what our oiling system is designed for stock. Since not running a cooler is going to most likely cause higher then stock oil temps, the 40 weight oil being above 200* will thin out and flow around the same as 30 weight oil at stock temp. The first number isnt the weight of the oil. It represents how well it flows when the oil is cold. Lower the number, the closer it is to its operating temp (200*) flow when its cold. 0w40 and 15w40 are going to flow about the same at 200*, but at 0* the 15w40 is like molasses compared to 0w40. Ever hear anybody say that most of an engines wear occurs at startup? Part of the problem is the oil is too cold to flow enough volume to lubricate properly.

For road racing and maybe even some auto-x tracks id add a cooler, but for high way drives there isnt much need for a cooler, IMHO. Your oil will still be cooled by the engine coolant, but not directly. If you run mineral oil, then that is a different scenario and id run a cooler regardless of the situation.

Actually the first number is the weight of the base stock. The second number is what weight the oil behaves at in a warmed up engine. This is achieved by adding viscosity modifiers to the base stock. Bobistheoilguy is a great place to learn about oils.

 

[talonDSMerr]

Here's my situation. I'm running my HX35 off of the oil filter housing with the existing stainless steel lines that were on the car. They're -4AN with an Earls in-line oil filter in the middle and a SBR -4AN restrictor in the inlet of the turbo. I also have no balance shafts. Yet, my gauge reads extremely low oil pressure, even when cruising around it seems as though my autometer gauge barely wants to climb off of that 0 mark. Anyone have any suggestions for me before I go tearing into it?

I'm guessing the pressure line to your gauge might be leaking. Might want to take a quick peak around and see if there's any oil around.

 

[GST95]

Here's my situation. I'm running my HX35 off of the oil filter housing with the existing stainless steel lines that were on the car. They're -4AN with an Earls in-line oil filter in the middle and a SBR -4AN restrictor in the inlet of the turbo. I also have no balance shafts. Yet, my gauge reads extremely low oil pressure, even when cruising around it seems as though my autometer gauge barely wants to climb off of that 0 mark. Anyone have any suggestions for me before I go tearing into it?

Is it an electronic gauge? Ive heard of many sending unit failures due to mounting it on the engine.

Actually the first number is the weight of the base stock. The second number is what weight the oil behaves at in a warmed up engine. This is achieved by adding viscosity modifiers to the base stock. Bobistheoilguy is a great place to learn about oils.

If there were only 2 ingredients in engine oil and we were only talking about mineral oil this might be fairly correct, but its not really that simple. An oils base stock is simply a starting point. It may or may not be the same viscosity as the first number of the end product. It would be like saying a cake is flour. Although its a main ingredient, there are many other ingredients that are added to turn it into a cake. Similar principles apply to the makeup of engine oil. The viscosity of an oil is measured at its end product. Cold viscosity is the first number, and operating temp viscosity is the second number. Some synthetic oils dont even require any viscosity modifiers to achieve its desired cold/hot viscosity spread.

 

[Morphius]

Oil feed for a 2003 - newer Dodge Holsets...

 

[Morphius]

Pics...

 

[aero_sallee]

That is the type of fitting used on the HE351VE on the 07.5+ 6.7 Cummins Trucks too. The fitting tha screws into the CHRA anyway, not sure if the line is the same or not.

 

[red_devil]

I know its been said but I couldnt find it. What is the thread size on a holset oil feed?

Another question is that I see over 100psi at cold start up with the sender unit at the stock oil pressure location. I dont know if I have bs or not as its a replacement engine. Could it be possible that I may not have bs installed or just high oil pressure? Always run 10w30, and after warmed up it doesnt go over 80psi. That being said I might be ok to run from the head correct? may just have to try to get the pressure at the head and find out.

 

[GST95]

I know its been said but I couldnt find it. What is the thread size on a holset oil feed?

Another question is that I see over 100psi at cold start up with the sender unit at the stock oil pressure location. I dont know if I have bs or not as its a replacement engine. Could it be possible that I may not have bs installed or just high oil pressure? Always run 10w30, and after warmed up it doesnt go over 80psi. That being said I might be ok to run from the head correct? may just have to try to get the pressure at the head and find out.

The inlet should be 12mmX1.5.

You might be alright feeding from the head, but it could still be too high. Id suggest trying a good synthetic 5w30 to lower your cold oil pressure. Your operating temp oil pressure should stay the same though.

 

[dsmtalontsi95]

Can someone sumerise this up as to what line you should run with each setup
balance shafts feed from the filter housing with this restricror
no balance shafts feed from the filter housing with this restrictor
balance shaft feed from the headd use this
no balance shaft feed from the head use this

It gets a little confusing, is all I'm saying and I'm lost on what to do.
I have a 6-bolt strocker with no balance shafts and don't know where to feed from with a holset hx-35.

 

[dsmtalontsi95]

Well Here is my oil set up. I've found that I get 7-10 psi at idle and 30 psi at spool up. I used the feed line from the head from extremepsi as well as there returne line. My mod set up is 2.3 with no b.s. and no ported releaf hole.

 

[dsm-onster]

Thanx for that. It seams like your idle fuel pressure is going to be a LITTLE low for a holset. But I think you'll be ok with pressure. Unless your return is too small. There's another thread on that. It's not just a holset concern but a garrett and BW concern too.

 

[red_devil]

Just like to add my results with oil supply with my HX40. Stock 7 bolt with bs and os still in and fed from the ofh. My car has high oil pressure for being stock. I see around 100psi at 7k. I used a -3AN line which I tested and got around 18-20psi at idle and 60 psi at 6k. I hope the idle pressure is ok being right on the limit. Im using a holset oil drain tube with a silicon hose connecting to the stock 2G return line. No shaft play and no signs of smoke after a week. Positive pressure at 2500k and 20psi at 4100k.

I also tested pressure at the head and only got around 5psi at idle.

 

[andy4g63]

^^^ You are going to toast it, the turbo... Make sure, that you have good 10-20PSI @ idle, when fully warm, or after 30-40min. of continious driving. I found out, that is better to feed it from OFH with some 0.060-0.070 restrictor and -4 feed line, regardless, how much pressure you have at the OFH. Once you have the restrictor, you can't shove more oil into the turbo, because of it.
Besides, the only guy that have like 20K on the turbo with high boost and DD is feeding it from OFH with restrictor.

There is a video, I think in the Holset oil return thread, made by jusmx 141 and shows how much oil comes out of the turbo with and without restrictor- it is very helpful.

 

[red_devil]

^^^ You are going to toast it, the turbo... Make sure, that you have good 10-20PSI @ idle, when fully warm, or after 30-40min. of continious driving. I found out, that is better to feed it from OFH with some 0.060-0.070 restrictor and -4 feed line, regardless, how much pressure you have at the OFH. Once you have the restrictor, you can't shove more oil into the turbo, because of it.
Besides, the only guy that have like 20K on the turbo with high boost and DD is feeding it from OFH with restrictor.

There is a video, I think in the Holset oil return thread, made by jusmx 141 and shows how much oil comes out of the turbo with and without restrictor- it is very helpful.

How am I going to toast it? I get 18psi at idle at full operating temp and 60 max, that is within Holset range. The -3 acts like a restrictor since the inside di is around .078.

 

[andy4g63]

Just to add I tested pressure at the headed and only got around 5psi at idle.

Like you stated above ^^^. That is not enough, if correct.

Sorry, I thoght you feed it from the head. It is from the OFH, but didn't see it before.

 

[red_devil]

Like you stated above ^^^. That is not enough, if correct.

Sorry, I thoght you feed it from the head. It is from the OFH, but didn't see it before.

Yeah its from the ofh. I wanted to test both areas before installing the holset and report back with what I found.

 

[welfle18]

I have been reading alot about these holset turbos and about the proper oiling procedures, and well I bought an oil restrictor for a bb turbo awhile back and was wondering that if I drilled out the .035 hole to an 1/8th inch hole if that would work? Meaning are the threads the same on the holset turbo as say the bb turbo I originally was going to run. I am of the OFH by the way with bs and os. Thanks.