Altered Mental Status (1G AWD 5spd)

[Anfurnyy]

Or....a canopy at least!

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I should have known hahaha

 

[jesse12345]

That's awesome! I need to get a 2g one.

 

[SixBolt_16G]

Or....a canopy at least!

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Gonna need to weigh that down for those Florida hurricanes...

 

[1990TSIAWDTALON]

Dam....I need to order hold down ratchet straps!!!
Back to you Cory.....sorry about the thread jack.

 

[BLACK'98DSM]

At this point, he probably doesn't care. We've all done it once - or five times . There are 93 pages in this build thread. We honestly may need these side conversations to keep Cory entertained and motivated!

 

[CrackedDSM]

At this point, he probably doesn't care. We've all done it once - or five times . There are 93 pages in this build thread. We honestly may need these side conversations to keep Cory entertained and motivated!

It's funny you say this, I was gonna post up the greta toonsberg meme of "How dare you" at Marty's comment and make some sarcastic quip of how I never go off topic ever, but you beat me to it.


This is my escape from the pressures of real life, so random stuff and tangents and off topic posts are fun to me.


Either way, I don't mind. And thanks fellas. It was a rough weekend in EMS.

 

[CrackedDSM]

Random update: I think I'm gonna try to reinstall cruise control in this thing. I need to test if the stalk actually activates everything, if the cruise computer is still even in there, and if it's even wired correctly.


But, I'm gonna do the exact same thing I've done with everything so far. I'm just gonna buy the cruise control system, plug it in, and see if it works. If it doesn't, then diagnose and test why not.

Auto seatbelts, rear wiper, stereo...etc. Kind of have a track record now. Lol. So yeah.

I also scored some fog lights for free.99, but they didn't have the brackets sadly. If anyone has the hookup on some 1GA turbo fog-light brackets, hit a brotha up.

 

[CrackedDSM]

I’ve checked fluids, found nothing out of the ordinary, and honestly I’ve decided screw it. I’m gonna just drive the car to work and let whatever is making noise either break, or get bad enough to be obvious.

I know what you’re gonna say. But I’ll be 100% honest and not in a bad way, I don’t care. if something breaks or locks up I’ll replace it. If nothing happens then we’ll chalk it up to drivetime noise from solid mounts. Idk.

Stay tuned for the exciting conclusion of “will this blow up in my face or be fine?”

 

[CrackedDSM]

I chickened out driving the car to work. But since I swapped the hatch out I needed a new sticker for my back window. New one came in today.

 

[Justin DuBois]

I chickened out driving the car to work. But since I swapped the hatch out I needed a new sticker for my back window. New one came in today.

View attachment 763059

love it - you need that one

 

[CrackedDSM]

love it - you need that one

I know. I saw it and had to have it. So true too.


But, this sticker was actually custom made because it had a white circular background and I didn’t want that. Dude did an awesome job and came quick. He’s the same one that made the sticker on my bumper that says “built this shit myself, vehicle may explode”.

 

[CrackedDSM]

Alright guys, I am now attempting to tune the car the "proper" way. It's full E85. I feel like I'm having to add a ton of fuel, and it's still running super lean on WOT. I need to add fuel during spool up, but so far this is how we're looking.


Advice please. Off boost the car seems to love life way more on this setup. Just seems like I'm having to do crazy things with deadtimes and stuff though.

All advice welcome and appreciated. @Justin DuBois @enriquez2000 and anyone else I forgot.


Also: Does anyone have linktools they'd be willing to share with me? I feel like that would help a lot for dialing in the VE map. Honestly though, this feels good. The car feels noticeably more smooth tuning it this way.

 

[CrackedDSM]

Set my OL thresholds to 1.1 and 51% and did some cruising and part throttle/part boost driving. Using SDVEAdjust it's dialed in the cruise really well I think. I haven't touched WOT yet, but I'm sure it's gonna throw everything off when I do..however I'm fine with that. Worst case scenario if I suddenly need the car, it'll drive anywhere right now and be fine.


I'm gonna let the car cool down a bit, and wait for some advice on WOT tuning. Here's a 30 second idle log for you guys, so you can see current VE settings and stuff. After review and advice I'll do some WOT tuning.

But seriously...night and day difference in how this thing drives. It cruises so smooth now, no more surging or random lean spots during 1k-2k RPM range when accelerating...and honestly I THINK(need more time and data) the idle issues are gone too. The fans kicked on and off and it didn't die.

Anyway, here's the idle log.

 

[SixBolt_16G]

Set my OL thresholds to 1.1 and 51% and did some cruising and part throttle/part boost driving. Using SDVEAdjust it's dialed in the cruise really well I think. I haven't touched WOT yet, but I'm sure it's gonna throw everything off when I do..however I'm fine with that. Worst case scenario if I suddenly need the car, it'll drive anywhere right now and be fine.


I'm gonna let the car cool down a bit, and wait for some advice on WOT tuning. Here's a 30 second idle log for you guys, so you can see current VE settings and stuff. After review and advice I'll do some WOT tuning.

But seriously...night and day difference in how this thing drives. It cruises so smooth now, no more surging or random lean spots during 1k-2k RPM range when accelerating...and honestly I THINK(need more time and data) the idle issues are gone too. The fans kicked on and off and it didn't die.

Anyway, here's the idle log.

Is there a specific order, as in, whether you have to do WOT or cruise tuning after you have your idle dialed in?

 

[CrackedDSM]

Is there a specific order, as in, whether you have to do WOT or cruise tuning after you have your idle dialed in?

I am nowhere near an expert, but honestly I've been told two ways and both are exactly opposite of each other.

The two ways:

1) Get the car to idle by any real means necessary, don't dial it in perfect. Drive the car, and get WOT perfectly lined up with global fuel. You want 100% VE at like 5500 to be exactly whatever your fuel table is set at that point. Mine is 11.5:1, so you want your WB to read 11.5:1 at 100%VE. Dial in global to make that happen. Then work backwards, dial cruise in, then dial idle in.

2) Pretty much what the above said, but in reverse order. Dial idle in perfectly with deadtimes and adjusting VE in the idle cells trying to get AirFlowPerRev to read .25-.30. Then do cruising, then do WOT.


I'm not really telling what I'm doing yet as it's kind of a hybrid. To be honest, I can see the logic behind #1. Because any adjustments to global will throw everything off. So it kinda makes sense to tune WOT, then cruise, then get idle perfect with deadtimes and VE adjustments.

But...take my advice with an entire container of salt. This is my first time seeing net positive results from tuning by myself..sooooooo. Lol.

 

[Justin DuBois]

I am nowhere near an expert, but honestly I've been told two ways and both are exactly opposite of each other.

The two ways:

1) Get the car to idle by any real means necessary, don't dial it in perfect. Drive the car, and get WOT perfectly lined up with global fuel. You want 100% VE at like 5500 to be exactly whatever your fuel table is set at that point. Mine is 11.5:1, so you want your WB to read 11.5:1 at 100%VE. Dial in global to make that happen. Then work backwards, dial cruise in, then dial idle in.

2) Pretty much what the above said, but in reverse order. Dial idle in perfectly with deadtimes and adjusting VE in the idle cells trying to get AirFlowPerRev to read .25-.30. Then do cruising, then do WOT.


I'm not really telling what I'm doing yet as it's kind of a hybrid. To be honest, I can see the logic behind #1. Because any adjustments to global will throw everything off. So it kinda makes sense to tune WOT, then cruise, then get idle perfect with deadtimes and VE adjustments.

But...take my advice with an entire container of salt. This is my first time seeing net positive results from tuning by myself..sooooooo. Lol.

You skipped the detail of setting the base fuel pressure, and then setting global fuel to hit AFR targets when WOT around 5500rpm when the VE cell is 100

 

[SixBolt_16G]

I am nowhere near an expert, but honestly I've been told two ways and both are exactly opposite of each other.

The two ways:

1) Get the car to idle by any real means necessary, don't dial it in perfect. Drive the car, and get WOT perfectly lined up with global fuel. You want 100% VE at like 5500 to be exactly whatever your fuel table is set at that point. Mine is 11.5:1, so you want your WB to read 11.5:1 at 100%VE. Dial in global to make that happen. Then work backwards, dial cruise in, then dial idle in.

2) Pretty much what the above said, but in reverse order. Dial idle in perfectly with deadtimes and adjusting VE in the idle cells trying to get AirFlowPerRev to read .25-.30. Then do cruising, then do WOT.


I'm not really telling what I'm doing yet as it's kind of a hybrid. To be honest, I can see the logic behind #1. Because any adjustments to global will throw everything off. So it kinda makes sense to tune WOT, then cruise, then get idle perfect with deadtimes and VE adjustments.

But...take my advice with an entire container of salt. This is my first time seeing net positive results from tuning by myself..sooooooo. Lol.

Thanks for the reply.. Ive seen it 2 different ways too and didnt know whether it mattered or whether the way of doing things progressed over the years to preferring one way over the other.

I was tryiing to get my AirflowPerRevs down last week cause its currently sitting at .42. Had trouble getting out of the 30s after dropping the idle cell on the VE charts as low as 45 and increasing the value for deadtime, but I didnt come close to as high as what I see yours is at, so i couldve gone further. Just didnt seem like i was moviing to much. Suppose to be nice tomorrow, so. probablygoing to take some logs if Ive resolved all my issues and then get back to trying to tune this bi***.

 

[CrackedDSM]

Thanks.. Ive seen it 2 different ways too and didnt know whether it mattered or whether the way of doing things progressed over the years to preferring one way over the other.

I was tryiing to get my AirflowPerRevs down last week cause its currently sitting at .42. Had touble gettiing out of the 30s after dropping the idle cell on the VE charts as low as 45 and increasing the value for deadtime, but I didnt come close to as high as what I see yours is at, so i couldve gone further. Suppose to be nice tomorrow, so. probably goiing to take some logs if Ive resolved all my issues.

I'm honestly not going to bother chasing and making it .25 or .30. I'm gonna do everything that I reasonably can to dial it in and make it run like a top, but if that means leaving it in the 50's and everything else is perfect then that is a-okay with me.

 

[Stapl3]

I am nowhere near an expert, but honestly I've been told two ways and both are exactly opposite of each other.

The two ways:

1) Get the car to idle by any real means necessary, don't dial it in perfect. Drive the car, and get WOT perfectly lined up with global fuel. You want 100% VE at like 5500 to be exactly whatever your fuel table is set at that point. Mine is 11.5:1, so you want your WB to read 11.5:1 at 100%VE. Dial in global to make that happen. Then work backwards, dial cruise in, then dial idle in.

2) Pretty much what the above said, but in reverse order. Dial idle in perfectly with deadtimes and adjusting VE in the idle cells trying to get AirFlowPerRev to read .25-.30. Then do cruising, then do WOT.


I'm not really telling what I'm doing yet as it's kind of a hybrid. To be honest, I can see the logic behind #1. Because any adjustments to global will throw everything off. So it kinda makes sense to tune WOT, then cruise, then get idle perfect with deadtimes and VE adjustments.

But...take my advice with an entire container of salt. This is my first time seeing net positive results from tuning by myself..sooooooo. Lol.

Number 2 will only work if someone is going to have their airflow adjustments in ridiculous shape. The ECU in these cars are so reliant on airflow adjustments being near stock.

Honestly to cut all the noise out and just get to dialing the car correctly it is so simple: Have all ECU adjustments stock, put the base fuel pressure where you think it should be, put in the global fuel value you think it should be, then do WOT pulls on low boost to 5500. While ignoring the fuel gauge, adjust your AFPR physically until the logged WB value is to equal AFRatioEST at 5500rpm. Then for idle, use only deadtime to get the datalogged WB to equal AFRatioEst. That's as much fat as I can cut off the whole method, but if you do this, you'll be 90% correct and you can then play with the SD table, timing, DA, etc etc guiltfree.

 

[Anfurnyy]

Number 2 will only work if someone is going to have their airflow adjustments in ridiculous shape. The ECU in these cars are so reliant on airflow adjustments being near stock.

Honestly to cut all the noise out and just get to dialing the car correctly it is so simple: Have all ECU adjustments stock, put the base fuel pressure where you think it should be, put in the global fuel value you think it should be, then do WOT pulls on low boost to 5500. While ignoring the fuel gauge, adjust your AFPR physically until the logged WB value is to equal AFRatioEST at 5500rpm. Then for idle, use only deadtime to get the datalogged WB to equal AFRatioEst. That's as much fat as I can cut off the whole method, but if you do this, you'll be 90% correct and you can then play with the SD table, timing, DA, etc etc guiltfree.

+1 for this.

 

[Anfurnyy]

Alright guys, I am now attempting to tune the car the "proper" way. It's full E85. I feel like I'm having to add a ton of fuel, and it's still running super lean on WOT. I need to add fuel during spool up, but so far this is how we're looking.


Advice please. Off boost the car seems to love life way more on this setup. Just seems like I'm having to do crazy things with deadtimes and stuff though.

All advice welcome and appreciated. @Justin DuBois @enriquez2000 and anyone else I forgot.


Also: Does anyone have linktools they'd be willing to share with me? I feel like that would help a lot for dialing in the VE map. Honestly though, this feels good. The car feels noticeably more smooth tuning it this way.

Well for starters i see your global fuel is only -35. With the calculator and 1150cc injectors and 43.5 base pressure the calc is spitting out -69 for me. Of course this isnt the end all, be all but yours seems way off, which then translates to off airflowperrev and goofy values in the VE table.
Based off the log id say youre going to have to fix that in order to add it back in the VE table so that it hits your 11.5 afr target at 5500-6000 at 100% VE since i think ECMLink maxes out at 127.5 VE and it looks like you're going to need up to about 15% more fuel in some of the wot cells according to the WBFactor. You wont max it out, but you'll be getting close
Your idle log looks decent outside of your airflowperrev, looks like everything is trying to do its job but you've got some weird spikes in your AFRatioEst that seem like they could be throwing the closed loop off?

i dont know if you have but also make sure that you go into the AEM Wideband settings and setup the min and max voltages for it. Should be listed in the instructions:

 

[CrackedDSM]

Well for starters i see your global fuel is only -35. With the calculator and 1150cc injectors and 43.5 base pressure the calc is spitting out -69 for me. Of course this isnt the end all, be all but yours seems way off, which then translates to off airflowperrev and goofy values in the VE table.
Based off the log id say youre going to have to fix that in order to add it back in the VE table so that it hits your 11.5 afr target at 5500-6000 at 100% VE since i think ECMLink maxes out at 127.5 VE and it looks like you're going to need up to about 15% more fuel in some of the wot cells according to the WBFactor. You wont max it out, but you'll be getting close
Your idle log looks decent outside of your airflowperrev, looks like everything is trying to do its job but you've got some weird spikes in your AFRatioEst that seem like they could be throwing the closed loop off?

i dont know if you have but also make sure that you go into the AEM Wideband settings and setup the min and max voltages for it. Should be listed in the instructions:
View attachment 763219

According to this thread that I found and the complex math in there, I feel like global is right where it should be since I'm on full E85. On pump gas I think -61 would be perfect. At -60 global fuel idle was pretty good, but anywhere above -10 vacuum was like 19-21 AFR ratio. Also, I have 1050 injectors, not 1150. The VE values are from the stock map I found.

Number 2 will only work if someone is going to have their airflow adjustments in ridiculous shape. The ECU in these cars are so reliant on airflow adjustments being near stock.

Honestly to cut all the noise out and just get to dialing the car correctly it is so simple: Have all ECU adjustments stock, put the base fuel pressure where you think it should be, put in the global fuel value you think it should be, then do WOT pulls on low boost to 5500. While ignoring the fuel gauge, adjust your AFPR physically until the logged WB value is to equal AFRatioEST at 5500rpm. Then for idle, use only deadtime to get the datalogged WB to equal AFRatioEst. That's as much fat as I can cut off the whole method, but if you do this, you'll be 90% correct and you can then play with the SD table, timing, DA, etc etc guiltfree.

I added some base fuel pressure, about half a turn and went to drive it. This is the log. I'm actually really very pleased with it. AFRest and Wideband match extremely closely/almost perfectly at 5500rpm-ish. Just have a gnarly little lean spot in the map from like 3300-4500rpm ish.

Anyway, here's the log for everyone to peruse. I'll also attach an idle/part cruise log too.


04.26-03 log is the WOT log
04.26-04 is the idle/part cruise log

 

[CrackedDSM]

Made a few tweaks, here's two more logs. One is WOT log, one is idle. The WOT log will show two WOT spots. Both are 3rd gear. I chickened out and aborted the first WOT event at like 5300rpm, so I kept it in 3rd and then went from 4k-6600rpm. But yeah, both events are 3rd gear.

IDK man, I'm sure it's nowhere near professional level but I am extremely pleased with myself here. The car runs SO MUCH BETTER than the previous "tune" using the MAFComp sliders, and I am doing these changes myself. Before I gave up, but this time...honestly it's been easy. I wish I would've just pushed through before but alas. Better late than never. I'm proud of me. Car seems to really, really love it too. And I'm flowing more airflow at a much lower boost level now. Awesome stuff all around.

Logs

 

[Anfurnyy]

According to this thread that I found and the complex math in there, I feel like global is right where it should be since I'm on full E85. On pump gas I think -61 would be perfect. At -60 global fuel idle was pretty good, but anywhere above -10 vacuum was like 19-21 AFR ratio. Also, I have 1050 injectors, not 1150. The VE values are from the stock map I found.

That's a valid point. Global should be less negative on E. I mean 1050 too. I calculated with 1050s but typed 1150

Sounds like you're on the right path my dude! Keep at it and dial in that VE

 

[CrackedDSM]

That's a valid point. Global should be less negative on E. I mean 1050 too. I calculated with 1050s but typed 1150

Sounds like you're on the right path my dude! Keep at it and dial in that VE

Thanks brotha. I can't express how grateful I am for everyone in this thread and outside of it who not only helped me, but have continually encouraged me to move away from that terrible tune using MAFcomp. God the car ran like ass on that. This was so easy, I just had to push through and stop getting so angry/giving up so easy.


The car runs indescribably better. It doesn't die when I turn both fans on, it doesn't die when I come to a stop. It doesn't have a buck or shudder or hesitation. It honestly feels and runs like a stock M/T DSM but with more power obviously. It's so smooth revving and driving. God I should've done this sooner.


But now it's just honestly driving and tweaking the VE map. I'm a little bit confused on what to do about the cells under 5500 RPM needing more fuel though, so maybe someone can give advice on what to do there. I feel like I'm gonna need more than 100%VE there and I don't wanna do that. At 4500 it seems like it needs more fuel, by just a tiny bit. But yeah. Big thanks to yourself and everyone else.