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Street Build Return of the King

Rating:
4.66667/5,
Year:
1993
Model/Trim:
Eagle Talon TSi AWD
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  1. Vegas smith

    Vegas smith Proven Member

    2,277
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    Joined Dec 2, 2002
    Houston, Texas
    Got the engine finished up. I'm using a hoist for the first time which is interesting. It scares the hell out of me having all that $$ hanging over cement like that but everything worked out all right. It's so nice having the big stuff in the car all at once. It can be really hard getting these transmissions in with two people much less one.

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    Street Build 2K  10

    1993 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · manual · 1G DSM
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  2. Vegas smith

    Vegas smith Proven Member

    2,277
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    Joined Dec 2, 2002
    Houston, Texas
    Little helper anxiously awaiting the finished project.

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    Street Build 2K  10

    1993 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · manual · 1G DSM
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  3. Vegas smith

    Vegas smith Proven Member

    2,277
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    Joined Dec 2, 2002
    Houston, Texas
    When I pulled everything apart a few months ago I noticed there was something going on with my clutch/flywheel. As you can tell there was some type of warping or overheating. What happened was when I installed the transmission last year I had so much trouble installing it that I wound up damaging the clutch disk. I was going to buy a brand new clutch from Tim Zimmer and get the flywheel resurfaced but that was going to cost $650-700 with shipping and all.

    I wound up talking to South Bend and long story short they actually can upgrade your clutch disk and pressure-plate for a reasonable price. I wound upgrading the disk to a kevlar/ceramic disk and getting the SS plate upgraded to something in the middle of the SS-X as they said they couldn't get it to the SS-X level. They also resurface your flywheel and make sure everything is perfect; all this for $350. I was pretty darn happy. They also have great customer service. I also regret not giving Tim Zimmer my business as he has been very helpful and I will surely be using him in the future.

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    Last edited: Jun 10, 2018

    Street Build 2K  10

    1993 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · manual · 1G DSM
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  4. brian9397gsx

    brian9397gsx Proven Member

    1,143
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    Joined Apr 28, 2008
    sioux city, Iowa
    It's not good if you plan on using it for food afterwards. My toaster oven in the garage is only for parts same as my old kitchen oven will be.
     
    brian9397gsx

    2K  0

    1993 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    19.80 @ 35.55 · 1G DSM
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  5. Vegas smith

    Vegas smith Proven Member

    2,277
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    Joined Dec 2, 2002
    Houston, Texas
    A little update on the car:

    The car has been "running" for a few weeks now but I've had very little time to work on it. It has been running extremely poorly since it has been done. I took a log and the first thing I noticed was a battery voltage of 11.9. I figured that was the main culprit so I set out on a quest to fix this voltage issue.

    Long story short, I tested everything in the alternator circuit (becoming an expert in the process), and finally remembered that the only new part in that area of that car was the new Jay Racing alternator bracket. On his site he recommends to grind away the black paint on the bracket to help with grounding. Lo and behold, that was the cause of the voltage issue.

    However, car is still running like sh**! My next step is to clean the injectors! I'm confident this is the real problem...just need time.
     

    Street Build 2K  10

    1993 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · manual · 1G DSM
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  6. iugrad92turbo

    iugrad92turbo Proven Member

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    Joined May 22, 2007
    Kalamazoo, Michigan
    Yeah I remember reading about grinding the block for good contact, btw, if I missed it what turbo is that your running.
     

    5K  6

    1992 Eagle Talon TSi
    awd · manual · 1G DSM

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    1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · manual · 1G DSM
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  7. Vegas smith

    Vegas smith Proven Member

    2,277
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    Joined Dec 2, 2002
    Houston, Texas
    Its the BB HTZ 76.
     

    Street Build 2K  10

    1993 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · manual · 1G DSM
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  8. We're on Boost

    We're on Boost Proven Member

    840
    50
    Joined Aug 25, 2007
    Seattle area, Washington
    What is the voltage now, since you fixed the voltage issue?
    On my car, I've seen that when it is running with a dead alternator, the voltage right on the battery terminals is ~ 12.04 volts, and that is not enough, it runs really rough that way. But I don't know what my log would have said for voltage, it wasn't hooked up. It's always lower in the log.

    My logged voltage values with working alternators have been like this:
    Alternator #2, 65 amp NAPA reman: 12.6 to 13.0 volts during the drive, quite variable.
    Alternator #3, 90 amp Bosch AL4008X reman: 13.8 volts pretty consistent during the drive.

    Alternator #2 is the one that was on the car when it was at English Racing getting all the work done and 15 dyno pulls.
    Alternator #3 I put on soon after getting the car back from them. It quit working last weekend.
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2018

    3K  17

    1990 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    650 whp · 510 lb/ft · 1G DSM

    1K  0

    1990 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    manual · 1G DSM
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  9. brian9397gsx

    brian9397gsx Proven Member

    1,143
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    Joined Apr 28, 2008
    sioux city, Iowa
    Stock alternators suck. I'm glad I went with a one wire gm I've had 0 issues. As far as grounding goes I always run a separate ground from my alternator to the chassis just for good measure.
     
    brian9397gsx

    2K  0

    1993 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    19.80 @ 35.55 · 1G DSM
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  10. We're on Boost

    We're on Boost Proven Member

    840
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    Joined Aug 25, 2007
    Seattle area, Washington
    Cool!
    Could you tell me what the model number or part number of your Alternator is? Or, the car make and model and year that it was originally made for, so I can look it up?

    Why are these relocated installs always using Saturn alternators? If you are calling it a "one wire GM" then maybe it has been used on a number of different GM cars?
    I did a little looking at Saturn alternators last night, and they are all remans already, and it will get worse, because of the demise of Saturn.
    I'm basically, with the Saturn alternator idea, just trying to get the lay of the land of it at this point. Then maybe it will be a winter project for me at some point. Not looking to rush it haha!
     

    3K  17

    1990 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    650 whp · 510 lb/ft · 1G DSM

    1K  0

    1990 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    manual · 1G DSM
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  11. brian9397gsx

    brian9397gsx Proven Member

    1,143
    86
    Joined Apr 28, 2008
    sioux city, Iowa
     
    brian9397gsx

    2K  0

    1993 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    19.80 @ 35.55 · 1G DSM
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  12. Vegas smith

    Vegas smith Proven Member

    2,277
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    Joined Dec 2, 2002
    Houston, Texas
    The alternator I use is the 8215N:

    https://www.motorcityreman.com/91scse1.html

    You can pay a little extra and they'll convert it to a 1-wire setup. I'm not sure why or how people started using them but I guess somebody along the way figured they work perfectly in the back of the block (and in the front, I believe).
     

    Street Build 2K  10

    1993 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · manual · 1G DSM
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  13. We're on Boost

    We're on Boost Proven Member

    840
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    Joined Aug 25, 2007
    Seattle area, Washington
    Ahh, excellent, that gives me a lot of info to chew on.
    Long list of years and models, 7 years and about that many models. There must be a lot of those alternators out there.
    It does look like it could almost be footprint identical except for the electrical terminals, but should be easy to take care of that.
    I can see that if you tried to use it in the stock (front) position, you would have to really shield the back from radiant energy coming off the exhaust, because the rubber seal for the rear bearing is right out there exposed.

    Do you use some shop's relocation brackets to put it in the rear?
     

    3K  17

    1990 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    650 whp · 510 lb/ft · 1G DSM

    1K  0

    1990 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    manual · 1G DSM
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  14. Vegas smith

    Vegas smith Proven Member

    2,277
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    Joined Dec 2, 2002
    Houston, Texas
    I use the Jay racing alternator relocation bracket.
     

    Street Build 2K  10

    1993 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · manual · 1G DSM
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  15. brian9397gsx

    brian9397gsx Proven Member

    1,143
    86
    Joined Apr 28, 2008
    sioux city, Iowa
    I dont know why my response didn't post sorry, I dont know exactly where or what alternator I've got. I'd assume it's one that Vegas linked. I've had my kit for over 10years and picked it up from someone's part out. But hey 10yrs no issues but take that with a grain of salt. The car has been down for 8 and has been running and driving now for 6months. I did modify my Jay racing relocation kit to space my alternator closer to the motor and used a different pulley that's larger and a 4 rib. Then used a shorter belt just to make extra clearance between my frame rail and pulley. Didn't need to with it as a manual but with the auto trans and mounts it was too close for me. Hope that helps.
     
    brian9397gsx

    2K  0

    1993 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    19.80 @ 35.55 · 1G DSM
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  16. We're on Boost

    We're on Boost Proven Member

    840
    50
    Joined Aug 25, 2007
    Seattle area, Washington

    Yes, thanks!
    I looked at the Jay Racing and MAP info about the relocation kit enough to notice that there is one piece you can turn around so the alternator pulley lines up with either the inner or outer pulley on the crank. That's cool.
    They also offer an alloy steel version that is stronger.
    I'm pretty foggy on what threaded holes it uses on the block, for attachment.
    I need to try to sneak my cell phone in there under the intake manifold to get some pics of what is already back there and if those attachment points are already being used by something. ER did make a bracket to take my coil pack and power transistor, that attaches to the block in that area, which was necessary because of the Magnus intake manifold which has no attach point for those things.

    I really need to stay away from the engine bracket in the timing belt area where there is a threaded 8mm hole. I have a bracket attached there that I made to hold my sawed-in-half timing belt cover in place LOL.

    Even without that consideration I still would like to use the inner crank pulley and not run the water pump with the alternator belt. I'd like the alternator on it's own belt run by the inner crank pulley.
    And the water pump on its own belt to the outer crank pulley, water pump driving the PS pump as in OEM. That means I'd need a dummy pulley in the stock alternator position to tension that belt, using the stock alternator bracket tension adjusting parts.
    That way I'd have 2 belts to drive all that stuff, rather than all that belt power coming from just the one 4 rib belt, and none of it would be coming near the 8mm threaded hole on the engine bracket.
    I might need a slightly larger pulley on the alternator like you did, to keep my alternator speed down, since the inner crank pulley is a little larger diameter than the outer one.

    Wow, bunch of stuff.

    I'm also thinking about trying out a LiFePO4 battery instead of a normal lead-acid battery. The LiFePO4 batteries operate about 1 volt higher than a lead-acid. That should mean that if the alternator does die out on the road, I would still have high voltage to the ignition system, which I seem to need for good running. Not only that, the battery I'm looking at only weighs 8 pounds. So I could keep an "extra" battery in the cabin or in the trunk, ready to replace the one under the hood, to give me some more amp-hours to run home on. Pretty crazy.
     
    Last edited: Sep 16, 2018

    3K  17

    1990 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    650 whp · 510 lb/ft · 1G DSM

    1K  0

    1990 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    manual · 1G DSM
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  17. Vegas smith

    Vegas smith Proven Member

    2,277
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    Joined Dec 2, 2002
    Houston, Texas
    A little update on the car:
    I'm still in the process of figuring out this bucking/hesitation issue. I've switched out my hi-z 1650s to stock 450 and the problem went away. I'm happy that I can at least drive and start to break-in the new clutch even though it's on stock injectors.

    I've been working on radiator ducting. I don't know if it will work but it's been fun to get creative to try and seal the radiator area. I've secured it to the front tubular crossmember with rubber grommets and zip ties.

    More updates coming this week

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    1993 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · manual · 1G DSM
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  18. TheBrownMike

    TheBrownMike Probationary Member

    11
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    Joined Apr 9, 2018
    SAN DIEGO, California
    Good build thread dude, keep it rollin!
     

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    1991 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    awd · manual · 1G DSM
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  19. We're on Boost

    We're on Boost Proven Member

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    Joined Aug 25, 2007
    Seattle area, Washington
    Are you going to have your 1650 injectors cleaned and tested, and try them again?
    I don't see anything in here about removing the resistor pack for those injectors.
     

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    1990 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    650 whp · 510 lb/ft · 1G DSM

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    1990 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    manual · 1G DSM
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  20. Vegas smith

    Vegas smith Proven Member

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    Houston, Texas
    I just got them back from FIC. They said they were perfectly fine. Strange. I did the resistor pack delete and all that.
     

    Street Build 2K  10

    1993 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · manual · 1G DSM
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  21. iugrad92turbo

    iugrad92turbo Proven Member

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    Kalamazoo, Michigan
    Looks good keep updates going.
     

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    1992 Eagle Talon TSi
    awd · manual · 1G DSM

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    1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · manual · 1G DSM
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  22. 1cleangsx

    1cleangsx Proven Member

    57
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    Joined Sep 28, 2013
    Cheyenne, Wyoming
    Sorry I haven’t read the entire build thread, but what heat range plug/gap are you running? I know those 450’s won’t even handle wastegate pressure on that turbo, so obviously your driving with no boost for break in, but we’re you bucking when you weren’t in boost on the 1650’s? Bucking/hesitation is best case scenario plugs or boost leak, worst case valves, hope fully somethin simple, I’ve been waiting on some updates cuz I can’t wait to see what you do on that xr71, which fp no longer offers:confused:
     

    Street Build 747  10

    1990 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    13.2 @ 104.64 · 1G DSM
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  23. 1cleangsx

    1cleangsx Proven Member

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    Joined Sep 28, 2013
    Cheyenne, Wyoming
    Sorry, I meant xr61
     

    Street Build 747  10

    1990 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    13.2 @ 104.64 · 1G DSM
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  24. Vegas smith

    Vegas smith Proven Member

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    Houston, Texas
    It was bucking both in/out of boost. I can't wait to see that the xr 61-56 offers too :(
     

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    1993 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · manual · 1G DSM
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  25. We're on Boost

    We're on Boost Proven Member

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    Joined Aug 25, 2007
    Seattle area, Washington
    Maybe we could tell something from a log where there was some bucking. In fact, now that you have the 450's in it and it doesn't buck, it would be cool to compare a 450 log with a 1650 log.
     

    3K  17

    1990 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    650 whp · 510 lb/ft · 1G DSM

    1K  0

    1990 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    manual · 1G DSM
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