The 14b Drag Race Discussion Thread

[outlawdsm]

Hey Phil, are you going to the E-town shootout on the 23rd? If so are you bringing the car?

 

[TSimage]

Ahhhh, yeah I know Cali is tough. For some reason, most likely the lack of an I/C set-up you're running, I thought the VR4 of yours was a full race effort, I didn't think it was doubling as a road car as well.......wow, 4" aluminum on the Talon, that's pretty sick! Well, hope you have a go at it soon....

The Galant will be my daily

 

[Phil1320]

Hey Phil, are you going to the E-town shootout on the 23rd? If so are you bringing the car?

I am going to try to make it down. Life is busier right now than it's ever been for me, so I can't say 100% I'll be there. I have not been to E-town in years, and I used to be there at least 5-6 times a season. Bummer. However, I will not be bringing my car. I don't have a rollbar installed yet and I wouldn't want to travel all that way and have my day cut short for running too quick as I'm sure there's a zero tolerance policy there, which I'm fine with really. Our local tracks give a tiny bit of leeway, but, they are tightening up as well, as they should.

Anyway, I will keep you posted as it gets closer....will you be bringing your car?

The Galant will be my daily

That's cool...that's what mine is.....doubt it will be as quick as yours though! Well, good luck and let us know how it goes!

 

[outlawdsm]

Ahh, I was hoping to see your car, oh well.

I'll be there to spectate with my 14b car. Look for a white 1gb with colorado plates, my 2g talon is still in colorado. ( 92 talon,1g rods, 2g pistons, mls headgasket, arp head studs, no balance shafts, ported 2g exhaust manifold, ported turbine housing, 3in turbo back exhaust, alamo smic, mbc, phenolic intake manifold spacer, 2g throttle body elbow, prothane mounts, no AC, act 6 puck, innovate wideband, safc2, walboro255 )

 

[Phil1320]

Ahh, I was hoping to see your car, oh well.

I'll be there to spectate with my 14b car. Look for a white 1gb with colorado plates, my 2g talon is still in colorado. ( 92 talon,1g rods, 2g pistons, mls headgasket, arp head studs, no balance shafts, ported 2g exhaust manifold, ported turbine housing, 3in turbo back exhaust, alamo smic, mbc, phenolic intake manifold spacer, 2g throttle body elbow, prothane mounts, no AC, act 6 puck, innovate wideband, safc2, walboro255 )

Damn..sorry...hopefully in the future though Ok, I will look for the car for sure and if I'm heading down I'll wear a distinct color shirt so you can find me and we can hook up and talk....sound cool?

 

[Phil1320]

Well, with the help of Bob and Rob of Forced Induction Motorsports here in CT, I actually made it up to Lebanon Valley Dragway in NY State yesterday for the CCDSM Fall Dragday!!! So, a big thanks to these guys first off before anything else! Without them, purely, it wouldn't have been possible. I honestly had no plans to race this season at all. But, in talking, my interest sparked, and I was inspired to just go have some fun rather than making it all about the numbers....basically, how it used to be years ago. Although, anyone that knows me, knows I'm a numbers type of guy.

So, I made a mad dash to get the car back together last week. I finally started it up on Tuesday I think and threw the slicks on. I literally hadn't touched the car since last year, and it hadn't even been started it since I pulled it in the garage last October.

I knew I hadn't made any changes to the car...so I knew it was going to be hard to match or beat my previous best of 11.49---I mean, that was THE run for my car the way it sits. But, I was presented with the opportunity to make it out, so why not just go see what I can do. Without any more BS, here goes....

#1 pass 1.50 60' missed third, threw it in anyway...went [email protected]. Ran 86.9 at the 1/8 due to the missed shift but the car still pulled strong gaining 24 mph up top....anyway, that was my warm up run and I think I psyched myself out in the staging lanes.

#2 pass 1.481 60' [email protected] not bad....

#3 pass 1.489 60' [email protected] gettin there....

#4 pass 1.480 60' [email protected] starting to stablilize a bit, the 1.48-0 is my best 60' to date as I ran the 1.481 above on run #2 and last October my best was a 1.48-1, so by one thousandth, but, I'll take it!

Now, pass #5 1.499 60' ....4.689 330', on my 11.49 it was 4.66, 1/8 mile was [email protected], on my 11.49 it was 7.279, 1000' was 9.638, on my 11.49 it was 9.562..........AND THEN..... I heard

EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEOOOOOOOOOOOOOWWWW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

....and there was quite a bit of white smoke in the rearview.........

...and so I slowed and moved off to the side as quickly as possible and pulled off the early turnoff.

GOOD-BYE AND R.I.P. ORIGINAL 14B TURBO

......AND STILL WENT [email protected]

It appears after looking over yesterdays timeslips and comparing them with last October's slips, I was on an 11.57 effort......that would have been my second quickest pass ever in front of my two 11.59 passes from last year.

So, that's a wrap on my "all original, never been off the car," 14B Stock Turbo.

Some details:

-I think the turbo blew at about 1100 ft.
-one of the track employees handed me the broken shaft about 10 minutes after the fact, before I inspected the car in whole, at that point I was thinking I've never seen something that looks like this, WTF?
-The oil trail was very small and thin. When I moved(pushed) the car from where I first shut it off, the oil trail stopped there.
-Upon lifting the hood, smoke was coming from the air filter, so that was another clue, also, the noise I heard when it happend sounded like something spinning FAST. And.....it was
-we got a tow back to the pits from local turbo/DSM guru Turbo Tony--thanks alot for that again--bigtime appreciated!
-local 420A DSM guru Bullett stopped over and we pulled the intake pipe, the nut that secures the compressor wheel to the shaft fell on the ground with a bit of oil, and there was the confirmation...it was now that we realized what the track worker handed me was the broken shaft that got spat out the exhaust.

You know, I've got to say that I was not dissappointed at all. More like I was waiting for something to give. I mean the car was built in 6/90. Good chance the turbo might have been manufactured that year, or maybe '89. Anyway, the car is 20 years old. It's been down the 1/4 mile countless times, and it had some hardcore street duty between '96-'00. The car, and the 14b turbo, have done me well over the years, 14 years to be exact, this month. I can't ask for any more. The turbo was brilliant. We tested the waters, and they were deep.

So, now......I join Dave, Nate, and Lucas.......what's that, 4 14b turbos between us......

Everything has it's limits......I'm impressed...I really am.

Other than an I/C pipe blowing off, I have NEVER, until yesterday, broken anything on my Talon.

The first thing to give, was undeniably the thing that gave me and the Talon our notoriety in the small, but awesome world of the DSM.

14B....the small stock turbo that could

 

[Pirrofab]

wow.... is all I have to say. Congrats on what was all set up to be another FAST run. Sorry to hear about the 14b giving up. all things happen for a reason. I have a 14b turbo right now on my friends talon with over 200k on it and its been running 18-21 for 4 years now and its still strong now with a 16g turbine housing on it. Do you have plans to install another 14b or step things up to a 16g? I know your a busy man but ofcourse when time allows.

 

[Phil1320]

Slips.....

wow.... is all I have to say. Congrats on what was all set up to be another FAST run. Sorry to hear about the 14b giving up. all things happen for a reason. I have a 14b turbo right now on my friends talon with over 200k on it and its been running 18-21 for 4 years now and its still strong now with a 16g turbine housing on it. Do you have plans to install another 14b or step things up to a 16g? I know your a busy man but ofcourse when time allows.

Yeah, wow is one way to describe it. Thanks for the props! Honestly, considering what happend, I'm happy with the 11.6 passes. To be able to pull off those passes and be on my way to another 11.5 pass was phenominal.
It really was a fun and successful day. I think several people thought I was going to be bent out of shape and I was the exact opposite. I guess you never know when your turbo will bite the dust. I did everything I could to extend the life of the turbo and always took care of the car well.

I'm not sure what my plans are. I have all winter to think about it. The local crew supplied me with many different opinions on where to go from here ranging from throwing a 35R on and running 9's, throwing the EVO 3 16g on, and of course, getting another 14b on there and continuing the quest.

Tough decision for me in a way. I've been told that the 550cc injectors probably won't cut it with the EVO 3 16g. I suppose I have to listen to that because I have zero experience with anything other than the 14b. If that's the case, well then there's one pro for staying on the 14b.

The biggest thing is......I've left a ton on the table in 14b world. There's alot left that I can do....and now would be the time to do SOME of it. I can't do it ALL at once. I'm at approximately a 50 WHP deficit when compared with the best 14b AWHP numbers.....that's alot, like I said, that I've left on the table. I think I need to grab some of that if I stay on the 14b. Another example it that I'm still using the AFC2 and that's it. I do have a chip now that I've used the last two times out. But, ultimately, DSMlink should pick me up quite a bit in the tuning dept.

The best thing about running the 14b is that it presents consistent challenge. I like that. It's always about the next tenth or two and how to get there.

I'm interested in all opinions though......what others think....pro's, con's, all that.

So, one piece of info from yesterday that some may be interested in....

The car weighed in at 2265 lbs. on the scale

With me.......2470 lbs. was race weight. At the first outing in '07 I weighed the car in at 2400 on the nose. Then came the lighter doors, removal of front swaybar, etc. I only guessed at the weight the rest of '09. Well now we have the exact. AND, the car could still be alot lighter. ALOT. Since I haven't consistently dropped ET below 11.49, I still don't need a rollbar So, the next time the car hits the strip in 2011, I expect weight to be closer to 2200 even. My goal was to be under 2500 total weight, so that has been met.

On a different note, pulled the turbo. Wow....pretty wrecked. Turbine wheel chewed the factory 02 sensor and might have killed my wideband 02 as well, if the oil saturation didn't kill it Wonder how far into the woods that thing went. They didn't find it on the track so....... That's a bummer but it comes with the territory. Also, the nut that secures the compressor wheel to the shaft had all it's threads in place, there was a nick at the top area, wonder if that sucker came loose and caused the failure....hmmm......wondering if I remember pneumo mentioning that happend to his.....either way, turbo no worky anymore

I've got some pics of it all that I'll post when I can.

Last, I did get some vids finally, however, they are not so great as they are on a point and shoot digi-cam. But, you can see the launches and stuff well, and you can see my Spyhunter smoke show at the end of the track....I think it's pretty cool to watch. So, I'll get those up here at some point as well.

Anyway, here's the slips.......

 

[bullettdsm]

Great day though, eh Phil? Pleasant surprise to see you there

And as I said before, I'm actually excited that the turbo blew. All that means to me is that you have more power coming your way without changing anything, BUT a rebuild on the turbo. In general, turbo's don't go from full power, working to full efficiency to blowing out wheels in a run or two (unless of course you starve it of oil or something catastrophic happens which wasn't the case here). So that leads me to believe that you did not have full efficiency of that turbo when you did you 11.4 run!

So, therefore, if-so-fatso, haybius corpses, you will have more power when you put another turbo on there (and it will be a 14b. Remember I know where you live ).

Again, a fun day had by all.

MB

 

[9!'clipseDOHC]

Wow! Sounds like quite a day! The way I see it, with as far as you have been on the 14 and the experience that you have, why change now? I say, keep pushing the 14b to the limits!

 

[Phil1320]

Great day though, eh Phil? Pleasant surprise to see you there

And as I said before, I'm actually excited that the turbo blew. All that means to me is that you have more power coming your way without changing anything, BUT a rebuild on the turbo. In general, turbo's don't go from full power, working to full efficiency to blowing out wheels in a run or two (unless of course you starve it of oil or something catastrophic happens which wasn't the case here). So that leads me to believe that you did not have full efficiency of that turbo when you did you 11.4 run!

So, therefore, if-so-fatso, haybius corpses, you will have more power when you put another turbo on there (and it will be a 14b. Remember I know where you live ).

Again, a fun day had by all.

MB

No doubt Mark, it was a great day, I did forget to mention that I can't remember a nicer, clearer, more perfect day for racing than yesterday, in all the 14 years that I've raced.

I hope you're right, to think I've been running mid 11's on a weak turbo is kinda nuts.....

....oh, and I did forget to mention up here that the boost was fluctuating between 21-23 psi which was odd to me as I've reported a ROCK SOLID 21 psi ever since the internal came off and the TIAL went on. Also, my A/F's were richer than normal right about 11:8 to 1 whereas in the past always were 12.2:1-12:4 to 1. Just some more notes there...

Thanks Mark for the encouragement as always....for those that don't know, this guy holds the record for the quickest NA DSM....see his sidebar...and he went out yesterday and hit 13.1 for a new record and personal best. Yes, I realize this is the 14b thread.....but, without Mark's help, and expertise in all things drag racing, I wouldn't be where I am. Mark has been my eyes and ears on many occasions and is directly related to my succeses with the car in 2009. As you can see, that will continue....and he has great interest in what I've been doing and likewise I love what he's doing as well. Again, thanks for the past, present, and future, you're an awesome guy to be around

Wow! Sounds like quite a day! The way I see it, with as far as you have been on the 14 and the experience that you have, why change now? I say, keep pushing the 14b to the limits!

In the grand scheme of things....it sure was.....

...thanks for the vote.....it seems to be leaning way toward sticking with the 14b so far......I guess I won't need the whole winter to think about what the direction will be, hell, it might not even be winter....

 

[9!'clipseDOHC]

Thanks Mark for the encouragement as always....for those that don't know, this guy holds the record for the quickest NA DSM....see his avatar...and he went out yesterday and hit 13.1 for a new record and personal best.

I was just noticing that and thinking dang, that N/T is spanking my turbo times. I've got to step it up. Those are some great times though!

 

[Nate Crisman]

Wow Phil, Im surprised and happy! not at all surprised that your 14b turbo "has left the building", but surprised and happy to hear you got back to the track this year and made a good showing. That's pretty insane to pull a car out of long term storage of nearly a full year and pull off runs within a tenth of your best ever pass.

My vote for replacement: put the E3 16g that you already have on the car and go run it the same as you have now for mechanical bits. It would be very very informative and cool to see that "back to back" change of only the turbo. I think E3 16g racing will give you that same incremental performance goal that you have with the 14b but at a much faster pace. I bet you would be in the 10.8's with no trouble on nothing other than a cartridge swap and possibly a bump to 650's w/ a chip or afc adjustment.

Since you don't get to run the car much, it would also be nice to start the 2011 season with a brand new MHI turbo that you know should last you the entire year with no worries. Compared to pulling another 20 year old 14b off the parts trader and blowing it to smitherines possibly on your first pass and wasting one of your rare days at the track. IMHO something fresh and new might re-invigorate your itch to race when you can gain big instead of only trying to chip off a hundreth.

 

[91-gsx]

That sounds like a fun track day, with awesome results, as always. I would stick with the 14B, and go all out with it. Like you mentioned, there is plenty of power left on the table for you to have fun with. And, 14B's are not too hard to get hold of. Once you do all the mods and get all the power that you can from a 14B, you can use that same setup with a 16G and keep the power coming. Good luck, with whichever choice you go with. Keep us updated.

Edit*
That is right, as Nate has mentioned, you have brand new 16G. This makes the decision a bit harder, because we all love 14B's. In this special case, it would be more efficient for you to use what you already have available. You will pick up some major power with the swap, and it will not cost you more. Those 550cc injectors and an SAFC will take you pretty far on race gas.

 

[habitatguy187]

I vote 14b with 7cm turbine housing, then 16g.


I want to see real-world gains by swapping out the stock housing.

 

[bullettdsm]

I vote 14b with 7cm turbine housing, then cams, then balance shafts, then DSMLink, then higher compression, then 16g

Agreed

Phil thanks for the kind words. I've really enjoyed being a part of your "research" on the limits of the 14b on a stocker engine . Its always easier to see stuff with 2 sets of eyes on a run, instead of just one set (in the car).

Its also easier when I say something like "Try hitting that shift point at 100rpm higher" and then you go out and do exactly the same run but with that shift point right at 100rpm higher Giving input is one thing, but transfering it to the track so consistantly is the part that is difficult.

Yup, spring time, here we come......

MB

 

[Phil1320]

I was just noticing that and thinking dang, that N/T is spanking my turbo times. I've got to step it up. Those are some great times though!

No doubt, awesome

Wow Phil, Im surprised and happy! not at all surprised that your 14b turbo "has left the building", but surprised and happy to hear you got back to the track this year and made a good showing. That's pretty insane to pull a car out of long term storage of nearly a full year and pull off runs within a tenth of your best ever pass.

My vote for replacement: put the E3 16g that you already have on the car and go run it the same as you have now for mechanical bits. It would be very very informative and cool to see that "back to back" change of only the turbo. I think E3 16g racing will give you that same incremental performance goal that you have with the 14b but at a much faster pace. I bet you would be in the 10.8's with no trouble on nothing other than a cartridge swap and possibly a bump to 650's w/ a chip or afc adjustment.

Since you don't get to run the car much, it would also be nice to start the 2011 season with a brand new MHI turbo that you know should last you the entire year with no worries. Compared to pulling another 20 year old 14b off the parts trader and blowing it to smitherines possibly on your first pass and wasting one of your rare days at the track. IMHO something fresh and new might re-invigorate your itch to race when you can gain big instead of only trying to chip off a hundreth.

It was a surprise to be able to hit the track for sure...I didn't expect I'd be there this year. It was great to get out again, it refuels me on why I love this stuff. And, you're right, it was pretty crazy to think that it sat for one year and came out and did what it did. So, thanks for the props!

About the E316g....mine is used, got it from a friend, it has about 20k on it, so I wouldn't be starting fresh, but way newer. Also, I think he had the turbine housing ported to reduce boost creep as much as possible(it was a street car)so most likely the porting he did is the exact opposite of what is discussed on the 68HTA thread for optimum flow. So, that's what I would be working with. Now that we're talking about it, I gotta go check that out. Either way it is what it is and I'll test it out, wether it(the 7cm housing) sticks with the E3 or not is the question, I actually still want to dabble with the 14b. As I said above, I've left alot on the table, and you've mentioned how much is still on the table as far as going full nuts on a drag build....still using Bucci's car as an example. I'm sure if that route was taken I could drop total race weight to around 2350 or so, I think Extreme's total race weight back then was maxed at a low of 2300 even.

On to your next point.....true that all 14b's are going to be old for sure. I wouldn't run another one unless I sent it out for full clean and rebuild. For instance, my VR4 has a 192k mile 14b on it and the car had all those problems with the clogged cat and it getting hot enough to take chunks out of the turbine housing---so that 14b probably wouldn't last long at all. If I were to go this route, I could entertain a 10 degree clip of the turbine wheel and port the compressor housing inlet and outlet for that little bit of advantage. I'd really like to test out some of these things to see if they show visible signs of gains. And I would like to get that 7cm housing on there and check that too. Everyone states that it does provide a noticeable gain so I wouldn't see why I wouldn't record that gain as well.

I agree, just changing the turbo to the E3 would be a cool thing to see as well, without any other changes except like you said, injectors/chip/tune or DSMlink finally.

I do have few and far between trips to the track, that's for sure. I would like to see big gains, who wouldn't, but, I've become used to knowing that I'm looking for that little bit every time I go. Hell, on Friday, I hadn't even nailed my shift points yet, I was too quick out of 2nd, then too late, got a bit better on the 11.62, and then was just getting down to business on the run that the turbo blew. That's why I posted the timeslips up, they tell the story pretty well. Five more passes and I might have been able to get back into the 11.40's, but that's mystery, so it ends there.

So, I'm gonna think about it this weekend and make a decision and just run with it. I have an extra 14b that I can rebuild and I've got the E3 sitting there, so I could really dabble in both......it's just a matter of what gets bolted back on the car first.......and I honestly think I'd be cheating myself if I didn't give the 14b another crack at it........

That sounds like a fun track day, with awesome results, as always. I would stick with the 14B, and go all out with it. Like you mentioned, there is plenty of power left on the table for you to have fun with. And, 14B's are not too hard to get hold of. Once you do all the mods and get all the power that you can from a 14B, you can use that same setup with a 16G and keep the power coming. Good luck, with whichever choice you go with. Keep us updated.

Edit*
That is right, as Nate has mentioned, you have brand new 16G. This makes the decision a bit harder, because we all love 14B's. In this special case, it would be more efficient for you to use what you already have available. You will pick up some major power with the swap, and it will not cost you more. Those 550cc injectors and an SAFC will take you pretty far on race gas.

It was good times Ok, so another vote for stick with the 14, check!

There is most definitely, more power, and more weight loss left for sure. And quite a bit of it....so it seems I really should try to take advantage.

As I stated above....not a brandy new E316g but still way newer than any 14b so that's why I would employ a rebuild and try that out.

I would think the 550cc and race gas would be fine with E3. I'm not going to pull the wastegate line and try to have the turbo spike into the stratosphere or anything. No 30-40 psi stuff. I'd set boost at 24-25 solid and I'm sure the car would make enough power like that to run some nice times. What do you think?

I vote 14b with 7cm turbine housing, then 16g.


I want to see real-world gains by swapping out the stock housing.

Check! Ok, I will most likely perform this test and get you some results, BUT, in order for this to really work properly, I would need to get another 14b on there with my existing 6cm ported housing, make passes, then go back to make passes AFTER swapping to the 7cm....don't you think? Because if I get a 14b freshly rebuilt and throw the 7cm housing on immediately, we won't know exactly if the gain came from the housing, the rebuild, or in part to each. Obviously, I'd want to throw that sucker right on there. But, to get the hard results I think you are after......may need to run my 6cm and the 7cm----on the same turbo..........

thoughts?

 

[JusMX141]

-local 420A DSM guru Bullett stopped over and we pulled the intake pipe, the nut that secures the compressor wheel to the shaft fell on the ground with a bit of oil, and there was the confirmation...it was now that we realized what the track worker handed me was the broken shaft that got spat out the exhaust.

Your car being a 1990 most likely had a right-hand threaded turbine shaft (part number ending in 01010 on the compressor cover). The right-hand threaded turbine was only used on 1990 models to my knowledge.

If you get a replacement 14B, make sure the part number on the cover ends in 01030 or 01410 so the turbine will be left-hand threaded and the nut will not fall off again from excessive boost!

 

[Phil1320]

Agreed

Phil thanks for the kind words. I've really enjoyed being a part of your "research" on the limits of the 14b on a stocker engine . Its always easier to see stuff with 2 sets of eyes on a run, instead of just one set (in the car).

Its also easier when I say something like "Try hitting that shift point at 100rpm higher" and then you go out and do exactly the same run but with that shift point right at 100rpm higher Giving input is one thing, but transfering it to the track so consistantly is the part that is difficult.

Yup, spring time, here we come......

MB

Of course man I've enjoyed it as well, and it's been great having you there. The help with getting to the track several times is still appreciated

Agreed on all counts. You've definitely helped me optimize the driving end of this gig, especially since we decided that the slicks were the choice for my set-up after the weekend of spinning all 4 through 1st and 2nd to 12.0's back in '07. We were right. What a difference.

And even though what happend, happend...I still gotta give

That little 14b got down to business in it's long life

So.....til 2011........

Your car being a 1990 most likely had a right-hand threaded turbine shaft (part number ending in 01010 on the compressor cover). The right-hand threaded turbine was only used on 1990 models to my knowledge.

If you get a replacement 14B, make sure the part number on the cover ends in 01030 or 01410 so the turbine will be left-hand threaded and the nut will not fall off again from excessive boost!

Excellent point Correct, just checked, my 14b has 01010 on the compressor cover.

The 14b that I have for replacement has 01030 on the comp. cover....so if you're dead on with your knowledge, then at least my replacement has a better design I suppose?

So, if this is exactly what happend, and it appears so as I said above, the threads look intact, I wonder when it started to back off? It's all a mystery now and no use I suppose to try to go any further with what did happen, just put my energy in to the future. I can't help but think that I might have been able to prevent it if I had pulled the intake and checked for shaft play or something. I'm pretty thorough with my checks of the car before each race. I even pull the fill plug to the transfer case just to make sure, even though the car sees no road use and I don't have a leaky transfer seal. It's all about that piece of mind I suppose.

Anyway, what's done is done. I've got a few friends trying to source a few more 14b's for me and I will make sure I don't attempt to use any with the 1990 spec. Thanks for the tip!

 

[habitatguy187]

Because if I get a 14b freshly rebuilt and throw the 7cm housing on immediately, we won't know exactly if the gain came from the housing, the rebuild, or in part to each. Obviously, I'd want to throw that sucker right on there. But, to get the hard results I think you are after......may need to run my 6cm and the 7cm----on the same turbo..........thoughts?

I agree, but at the same time I DOUBT that there was much left in the old 14b. I think you must have been running it near it's potential with the mph you were putting down.

If you would like to test it the real way I'm all for it, but if you're like me and don't like doing unnecessary work just to test an idea, then I'd just throw the 7cm the first time .

 

[rhamlinii]

Well I picked up another 91 1GA TSI AWD. I've been driving it for about two weeks now back and forth to work. I'm still going thru random parts I have around my house, but it will be a 14b car with a bone stock motor. This is what I gaithered so far.

Mods

Hks evc boost Controller


Act 2600 clutch
Act flywheel
2.25 upper intercooler pipe
1.75 turbo outlet pipe w/ all hard lower pipe


255 hp fuel pump w/rewire
aeromotive FPR @ 65 psi Base Fuel Pressure
Stock 450cc 2g Injecters

Evo3 exhaust manifold
7cm exhaust housing
3inch O2 oliminator w/ 46mm tial external gate routed back inside
3inch v-band full exhaust system
3inch cat


Stock intake pipe w/ hacked air can and k/N filter


Boost guage
egt gauge
PLX wide band


Still debating on keeping the v3 from the race car in this car for the time being, but it has an afc in it aswell. I'm pretty excited as this car is pretty much ready to go to the track. So far Dsmlink says the injecters are maxed out 27.6 pound of air and 100% duty cycle on pump gas @15 psi. FPR was set @40 PSI through THAT TUNNING session. I've since bumped up Fuel pressure as quoted and duty cycle is in the low 80's will 10.8 to 1 airfuel w/ 1 count of knock through out the 1st gear to 4th gear pull. Timing is a little lower then stock, but I havn't checked base timing. I'm not really concerned as I don't have a hight knock count and crusing egt seem normal. On race gas i'll see what she likes. Hoping for high 12s on pump, and low 12s on 104 unleaded race gas. This is just something I got to hold me over untill spring and my race car is ready. Already took out rear interior and panels, both headlight motors, and rear and front bumper supports. My girlfrends says the power steering stays so she can drive it, but the AC is gone. As is, it's not fast but it "quick" and pulls hard for a 14b.

On a side note, Phil go for an Evo 16g and or a 20g/bolt on turbo. Most fun turbo, and it gives you the bang for the buck. I put a t3 manifold and a big turbo on my race car and the maint. kills you. It really sucks to break and blow up high dollar shit. I TUNED MY CAR, so I own the mistake. I'm not sure how much the motor is hurt as it still runs. It just smokes, but compression is ok. My leak down in bad, and I was told the rings are gone. I've been plauged with issues with built motors and stock bottum-ends always lasted from my experience. I just dont want a time bomb w/ a 6765 on it. So I will go for another built motor will 11.1 compression this time around. I'm still chasing a 10second pass. 11.20@ 136 is the fastest i've been without spray. That was on stock tires w/ a 1.9 60ft. GOOD LUCK, with whatever you decide.

 

[bullettdsm]

Your car being a 1990 most likely had a right-hand threaded turbine shaft (part number ending in 01010 on the compressor cover). The right-hand threaded turbine was only used on 1990 models to my knowledge.

If you get a replacement 14B, make sure the part number on the cover ends in 01030 or 01410 so the turbine will be left-hand threaded and the nut will not fall off again from excessive boost!

Lol @ Justin showing off his knowledge. Get down with your bad self

MB

 

[SBstar]

Congrats and great to hear you got out to the track phil! I've been super busy with work and haven't been on much lately. Get another 14b on there, preferably a freshened one and that 7cm housing and lay down some more good stuff for us! Then throw those cams in as I'm still curious about those!

 

[Phil1320]

I agree, but at the same time I DOUBT that there was much left in the old 14b. I think you must have been running it near it's potential with the mph you were putting down.

If you would like to test it the real way I'm all for it, but if you're like me and don't like doing unnecessary work just to test an idea, then I'd just throw the 7cm the first time .

The trap speeds were decent with a best of 115.7 on Friday. About 1 mph shy of my best, which was in July '09. The car did exhibit some real inconsistencies in 1/8 mph vs. 1/4 mph starting last year. So, I would have to agree with Bullett and say that the turbo was probably starting to be an issue last year. I never tried to raise boost up to the 24-25 psi level that I have heard of some running, not sure it would gain me any mph and judging by how little AWHP was made going from 16 to 21 psi, I doubt there would be much gain if any at all.

Because of the limited access I have to getting to the strip, I will most likely toss the 7cm right on and just get what I can, while I can But, I really do like to see what every little change gives, or takes from the set-up. And, with how little is in the way in my car, a turbine housing swap is 15-20 minutes at the most, not including any draining or refilling of fluids. Nonetheless, time is everything for me lately, so, I will probably just cut to the chase.

 

[jjrock5]

I guess I may be stating something obvious (please don't flame ) but do you believe one can even come close to those numbers (11s) by having a 14b on a full weight 2g AWD with all supporting mods (fuel, V3, SMIM, FP mani, full but catted 3" exhaust, FMIC, stock tranny, stock 7 bolt etc.)?

I believe my car weighed ~3200 lbs (full tank of gas) without me in it.

You know, I keep thinking 11s is definitely impossible as I type this...