First drag race... not good

[MitzMadness]

Ya today was high school nationals and I thought I'd be running like a flat 15 or maybe a lil better but I ran 16.4 and 16.5. 16.5 was with a friend in the car. I have to say I very disappointed with this. my car is a auto 97 GSX my reaction time was .658 I have no clue if this is any good or not this was my first time drag racing.... I'm almost positive something is wrong with my car. Check my mod list (all up to date) I just think 16.5 is really really slow compared to what I should be running. I really don't think I have a boost leak , only saying this because it'll be the first thing someone says. I'm building 15 psi just fine. I'm not sure if ignition timing can have such a drastic affect on a car or not but I know as of when I first got the car which was back in October a friend hooked their ECU up to my car and it showed the "ignition timing I believe" to be jumping from 8 to 12 fairly radically. The car has always smelt like it was running rich since I've owned it. The car was unmodified and owned by an older lady. Tell me what you guys think, this is a big dilema to me.

 

[BigAirSkier1580]

Your R/T is good, but doesn't change your ET or speeds.

What was your 60ft, 1/8 et and MPH and 1/4 ET and MPH.

Also, what were the temps that day. Regardless, it doesn't sound right at all. Plugs fresh?

At the same time I'm not all familiar with the Auto's, but I know they are still quick.

 

[red4G63T]

Pressure test, you might have a boost leak.

 

[MitzMadness]

I did 16.5 at 84mph. It was about 65 degrees. I don't have 1/8 ET or 60ft. time because it printed them off as 0's on the timeslip. I changed the plugs and plug wires 3000 miles ago. And I still had the erratic ignition timing. I'll try a boost leak test, how bout compression test? I did notice when I changed the plugs that 2 of them had a little oil on them but I've changed the plugs 4 times over a period of 3000 miles and I have not seen oil on them ever again. I know the oil on the plugs cna mean bad piston rings but I figured maybe it was from somethign else since after 3000 miles the oil has not appeared again. Any ideas guys?

 

[Brits97TSI]

MitzMadness I feel your pain!!! I was up there too today for high school nationals. I have no idea what's going on with my car. I've put a nice amount of money into it.. and finally got the gauges and boost controller on for the race. Anyways here's the weird part.. last wednesday i ran a 15.45 WITHOUT the boost controller and gauge in (which I and everyone else was like WTF def. looking for some high 14's or something) Today.. i ran a 16.26 WITH my boost controller on set to 14.. I'm thinking I def. have a vacuum leak tho.. cuz when the boost was still at stock and the gauge was just put on it said i was pushing 17 PSi What do you guys think? Sorry I don't mean to steal your thread.. I'm thinking we have somewhat the same problem and this $hit is driving me CRAZY!

*Brittney

 

[Brits97TSI]

This was my first drag race also.. I have a '97 TSi FWD, automatic too.... I was powerbreaking the hell outta that car tho (new tranny.. no worries) trying to build boost. My little jr. dragster friend was the one running my car last wed .

 

[MitzMadness]

Brit what color was your car. I had the white GSX from Strongsville. Yes and people feel free to shout us ur opinions on whats wrong and what to check for.

 

[White97eclipse]

Well, if you ask me, it shouldnt be plugs or wires, because when its something like that.... you can def. feel the car bog out. . Even only with 7lbs on my rs... when my car bogs under boost,,,, i feel like im going to go through the windsheild... i would think maybe either vac leak.... or compression... those arent good times at all though... my buddy ran a 16.25 with a n/t so somethings going wrong.,.. but when its timing... its a violent loss of power... thats just my .02

 

[biglady112]

I'd be willing to bet it would be your automatic transmission. That is where the power is going. The torque converter is eating it all up. Intake and exhuast won't get you there. You get minimal gains on a T-25 with just those. And 14psi on the controller isn't much either. I bet you it isn't 14psi at redline. Watch your boost gauge when you get near red line. You might be surprised.

Don't be disappointed. Just tune and get it running the best you can. Then spend some more money.

Steven

 

[MitzMadness]

How can you make statements like this. There are plenty of auto's running better times with less mods than me, heck stock auto's should be running better times than I am. Somethign is definately wrong and with so few miles on my car I have a hard time believing I'm having a piston ring failure causing a loss in compression.

 

[Brits97TSI]

Ya.. plus not to mention like I said I was runnin a 15.45 5 days ago (which I still wasn't pleased with ). Mitz, my car was the burgundy '97 Talon... the one in desperate need of a paint job with a primered spoiler and black fender . I saw your car.. didn't see it run though, it was nice .. But also, I just got new plugs and wires (NGK plugs, Accel wires) my plugs are gapped at .50 (like the stupid Advanced Auto ppl told me to do) so the car could be running better and I need to regap them, but I was running that 15.45 with the plugs like this so that can't be the reason. My auto tranny was just rebuilt with a shift kit and new torque converter 1,000 miles ago so though it still may be slower than a manual... a 16.26 is a bit extreme don't you think? A 16.26 is slow for the stock, let alone a slightly modded car. My boost won't go to 17 even if I set my Greddy Profec B spec 2 to 17.. the peak boost recorded was 13.6. This is also with the walbro 255 and some 110 octane. I'm thinking it has to be a boost leak/vacuum leak so a boost leak test will be done sometime this week.. I just saw his post and realized we were at the same place with the same kinda problem and thought it was kinda funny and weird. If you guys have any other thoughts let me know pleeease! I hate dumping all this money into mods and having a car that's a second SLOWER than the stock car should be

*Brittney

 

[NewB2dsm]

Your R/T is good, but doesn't change your ET or speeds.

He is right that R/T does not change your et or speeds but as for good. It depends on what kind of tree you were running on. Probably a .500 tree where a .500 is a perfect r/t in which case your r/t was not bad. But i belive pro-tree's .000 is perfect in which case not so good r/t. But like i said i dont think it would be a pro-tree or even a .000 system.

pressure test the system post up the hole slip

 

[MitzMadness]

I already said I posted all the numbers that were recorded on the time slip... MY friend and stepdad both said my car looked like it crawled from the line then speed up pretty fast after the first 150 ft. or so. Oh and we were racing on a .500 tree. I figured my RT was pretty good considering the 2 guys I ran against had slower rt's by at least .100's. Also if I have a boost leak/ pressure leak will it make my car smell like its running rich, note I have not done any fuel mods? And can having my A/F ratio off even make my ignition timing want to hop around?

 

[White97eclipse]

You gota have a boost/vac leak.... you say the tranny and motor are good... no piston ring failure... and its not the auto tranny. there's no way a n/t can beat a 4g63t even if it is auto.... Check all your vac lines, ic lines... when i first put my turbo on my car, I didnt have my ic tightned down all the way, and my boost would only reach 3lbs... and my wastegate is set at 5.. and not only was it only three pounds,,, it HARDLY felt like three.. That might explain why your profec B wont get the 17lbs youre trying to accomplish. Again.,.. not trying to but in with my 420a-t knowlege,,, but hey... a turbo's a turbo... I say do a boost leak test!

 

[Brits97TSI]

Just got back from a day of tuning and looking over the car. There was a boost leak right off of the turbo.. some open T in an actuator line or something? Well anyways, capped that line off and now it's boosting up to 19.6, well that's all I've done. Obviously I won't be pushing that really ever on my little T 25 with only a walbro 255 to back it up.. but it's nice to see everything in working order. Let's hope for a better time this wednesday Hope you figure your problem out Mitz

*Brittney

 

[MitzMadness]

I'm gonna do the boost vaccum leak anyway but I have a hard time believing that's my problem only because I know I can build 15 psi.

 

[White97eclipse]

Ha ha ... Score one for the 420a-t guy
Thats awsome you got your car fixed up though! Def, post up the new numbers.. what are you dynoing at right now?

 

[Brits97TSI]

Ha ha ... Score one for the 420a-t guy
Thats awsome you got your car fixed up though! Def, post up the new numbers.. what are you dynoing at right now?

ya i'm verry happy about it i'll have new times tomorrow (hopefully better!) I have noo idea what it's at right now ... I was supposed to get the car dynoed sunday but that didn't work out.. I'll get to it eventually

*Brittney

 

[4pistons]

I have a hard time believing that's my problem only because I know I can build 15 psi.

Having a boost leak doesn't mean you have no boost. If you had a tire with a hole in it could you still inflate it? You sure could, if you can put air in faster than it's leaking out. But it's a hell of a lot harder! Same thing for your turbo.

If you're building 15 psi now and you do have a leak then the turbo is working harder, and heating the air more than it should. Your boost controller is set for 15 psi so no matter the size of the leak the turbo will spin until 15 psi is reached.

Rick - '91 GSX

 

[MitzMadness]

Thanks for clearing this up for me. So since I'm leaking metered air would this account for why the car is putting out a rich smell?

 

[CanadianTSi]

Thanks for clearing this up for me. So since I'm leaking metered air would this account for why the car is putting out a rich smell?

Yes, because the car is expecting more air to be entering the motor then there actually is(since it is leaking out) therefore it injects too much fuel.

 

[Brits97TSI]

not to go back to me i just posted earlier id post my times from tonight... I ran a 14.9.. not thrilled but def. better than a 16.26... umm it took 20 psi to get that 14.9 tho so obviously i do still have a prob. somewhere.. we're thinking boost test (still haven't done haha) and relocating my boost controller to a place nearer the turbo therefore cutting away A TON of extra vacuum line.. I mean you guys should see how much line I have.. very unneccessary..

*Brittney

 

[Waredtalontsi]

How are the cars being launched? Are they being powerbraked at the line atempting to build boost? For the person that had the spark plugs gap at .50 please regap the plugs between .28 threw .32. One more thing check if you can advance slightly your cam angle sensor. This does wonders on on my first gen, not really sure if you can do it to a second gen.

 

[MitzMadness]

Ya I was powerbraking at the line and yes my plugs are gapped at .28 I'm gonna run some tests on it tommarow.

 

[andymoraitis]

not to go back to me i just posted earlier id post my times from tonight... I ran a 14.9.. not thrilled but def. better than a 16.26... umm it took 20 psi to get that 14.9 tho so obviously i do still have a prob. somewhere.. we're thinking boost test (still haven't done haha) and relocating my boost controller to a place nearer the turbo therefore cutting away A TON of extra vacuum line.. I mean you guys should see how much line I have.. very unneccessary..

*Brittney

Brittney,

I was just looking at your profile and noticed you have a 255 pump on a little old T25 and stock injectors. Please tell me you have an AFPR to turn down the fuel pressure, because if not, you're overrunning your stock regulator and killing performance. The reason I ask is that I didn't see one in your profile. Truthfully, a 190 can take a 4G63 deep into the 12's or better so you may want to yank that sucker if you have no means to control it.

Nice times and all the best in getting them lower!

Andy