eliminating ABS [Merged 8-8] removing removal deleting delete take off

[OMN_DSM]

Has anyone here removed there ABS system from there car? I want to get rid of mine for 1. it doesn't even work properly, 2. wieght reduction 3. puts me more in control of the car.

I need to know what all is involved what parts I will need for the swap and any other info that may be useful. Thanks agian

Mike

 

[DaveT]

I removed my ABS from my car about a month ago. Pulled the ABS unit, proportioning valve, and 6 brakes lines (not the rear lines). For the most part, the removal is simple. Remove the ABS unit, remove the proportioning valve, and remove the brake lines (cut them if you have to, then they are easy to remove). Then you need a new non-ABS proportioning valve, and 4 non-ABS brake lines (2 from the master cylinder to the prop valve and 2 from prop valve to front brakes).

*** Note: Here in AZ, I could not get one of the brake lines for the master cylinder from the dealer. They said it was discontinued. I had to make my own brake line, easy though.

Put the brake lines in, take your time, they will fit, and then put the proportioning valve in. Bleed all 4 brakes and your done. Now sit back in amazement at how much space you have.

Don't need to do anything with the rotors/calipers/pads. Anyways, I think the rotors are different on ABS cars since a speed sensor is used for ABS.

DaveT
92GSX

 

[scotthidley]

Pull the fuse and the dash light bulb.

There is no need to do that. The abs control unit is in the picture below. It is the box rearward of the seat belt motor. It has a huge cable connected to it. I removed that, along with the g-force sensor that is located on the bracket where the rear seat belt buckles bolt to. I have never had that light come on since. On top of that, you get a minor weight savings as well. My light is still plugged in, and it doesn't go off when the pocket logger is plugged in either.

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

 

[DaveT]

Ok, I put this together when I was did my ABS to Non-ABS converstion. They discontinued making the Brake Master Cylinder Tube (closes to the rear firewall) so I had to make my own. Find out when your car was made and look through the list and find the part number. I may not have all the part numbers but most are there.

What you should do is go to the dealer and have them print out all the PN for a brake part off a 1G, then look through the list and find what matches your car (check if my list is correct) then order them. That is what I did. Tell them they don't need a VIN#, just the PN for the brake part (ABS and Non-ABS).

Left Front Brake Tube:
Manufacture dates from 3/1/89 to 5/3/93
MB534428

Right Front Brake Tube:
Manufacture dates from 6/2/90 to 6/3/92 (probably the
same dates as above but didn’t have that information)
MB857176

Brake Master Cylinder Primary Tube:
Manufacture dates from 3/1/89 to 5/3/93
MB534855
Manufacture dates from 6/1/93 to 5/1/94
MB618985

Brake Master Cylinder Secondary Tube:
Manufacture dates from 3/1/89 to 5/3/93
MB534856
Manufacture dates from 6/1/93 to 5/1/94
MB618984

Brake Fluid Proportioning Valve:
Manufacture dates from 3/1/89 to 6/1/90
MB534829
MB699649
Manufacture dates from 6/2/90 to 10/1/90
MB407576
MB699646
Manufacture dates from 10/2/90 to 6/3/92
MB699646
Manufacture dates from 7/1/92 to 5/3/93
MB895431
Manufacture dates from 6/1/93 to 5/1/94
MB895431


Hope this helps.

DaveT
92GSX

 

[Drivend]

Thanks Dave. This will help many, I'm sure, in their quest to rid themselves of ABS, and free up tons of underhood space. I lucked out. Today I visited one of my local junkyards and found a donor car. I got all four lines and the porportioning valve for $10. It took 30 minutes to pull and about 3 hours to yank out the old and replace the lines in my car. What a pain in the arse working around the CC and AC was. All I have left to do is bleed the master and the four corners. By what you posted, it appears that there are different porportioning valves for 1Gs. I wasn't aware of this. I wonder if I got the correct one. This should be made a sticky.

 

[bigfoot]

I'll be doing this soon, found the parts car today but I didn't have the line wrenches with me. I'd like to see some info on which proportioning valves do what. Maybe someone with some road racing experience will give it a shot. All I can say is stomp on it and see if the fronts lock up just before the rears. If I use the wrong valve it's gonna suck because I have to pull the intake to get to it.

Edit: found something. DSM Big Brakes INFO
Click on all the links from these posts. GalantVR-4.org: ABS Removal and Stainless Brake Line Install Evidently we need the prop valve from the 92.5-94 non ABS TELs with the big front brakes.

 

[scotthidley]

This is on the same page as well, I think it'd help to combine the topics or to make sure it isn't being discussed before starting a new one.

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=150412

 

[Ludachris]

What really needs to happen is to have someone write up a good "how-to" article in the Tech Article section so that it's stored on our site. Since I'm removing my ABS while the engine's pulled, maybe I can document it and tack on the part numbers as well.

 

[DaveT]

Well, it has already been done by Jim M. His writeup was extremely helpful. He was just missing the part numbers. And finding the correct part numbers is definitely a hassle and time consuming. Here is the link (can be found on VFAQ):

http://www.mckeone.net/abs.html

Are part numbers between E/T/L the same or are they different? If they are the same, than it would be great to link the above website with the part numbers in the tech section.

DaveT
92GSX

 

[HokieDSM]

Well, it has already been done by Jim M. His writeup was extremely helpful. He was just missing the part numbers. And finding the correct part numbers is definitely a hassle and time consuming. Here is the link (can be found on VFAQ):

http://www.mckeone.net/abs.html

You're right - it is a great writeup.... but it's missing the V in VFAQ - none of the pictures have worked in ages.

 

[scotthidley]

As of this spring, none of the hard brake lines were available for my car from the dealer. I ended up making my own, the needed parts can be found at a local auto parts store, along with the end former tool.

 

[Girvin]

Has anyone sourced the reason or differences between the non ABS proportioning valves? I plan on removing my ABS using my 90 fwd valve and lines on my 91AWd....?

 

[jtmcinder]

Cars with ABS usually split the front and rear lines inside the ABS unit. The prop valve on these cars only adjusts the rear pressures (by reducing them starting at some point), so two lines go in and two come out; the front lines do not go into the prop valve.

Cars without ABS split the front and rear line inside the prop valve. So two lines go in, but four come out.

What prop valves do is reduce rear line pressures when input pressure exceeds a certain point. This is done because, when you are braking hard, weight shifts forward, giving the front tires more grip and rears less. Without a prop valve, hard stops would always involve locking up the rears.

I bring this up because one thing that you can do to increase the braking performance of a car that has been lowered is to reduce the action of the prop valve. A lower car transfers less weight to the front during braking, so more pressure should be allowed to go to the rears. Put another way, when my car is up high on the winter suspension, my rears lock before my fronts. In the summer, with the car dropped about 1.5", the fronts always lock first.

- Jtoby

 

[bigfoot]

Thanks for the explaination jtmcinder. Would a car with 13" front brakes need a prop valve with LESS split? And this is why the 92.5-94 big brake cars changed to a 2500 lb split? This makes the rears do more braking because the 13" brakes would lock up the fronts otherwise. Please correct me if I'm wrong here.

BTW the car is lowered too.

DaveT, the pics worked for me.

Girvin, the different TEL prop valve splits are linked on post #6.

 

[jtmcinder]

There was a recent write-up in some mag (Sport Compact Car?) in which they found that cars with aftermarket big front brakes often have longer stopping distances. The reason was that which I alluded to: the brakes moved too much bias forward, so the car lost total braking power by losing the rears.

This is why you really want to work with someone like Todd at TCE (no, I don't work for Todd and we even frequently argue). If you insist, he'll sell you anything you ask for, but if you ask, he'll work with you to make the car stop faster. Sometimes the solution is as simple as correct pad selection (e.g., upping the mu of the rears); sometimes it is more complicated. But you really want to work with someone on this and not just slap on some kit off the internet or you might end up doing what they did to the cars in that magazine article ... spending money to make the car less good.

- Jtoby

 

[scotthidley]

That's an over rated statement if you're all wheel drive. When I originally installed my baer's, I still had the stock rears (60-70k or so on the car at the time), I also had a quaife center diff. I was doing about 50 when a car tried turning in front of me. The baers managed to easily lock all 4 up. The car still had abs at this time, however the fuse was pulled, so it wasn't working, but the prop valve,... were still the same.

Now with a regular center diff, and new pads all around (porterfield r4s's in back, hawk hp plusses in the front), I can still easily lock the rears. Stopping power is very strong in the car. This setup with with the non-abs prop valve, along with the non-abs master cylinder (which isn't a necessary swap).

So basically, since the car's all wheel drive, the fronts can still give stopping power to the rears (the clutch dissengages from the engine, not the drivetrain). You have to take magazine articles loosely, as they're often written with an advertiser in mind. Some of the ideas are valid, but if the fronts bias too much, a better pad in the rear could make up for it. There's multiple ways to fix that problem (the best would be an adjustable prop valve,...).

 

[quiksilver38]

instead of ripping all the stuff out cant you just take out the ABS fuse in the fuse box like in die hard 3?

 

[screamineagle]

i want to remove my abs out of my 93 Talon AWD and don't know if i should order the parts from the dealer or if i should pull them from the junkyard. If there cheap (under 50 bucks) i'd get thme from the dealer but if not then i guess i'll spend some time at the junkyard carefully pulling them out with i would rather not do. So anyone that has done it and purchased the parts from the dealer how much did you end up spending. Oh, i know the porportioning valve is expensive so i'll probably pick that up from the junkyard but the prices of the lines is what i'm really after.

 

[EclipseTenzoR]

Can't you just pull a fuse to the ABS system that way it doesn't automatically function when there is wheel slippage?

 

[EclipseTenzoR]

instead of ripping all the stuff out cant u just take out the ABS fuse in the fuse box like in die hard 3?

Die Hard 3 comes to mind when ever I read a post like this. The simplest answer

 

[screamineagle]

I do not only want to disable it but i also want to totally remove it for the weight savings and the room gained from removing the abs unit itself from the engine bay. I the battery is moved to the back and i'll be making my own intercooler piping soon (short route), i'll have a nice straight pipe going straight down once all that room is freed up.

 

[Blizz92tsi]

Arctic tsi did this and I believe he has part numbers on his website. www.arctic-racing.com You might check that out and if it doesn't have enough info give him an e-mail.

 

[Sean485]

All you need are the brake line brackets, front brake lines to the proportioning valve, the lines from the valve to the master cylinder and the proportioning valve itself. I would grab them off a car in the boneyard, but be aware it will be a total PITA to do if the engine is in the car.

 

[ArcticTsi]

Listed below are all the required parts & part numbers:

Proportioning valve(non-ABS):

MB699-645 caps# 55876 $42.58

Master cylinder to proportioning valve lines:

MB534-426 caps# 56256B $4.52

MB500-561 caps# 56255B $4.88

Front brake lines to proportioning valve:

MB857-176 caps# 56267R (passenger side) $3.60

MB534-428 caps# 56267L (driver side) $5.15

Total Cost of Brand new OEM parts $60.73

22-23lbs of weight savings to be had with this mod.

Jose
ArcticTsi

 

[screamineagle]

Artic one more question for you if you can answer it regarding all the wiring going along with the abs. did you pull the computer and the whole harness that attaches to it? is there no problem doing this? Did you get an abs light?

 

[Sean485]

I removed the ABS computer and all the wiring for it, no problems here. Just removing the ABS computer would be the easiest way to avoid an ABS light problem, but if your bored like I was seperating out the abs wires from the rest of the harness isn't hard, just time consuming