2G AWD Conversion/Swap Guys Enter Here - Advanced. [Merged 2-07]

[nuclearr]

So which diagram is the correct Diagram for the level wiring? I have seen two but do not know wich one is correct I used 99GST's digam.

At first I had 1/2 full and some slight movement then it would go to E. Now it does not work at all. I am looking at Peepers digram and woundering if that one is correct. I saw some one posted about losing contact on the senders that may be my issue but untill I run down the gas (full tank), I can not do that.

Edit I do have the 2 pin second sender so Peepers diagram is out.

 

[DashLaflash]

Does anybody know the length of the rear AWD subframe mounting bolts? The long ones.

 

[v8s_are_slow]

Are you guys talking about the (4) Bolts that hold the rear subframe in place?

You dont have to do any guessing around really, the holes for the front (2) bolts are already there, you just have to cut a piece of metal under the rear seats to get to them

Here's some pics to help along

Here's where the fronts are

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The Rears

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Holy crap man, that's exactly what I DON'T wanna do. That thing looks pretty hacked up there. This thing isn't a show car by any means but still, I wanna keep all installation work looking as clean as possible.

One thing I'm wondering is, can ya put on a nut on the end of the bolt (to keep from messing up the threads on the end of the bolt) and then hit it hard with a hammer in the upwards direction to make it hit the metal so that it leaves an indention so you know EXACTLY where to cut? Understand what I'm saying? I wanna cut as little as I possibly have to. Prefer none at all, but sure I can't have my cake and eat it too on this one.

 

[99gst_racer]

Holy crap man, that's exactly what I DON'T wanna do. That thing looks pretty hacked up there. This thing isn't a show car by any means but still, I wanna keep all installation work looking as clean as possible.

One thing I'm wondering is, can ya put on a nut on the end of the bolt (to keep from messing up the threads on the end of the bolt) and then hit it hard with a hammer in the upwards direction to make it hit the metal so that it leaves an indention so you know EXACTLY where to cut? Understand what I'm saying? I wanna cut as little as I possibly have to. Prefer none at all, but sure I can't have my cake and eat it too on this one.

No, that won't work. The head of the bolt is very large, and it's underneath two layers of metal. You can't hit it hard enough to make any kind of visible indent.

But don't worry about it looking bad. It's all completely covered up when the hatch area is reassembled. And if you're really anal about how it looks, you could always weld it shut, grind it down, body filler, sand, sand, sand, and paint the area to completely hide the fact that it was once cut into.

 

[DSM_PWR]

Holy crap man, that's exactly what I DON'T wanna do. That thing looks pretty hacked up there. This thing isn't a show car by any means but still, I wanna keep all installation work looking as clean as possible.

Its actually not THAT hacked up like your making it seem...

Maybe its the fact that all the interior is removed thats giving you the impression...

My car is actually going to be a show car and im extremely anal about my car/build... however those cuts i made wont faze me or keep my up all night tossing and turning

 

[gofer]

The less welding I had to do the better, so this was my solution and its been 2yrs with lots of hard launching and 20k miles and no issues thus far.

Finding the EXACT location of where I needed to cut from the top, I used a long philips and a hammer to punch up from the bottom.

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Once I marked all the holes I crawled inside the car and used a whole-saw to cut over where I needed to drop the bolts into their respective holes.

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Like I said, I'm not a welder, so this was my solution to the rear subframe bolts. I went to Home Depot with the AWD bolts and found some grade 12's (and hardware) that matched them in length. I also got them long enough to "double nut" them to make sure they held, using loctite on the threads as well.

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[v8s_are_slow]

That's exactly what I wanna do. But concerned about the bolts that have to be removed and locating them so I can make the smallest cut possible and do it right the 1st time. I don't have my rear carpet and all that in my car

I dunno DSM_PWR, maybe I need to see the aftershot of this. Lol.

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[99gst_racer]

The cutting can be as clean or as ugly as you want. Here's a few pics of when I did it:

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[DSM_PWR]

I dunno DSM_PWR, maybe I need to see the aftershot of this. Lol.

Ill be happy to take an after shot next time i head over to the shop...

But it sounds like your better off just skipping the AWD Conversion, selling your car, buying a GSX/AWD TSI since you feel that this is sooo hacked up

Wait till you have to weld up the driveshaft loops

 

[v8s_are_slow]

I'm not. I'm going with a single piece, carbon fiber driveshaft. So there. Lol.

 

[skatershawn]

DSM_PWR's car is pretty legit!!

ive seen it first hand!

 

[DashLaflash]

The cutting is really not that bad you can easily grind down the welds and bondo it. No one will ever know it happened. Also I don't see much welding needed here. You only have to put a couple tack welds on the new bolts to keep them from spinning and then welding up the holes you cut. If you guys can't weld or don't have a welder you can bolt down the subframe and then drive it to a shop and have them weld up the holes.

Hey gofer you didn't happen to write down the length of the rear AWD bolts did you?

 

[gofer]

Hey gofer you didn't happen to write down the length of the rear AWD bolts did you?

I don't have it written down or memorized but I do have a set of the GSX rear subframe bolts in the garage I can measure for you. Give me until tomorrow to do it, I'm at work right now so its not as easy as walking out to the garage with a ruler.

 

[gofer]

The long ones are 5.5" from the bottom of the bolt head to the tip and the short ones are 4" from the bottom of the bolt head to the tip.

 

[DashLaflash]

Awesome thanks Gofer! It must have killed you inside to cut into such a clean car.

 

[v8s_are_slow]

Okay, I started this today. The FWD is out but still have to drop the tank. I don't have my AWD parts with me at the moment but I should have them tomorrow. One thing I've done so far is to take the 4 bolts out of the rear that holds on the wheel bearing and parking brake assembly. I'm hoping I can bolt it back up to the AWD rearend so that I don't have to disconnect the parking brake cables. And I have Megan Racing springs so that I can use them with the AWD rearend as well. So far, everything has been simple simple.....but I'm not done yet.

 

[gofer]

You're making it WAY harder then it needs to be... Drop the ENTIRE rear subframe suspension and all (including the e-brake cables, then bolt the entire rear AWD subframe up...

You've got the (4) rear subframe bolts, (2) upper control arm bolts on each side, (2) shock mount bolts on each side, (1) lower control arm bolt on each side, and then slide the ebrake cables out of the interior and pull the hole damn thing out from under the car. Then reverse the install of the rear AWD subframe, I even had the rear end bolted in there...

Maybe I'm reading your post wrong? You need to run the AWD ebrake cables anyway since they are longer.

 

[v8s_are_slow]

You're making it WAY harder then it needs to be... Drop the ENTIRE rear subframe suspension and all (including the e-brake cables, then bolt the entire rear AWD subframe up...

You've got the (4) rear subframe bolts, (2) upper control arm bolts on each side, (2) shock mount bolts on each side, (1) lower control arm bolt on each side, and then slide the ebrake cables out of the interior and pull the hole damn thing out from under the car. Then reverse the install of the rear AWD subframe, I even had the rear end bolted in there...

Maybe I'm reading your post wrong? You need to run the AWD ebrake cables anyway since they are longer.

Are you 100% sure that the cables are longer? I don't personally see why they would be since the awd cables would be going to the same wheel and it's not like the wheels are being moved back any. I'll have to verify this tomorrow when I pick up my rear assembly from my parents.

 

[Gstclipse69]

Yes the e-brake cables are longer. I don't know why but they are by a couple inches.

 

[v8s_are_slow]

If it's only a couple of inches, i'd figure it would reach if maybe some of the clamps holding them down are undone. Eh, I'll take a look and post pics if needed.

 

[v8s_are_slow]

Okay, I have the rearend here at school with me now and at 1st glance, it looks like some of the things will swap over easily enough. I'll post the pics I took a little later on some of the things I saw and found out. The awd knuckles and fwd knuckles "look" the same. The fwd knuckle looks like you'd be able to knock out the rear cover that goes behind the bearing and then just slide the axle through it. Buuut, you can't. The bolt pattern and bearing itself, as well as the bolt patter on the dust cover behind the rear rotors is a different pattern and the hole for the bearing is wider on the fwd. You'll see what I mean when I post the pics. But you HAVE to use the awd knuckles.

Someone's probably wondering why I'd even bother doing all this crap. Well, the rearend has been sitting out in the rain for awhile, and also, the e-brake cables were cut on the awd rearend. So I was just gonna swap the knuckles as an entire assembly, and just hook up the fwd e-brake cables. I'm still gonna see if I can keep my cables though. Right now, they "look" almost the same. But I won't know for sure until I get the rearend mounted up so I can see. Sure I'll be having to swap them anyway, but I wanna know for myself.

Aside from that, my only major concern on this entire swap is the fuel tank wiring. The 98 fwd gas tank has a bunch of tubes coming off the rear of the tank (guessing for the charcoal canister???) whereas the 95 awd tank doesn't have anywhere near all the same crap. So not sure what I'm suppose to do with all the hoses yet, and have to make sure I get all the wiring done correctly. Fun stuff. Yay. I'll post pics as soon as possible.

Alrighty, I have the pictures now. At the moment, the biggest hurdle for me is the stupid gas tank. I'm not sure how to hook up the hoses right now and I'm stuck.

Here's the 2 gas tanks, side by side. The fwd on the left, awd on the right.

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Now what hoses go where? There's 4 hoses and only 3 places on the back of the awd tank to put them on. Notice I have the charcoal canister taken off as well. Guessing the piece on the left is the charcoal canister?

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Okay, this is the filler tube. There's a canister attached to it. Is this the charcoal canister or the other piece that has a bunch of hoses on it? Either way, still not sure how to hook 4 hoses up to the tank that only has 3 hose fittings to hookup to.

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Filler tube

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Here's the 2 rearend's.

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And you can see the bolt pattern difference, and bearing difference showing why you can't use the fwd knuckles on the awd.

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[gofer]

I thought you were asking about how its mounted up into the rear end of the car. Thats emissions stuff from the late '98+ DSM's, you'll have to get the charcoal canister, etc. from a '95-'97 DSM if you want to retain all the emissions stuff.

All you need to retain from your old gas tank is the filler neck, it looks like all the other rubber hoses are mounted on the AWD tank.

 

[v8s_are_slow]

Emissions? What's that? Lol.

Nah, I wanna delete all that stuff but can I delete that canister on the side of the fill tube? And if I do, I'll only have 2 hoses, and then 3 fittings on the tank.

 

[gofer]

Sounds about right to me...

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[johnmarines]

Okay guys I am having a issue with my awd conversion. My install went pretty well. No major issues which was great. The only problem is my pass side front axle. For some reason it keeps ripping my boots in half at the cup that goes into the trans. It seems there is about an inch of travel, so its stretching the boot till it rips when I make a turn. I even had the axle pop out of the cup. Im at a loss at the moment of what to do. I replaced the lower control arm because I thought maybe it was bent.. no go. I removed the lower lateral arm to see if that was the cause..didnt work. Then I proceeded to remove the uppr control arm to see if it would line back up but that didnt work either. I checked all my mounts to verified they were tight. Im auto so Im not sure if that matters. I tried 2 different axles with the same results. Can anyone help me out on this?