anyone else have lower honeycomb problems? [Merged 10-6]

[wishIhadaturbo]

I can't be the first person that has done this. I busted out both honeycombs in my MAF. Does anybody sell replacements ? Or have an idea about what I should do. The car is idleing very rough now and misses whenever I am not accelerating.

Will

 

[wolf20043]

ok, the cruise controll works fine...no adjusting there. thanks for the help

Just trying to help
Mike

 

[DataStream18]

I have a 93 Eagle Talon TSi FWD. As it says in the title, my lower honeycomb MAF is partially destroyed. As in, not good looking. I have heard about this MAF Translator and i hear great things. Any one know or have a link to tell me what parts are needed to hook it up or how to use it? I've seen pis of people running a tube right up to the turbo to the filter, that is what i want to do, i just don’t know exactly how. I am good with wiring and stuff like that so that’s not what I’m worried about. Any help would be awesome.

Thanks
Phill

 

[DSMcamaro]

*edit* read this first
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=174055

you will need-
a MAFT
a new UICP
a 3" or 3 1/2" GM MAF
2 couplers
clamps
aftermarket air filter
CAI/custom piping

how to install
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=99455&highlight=MAFT

how to tune
http://www.fullthrottletech.com/showthread.php?t=105

where to buy(1 of many places)
http://www.slowboyracing.com/more.php?id=5134&

oh yea, dont forget to search.
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=215327&highlight=MAFT
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=215599&highlight=MAFT
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=100275&highlight=MAFT

to save money, I would just go get a GM MAF from a junkyard ($30-45) usually.

 

[exiletalon]

a GM MAF is a great upgrade but is pretty involved- the 2G MAS is a great upgrade for 1G and are fairly easy/cheap to find- look here in the classifieds.
if you want to go all out, then go ahead and do the GM MAF- it is a great product

 

[xcelr8n]

a GM MAF is a great upgrade but is pretty involved- the 2G MAS is a great upgrade for 1G and are fairly easy/cheap to find- look here in the classifieds.
if you want to go all out, then go ahead and do the GM MAF- it is a great product

It is IMO that installing a 1g MAF-T in his car along with a GM MAF is less "involved" than installing a 2G MAF, especially since with the 2GMAF he now needs fuel control/ecu chip/550cc injectors etc..

 

[DataStream18]

Ok what is the difference between "draw thru" and "blow thru?" Also can you explain some terms for me: UICP, the difference between a MAF-T and a MAF, and IMO. How much Piping is needed? I am sorry for all the questions.

Also what is the advantage of this? Im using the car as a dailey driver and maybe a race or two at the street light.

Im thinking of getting the "Big 16T" turbo as well, what do i need if i get that aside from gaskets?

Phill

 

[DSMcamaro]

Ok what is the difference between "draw thru" and "blow thru?" Also can you explain some terms for me: UICP, the difference between a MAF-T and a MAF, and IMO. How much Piping is needed? I am sorry for all the questions.

Also what is the advantage of this? Im using the car as a dailey driver and maybe a race or two at the street light.

Im thinking of getting the "Big 16T" turbo as well, what do i need if i get that aside from gaskets?

Phill

wow dude, i'm pretty sure I overdid myself in my first post. You should know the differnce between blowthur and draw thur by reading the first link I posted. everything else could be <b>FOUND BY A SIMPLE SEARCH!!!!</b> check out the VFAQ, spend the next couple day reading it before asking more questions.

http://www.vfaq.com/index-main.html
UICP=upper intercooler pipe
MAFT =mass air flow translator
maf/mas=mass air flow sensor

btw-did you even look at my first post?!

 

[hanster24]

ok, i'm gonna try to run my car with out the honeycombs in the MAF "Mass Air flow", i just got a injen intake pipe "from the MAF to the Turbo, stock t25", i was reading about this, and some say it could cause knock! and the turbo would sound louder!

if the car is at idle, would it act weird, or would it act weird at any rang or rpms?
i dont want to hurt the engine, but if the MAFS sees too much air comming in, wont it only alow some of it into the engine, but i'll get more air into my turbo

 

[FORMONTOYA]

On a stock setup DO NOT remove honeycombs from the MAS. It WILL effect the way the car idles specifically and it does not help you while driving either. If you had some way to control the A/F you could get away with it.

http://dsmtuners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=178638&highlight=hacked+mas


Jim

 

[95blackGsTurbo]

**EDIT** Beat me to it I guess

 

[hanster24]

so i if i get like a Apexi S-AFC i can run my car with out the restrictors?
how much more air do u get when you removed them?

 

[larsenracing]

I ran with out some of them with no problem i just left the one that is in the port that runs by the sensors and it was fine, But every car is different.

 

[larsenracing]

Yes with an s-afc you should be fine but it will need to be tuned properly like by getting a logger and a wideband and/or dyno tune.

 

[95blackGsTurbo]

You can do it but like said above leave the one in that is infront of the resistor.

 

[hanster24]

does the MAS detect more air, more flow?

if I'm stopped, in nutral, rpms are at ~500, there is x amount of air going in, if I'm on the freeway, @ 60mhp, and i put it in nutral rpms are at ~500 and the speed is 60, there is more air being forced into the intake "Stock" than when im stoped? right? but the MAS still gives the car the reading for the how much air is going in at all times, so how does it make a diffrence if the restrictors are not in place "all of them out" when im stoped or moving?

 

[hanster24]

never mind, i was reading the post from http://dsmtuners.com/forums/showthre...ght=hacked+mas

thanx

 

[steve]

so i if i get like a Apexi S-AFC i can run my car with out the restrictors?
how much more air do u get when you removed them?

If you had a SAFC there would be no need to remove the honeycombs. you could just lean the car out with the SAFC rather than doing a halfassed job by removing them.

2G MAFs work best if you leave them alone. If you start overruning them it's time for a 3G/EVO8 MAF or a MAFT

Steve

 

[bane3d]

does the MAS detect more air, more flow?

if I'm stopped, in nutral, rpms are at ~500, there is x amount of air going in, if I'm on the freeway, @ 60mhp, and i put it in nutral rpms are at ~500 and the speed is 60, there is more air being forced into the intake "Stock" than when im stoped? right? but the MAS still gives the car the reading for the how much air is going in at all times, so how does it make a diffrence if the restrictors are not in place "all of them out" when im stoped or moving?

You need to go here before you do anything else to your car. Read everything.

http://members.shaw.ca/costall/1000Q/

What is a MAS honeycomb?
This refers to a thin, gold-colored grille material located at the front of the mass airflow sensor (MAS). Its raison d'etre is to 'straighten' out the incoming airflow into the MAS. This is a requirement of the Karmaan vortex airflow sensor used in the MAS. The upper portion of the honeycomb affects the measured air, while the lower portion affects bypass air - air that is not measured by the MAS.

Removing the lower portion of this honeycomb-like material can sometimes help delay fuel cut on 1G DSMs, by adding a few percent more unmetered air into the air/fuel mixture. Some owners, however, complain the mod makes their engine run rougher - the current theory is that the turbulet lower airflow somehow affects the non-turbulent upper airflow where the two flows meet.

Please note that under no circumstances can all of the honeycomb material be removed from the MAS. Doing this will screw up your idle huge, as the MAS airflow measurement gets all screwed up. Only the lower portion may be removed, and generally only on 1G cars.

2G owners often find out they can't remove any of the honeycomb material. Fortunately, since the 2G MAS flows a lot more air than the 1G MAS, the honeycombs should be considered far less of a concern.

See the FAQ Locator (look in the "Intake" section) and Jim McKenna's MAS modification page for more information. For those interested in the entire MAS sensor assembly, please read Mike Jackson's DSM MAF Theories Page.

 

[FRIZZLE]

If i were you i would replace the honeycombs in the MAF and run a S-AFC.

 

[Wickedracer84]

hey i was just wonder in there any honey combs that i can take out to make my car run leaner without causing my car to stumble at idle?
i will be using my pocket logger to monitor what happens

 

[steve]

Please just leave them alone.
Install the SAFC and lean the car out.

Steve

 

[dsm-onster]

What's the cliche around here? "Steve knows best"

Listen to him. Don't hack the 2g maf. Most people hack it to run leaner and/or run bigger injectors cheaply. But the volume flow measurement is not consistantly reduced in the same percentage through out the hertz range once any maf is hacked... Thus you are introducing an inconsistant variable in the mix. Do it right. Get a piggly-back or DSMLink. Or at least an SAFC.

 

[steve]

Ha Ha.
His profile says he has a SAFC but it's not installed. I'd guess it's time to install it.

Steve

 

[Wickedracer84]

Ha Ha.
His profile says he has a SAFC but it's not installed. I'd guess it's time to install it.

Steve

yeah its just sitting in my back seat of my car

 

[nightracer91]

I recently posted about me putting in my new intake pipe (3" Dejon Tool) and I mentioned about opening up the flow through the MAF, removed silencer in rear and lower honeycomb. What is the lower honeycomb even for? Some guy said his ran so lean it would die at idle. My GST seems to run better at idle. There seemed to be a tiny argument about "hacking" MAF. What are the facts about "hacking" the MAF?