Roll Call October 2007 420a

[Slippi84]

Dude my own motor is more worked out then yours. I have 8:8:1 compression(8:6:1 according to Howell). Fully ported and polished head. Stroker with long rods. Ported and polished and knife edged intake manifold. SS oversized valves w/ PT cruiser lifters and rockers. Mopar studs and MLS gasket. Crange turbo cams, forged built motor. Blutcxh, flywheel, UDP, adjustable cam gears (haven't even touched those yet) intake, exhaust, plugs, wires, etc. This was all before the turbo came. Believe me I was beating GS-T's with that motor so I understand where you are coming from. You should add a turbo in the mix it really changes things.

One thing I don't understand out of this whole equation, is why you chose such low compression for a n/a HP goal. Was this your plan the whole time? Because higher compression is the only thing keeping you from that goal. By saying Mark has less power because you are using lower comp isn't really valid. It's part of the build, for more efficient power putting motor you would want higher compression from the get go.

Again, he's also without nitrous. So by you adding nitrous in your HP goal isn't fair. Granted, 300whp N/a is nice, but you don't have 300 HP n/a. Last time I checked nitrous was a forced induction, meaning it's not part of the HP equation (for n/a applications). Thus the specification of w/ nitrous or w/out nitrous in dyno runs. Because it changes things significantly. It's easy power though! haha..

Dyno sheets would still be cool.

I am not gonna take this away from the ACTUAL point of this which is to see what people are running all motor nitrous or turbo but I find this post kinda pointless and missguided and in some parts just flat out wrong. The ONLY thing I can see that you have that he doesn't that would make any kind of diffrence is long rods and a stroker crank where it seems to me that he has only a stroker crank. Even with that it doesn't make you more worked just diffrent parts. You both have built heads cams/gears forged bottom ends crnak and all and all the other goodies(actually he did tb work I"m not sure if you have that or not but that would tech make him more worked then you not that it matters.) The point of his post was to show people you can't just have a built engine with no supporting or minor mods and benefit from lowering compression otherwise you will just feel sluggish. That and his compression to power comparison is just to show that while bullet had more hp it's more do to his tune and compression then it is do to lack of mods on Kazoos side.

Anyway everyone seems to have nice setups comparing anything other then 1/4 times or top speed is pointless in my book anyway. Lets just apprciate it for what it is wait till he gets some dyno runns and ask him how he did whatever he did rather than saying what he can't or won't or isn't doing just my .02

WHere the other nitrous guys I don't see many guys going the built engine with nitrous route?

 

[95TalonOwner]

Here is my setup, stage I hahn kit with a custom intercooler setup from one of my old 1g side mounts. I should be going howell 2.2 stroker this winter. As of right now I am running a completely stock motor with 168,000 miles on it. I'm just hoping it lasts me until this winter when I tear it down.

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[Dark DSM]

Mine is pretty much the "usual" rebuild,

8.8 comp JE's
Eagle H-beams
Cometic Head gasket
"Entire"! engine ARP studded
PEP valves, Slight porting work
Crower stage 3 cams
OBX intake
880CC 4G63 injectors (w/ resistor pack)
OBX fuel rail, and all SS braided lines
Vortech FMU 1:1, Aeromotive FPR
Walbro 255
Apex AFC Neo
57 trim T3-T4 turbo, Custom manifold,
24x29x3" FMIC, and 3" piping
HKS SS BOV
Modern Performance 60mm TB
Stage 3 Spec Clutch
Rear brake drum-disc conversion
18" Motegi DP10 rims w/ 225-40-18 Bridgestone S-03 pole position tires

More than likely other things that i cant thing of, but heres a few pictures, none of with are up to date yet. Just dont "DIS" the manifold, cause its not done yet, still needs tweeking!

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[Slippi84]

Mine is pretty much the "usual" rebuild,

8.8 comp JE's
Eagle H-beams
Cometic Head gasket
"Entire"! engine ARP studded
PEP valves, Slight porting work
Crower stage 3 cams
OBX intake
880CC 4G63 injectors (w/ resistor pack)
OBX fuel rail, and all SS braided lines
Vortech FMU 1:1, Aeromotive FPR
Walbro 255
Apex AFC Neo
57 trim T3-T4 turbo, Custom manifold,
24x29x3" FMIC, and 3" piping
HKS SS BOV
Modern Performance 60mm TB
Stage 3 Spec Clutch
Rear brake drum-disc conversion
18" Motegi DP10 rims w/ 225-40-18 Bridgestone S-03 pole position tires

More than likely other things that i cant thing of, but heres a few pictures, none of with are up to date yet. Just dont "DIS" the manifold, cause its not done yet, still needs tweeking!

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At first when you said don't diss the manifold I was like the obx is fine you just gotta mod it a little...Then I saw you exhaust manifold and said OH o

 

[cs82685]

Mine is pretty much the "usual" rebuild,

8.8 comp JE's
Eagle H-beams
Cometic Head gasket
"Entire"! engine ARP studded
PEP valves, Slight porting work
Crower stage 3 cams
OBX intake
880CC 4G63 injectors (w/ resistor pack)
OBX fuel rail, and all SS braided lines
Vortech FMU 1:1, Aeromotive FPR
Walbro 255
Apex AFC Neo
57 trim T3-T4 turbo, Custom manifold,
24x29x3" FMIC, and 3" piping
HKS SS BOV
Modern Performance 60mm TB
Stage 3 Spec Clutch
Rear brake drum-disc conversion
18" Motegi DP10 rims w/ 225-40-18 Bridgestone S-03 pole position tires

More than likely other things that i cant thing of, but heres a few pictures, none of with are up to date yet. Just dont "DIS" the manifold, cause its not done yet, still needs tweeking!

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Kinda off topic, but what do you plan on using to control fuel with those injectors and the 1:1? MS?

Also wtf is up with that front bumper it looks like it's shaped to fit some weird ass headlights.

Finally, please god get rid of the wing and the tail lights.

 

[Dark DSM]

ya see i knew some dumbass would start saying stupid things, first off this is MY car not yours, damn its not even finished yet, i dont even have paint on it, so hold off on the stupid comments. Two dont worry about how im going to control the injectors, i dont need MS, its not that hard. Believe me it looks a lot better in person, and two the wing serves a purpose, its gonna keep the extremely light ass end on the ground. I didnt buy it just for looks. Now as far as the injectors go, the Neo does some controling, but not all, thats why im also using a FPR to keep an idle pressure just where i need it, and with how big they are all i need is the 1:1 FMU, and i doubt im missin something, and if i am besides tweeking it constantly, please advise and dont criticize. Like i said it still doesnt run and i dont know whats its gonna do yet......

Oh and about the headlights, if you look at some late 2G's you will see the bumper bunch up in the center section like they do, but being the bumper on mine now is fiberglass, it still needs a little tweeking. Its nothing new.

 

[Slippi84]

ya see i knew some dumbass would start saying stupid things, first off this is MY car not yours, damn its not even finished yet, i dont even have paint on it, so hold off on the stupid comments. Two dont worry about how im going to control the injectors, i dont need MS, its not that hard. Believe me it looks a lot better in person, and two the wing serves a purpose, its gonna keep the extremely light ass end on the ground. I didnt buy it just for looks. Now as far as the injectors go, the Neo does some controling, but not all, thats why im also using a FPR to keep an idle pressure just where i need it, and with how big they are all i need is the 1:1 FMU, and i doubt im missin something, and if i am besides tweeking it constantly, please advise and dont criticize. Like i said it still doesnt run and i dont know whats its gonna do yet......

Oh and about the headlights, if you look at some late 2G's you will see the bumper bunch up in the center section like they do, but being the bumper on mine now is fiberglass, it still needs a little tweeking. Its nothing new.

He asked about the injectors because 880s is out of a safc's range of tunability ever with afpr and even if you did lower base fuel pressure low enough you would have to make it too low which is a whole nother issue. All that work and money I would just go with a portfueler but like you said your car just trying to give you a heads up. Anyway I hope you didn't take my last post offensive I know I couldn't even weld that good . Good luck with your setup the molded kit looks good just curious you doing side skirts or no?

 

[Dark DSM]

no offensive, i just dont like when someone tells me something that "i have to do" according to them. I do appreciate the info on the fueling, im gonna try my setup first and "play with it" cause MAYBE i can make it work, or maybe not. I want to give it a shot, then ill change it. Thats why i want the experience, and yes side skirts will be there eventually just a little tight on $$$ right now, just like alot of us.... By the way imagine the tail lights and wing with a black paint job, with a slight "pearl" in the clear coat, but only to were you see it in the sun. So actually there is more to it than you think. But yes the wing is serving a purpose, i wasnt sure about it at first but in my image of what i want the car to look like, its only appropriate and it fits. Please note im still far from finished, part money, but mostly "creativity", and man hours, still alot of hand work invloved.....

 

[crab1092]

Here is a pic of my engine, In my living room of all places. Its a Hahn 20g with a zex direct port nitrous kit jetted at 100 shot. Its in my car already but I havent sprayed it yet because i am still trying to get everything tuned with the turbo itself. I am running the portfueler set up and i am learning that its not the easiest thing in the world to tune. Thanks bigrand for the ignition by the way.

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[totaleclipse_05]

Have fun TRYING to get your fuel setup to work because it won't. Attempt a search to find out why.

No offense, because I'm sure you have put plenty of time into that manifold, but it looks like crap. Why did you not just go with a Hahn manifold or STAR/Treadstone?

And keeping the "extremely light ass end" on the ground with the wing? Do you plan on acheiving flight or something?

 

[KazooGS-T]

Nonsense, his fuel system will work. It'll work just long enough to wash out his cylinder walls with the ton of gasoline that will be pouring into them, and he will figure that out, just in time to have to do another rebuild.

 

[bullettdsm]

Thanks for staying on topic, Crab.

In the immortal words of that convict, Rodney King "Can't we all just get along?"

This is gonna head to lock down if we don't stay with Rand's original idea (which I, for one, find interesting. Pretty even split on turbo non turbo)

MB

 

[Dark DSM]

Have fun TRYING to get your fuel setup to work because it won't. Attempt a search to find out why.

No offense, because I'm sure you have put plenty of time into that manifold, but it looks like crap. Why did you not just go with a Hahn manifold or STAR/Treadstone?

And keeping the "extremely light ass end" on the ground with the wing? Do you plan on acheiving flight or something?

Hey ya never know with how fast these cars can get, and as is sits there is way more weight in the engine bay than there well probably be in the rear. And trust me if you have read what i have put into it you can obviously tell is isnt no flippin show car. Hmmm i must want to haul ass. DUH! So use your head and imagination. And i like Bulletts idea lets stay on topic, and by the way whos fuel system are you talking about? if its mine. There is no reason it shouldnt work, every car is different and reacts differently, maybe the last person to try a setup similar to it, didnt work. But you dont know that it wont work on mine, not to mention im using a little different approach, and im not going to publish it until im done. So dont jump the gun homie!

 

[cs82685]

ya see i knew some dumbass would start saying stupid things, first off this is MY car not yours, damn its not even finished yet, i dont even have paint on it, so hold off on the stupid comments. Two dont worry about how im going to control the injectors, i dont need MS, its not that hard. Believe me it looks a lot better in person, and two the wing serves a purpose, its gonna keep the extremely light ass end on the ground. I didnt buy it just for looks. Now as far as the injectors go, the Neo does some controling, but not all, thats why im also using a FPR to keep an idle pressure just where i need it, and with how big they are all i need is the 1:1 FMU, and i doubt im missin something, and if i am besides tweeking it constantly, please advise and dont criticize. Like i said it still doesnt run and i dont know whats its gonna do yet......

Oh and about the headlights, if you look at some late 2G's you will see the bumper bunch up in the center section like they do, but being the bumper on mine now is fiberglass, it still needs a little tweeking. Its nothing new.

It is YOUR car, and I understand it's not done, but... I have never seen a 2g (or any car on the street for that matter) that looks good with a wing like that. Also, if you're planning on making such crazy power and going so fast that you will need it, then what are you planning on using to control ignition timing when you up the boost to make the power you want to make?

The taillights I've had them, (on a black car) you'll see the light eventually and realize how ugly they are. As for the bumper it was just a question.

As for the fuel. Why are you sure it will work, there is way more support that says it won't then saying it will. People here are just trying to help you get your setup working. The largest injectors I've heard anyone getting to idle on the stock ECU with an fpr and safc were 550's and it still idled like crap. Maybe it will work for you, but the odds are it just won't.


PM me if you want to argue back, I didn't see a link to PM you, but I don't want to crowd a good thread with bickering. Like Mark said, it should be kept on topic. Hopefully Paul or someone will clean this thread up a bit and get rid of some of these posts (including this one)

 

[VelocitàPaola]

This whole thread should have been moved to the Hangout; but I know it would've gotten torn to shreds there, so I let it stay here for a while. Anyway... it looks like fun-time's over: things are getting out of hand for a thread that's still in a technical forum.

 

[VelocitàPaola]

ya see i knew some dumbass would start saying stupid things, first off this is MY car not yours, damn its not even finished yet, i dont even have paint on it, so hold off on the stupid comments. Two dont worry about how im going to control the injectors, i dont need MS, its not that hard. Believe me it looks a lot better in person, and two the wing serves a purpose, its gonna keep the extremely light ass end on the ground. I didnt buy it just for looks. Now as far as the injectors go, the Neo does some controling, but not all, thats why im also using a FPR to keep an idle pressure just where i need it, and with how big they are all i need is the 1:1 FMU, and i doubt im missin something, and if i am besides tweeking it constantly, please advise and dont criticize. Like i said it still doesnt run and i dont know whats its gonna do yet......

Oh and about the headlights, if you look at some late 2G's you will see the bumper bunch up in the center section like they do, but being the bumper on mine now is fiberglass, it still needs a little tweeking. Its nothing new.

Sir, you're severely mistaken. It appears as though you're proceeding without much research behind your decisions whatsoever. Some of our more knowledgeable members tried to nudge you in the right direction, but you wanted nothing of it.

When you rebuild and turbocharge your engine, you start playing with the big boys. Mistakes don't cost fifty bucks and an hour or two of your time anymore... if you mess up at this level, you're in for thousands of dollars of damage. They were just trying to protect your investment; I suggest you do the same and listen to those of us who have been down this road before.