Increasing o2 sensor lifespan

[CrackedDSM]

Hey guys, wanted to open up a discussion here because I'm curious about something.


Small backstory: I killed the wideband sensor in my innovate LC2 gauge in less than a year, and less than 300 miles of use. Never preheated the sensor before starting, it's 18" away from the turbo, it's not mounted below the horizontal line. Tune has been quite rich for the sensors early life though. However no E85, no methanol, no race gas, just pump 93. No anti-lag or etc.



The question: Are there ways to prolong o2 sensor life? Specifically the LSU4.9 wideband sensor. There have been some suggestions in my build thread, but I wanted it in a better more easily searchable/findable spot. So please...post up your personal experiences on what works, what didn't work, how you killed yours fast, and anything you did to make it last further. Please be explicit and detailed, please don't just say blanket terms like "just heatsink it" and leave nothing else. It's a nightmare sometimes trying to figure out what people mean.

Thanks in advanced for all the advice and comments.

 

[FIBA M - EC17PSE]

I have been on the same sensor on my LC1 since new. I always preheat the sensor. Always have done and always will! Its not gone wrong and I was advised ro do so back then so it works and works well. Ecmlink shows its super close to being spot on.

Mines in the DP just after the oil pan

 

[CrackedDSM]

I have been on the same sensor on my LC1 since new. I always preheat the sensor. Always have done and always will! Its not gone wrong and I was advised ro do so back then so it works and works well. Ecmlink shows its super close to being spot on.

Mines in the DP just after the oil pan

I think the LSU4.2 are more robust than the 4.9. My AEM UEGO uses the 4.2 and it works still to this day even being 10+ years old.


Been reading more and more, and it's something innovate changed in the programming of the LC2 vs the LC1. Read up on their "heat sink extension" they sell, and they admit that they programmed the LC2 to be sensitive and give an error code if certain conditions are met. But, I'd rather not take the chance and be prepared so that the AEM X-series wideband I'm getting lives nice and long. I'd be happy with a full year. Don't expect 10+.

 

[DSMPT]

Innovate, AEM, PLX etc, many brands use the same Bosch sensor. The only difference is the control unit. Since I see very often that people complain about Innovate, IMO the Innovate control unit has some issue or perhaps simply there are more Innovate users than other brands.
I have had PLX, AEM and Auto Meter for myself, and I used to run often with high EGT, oxygenated/leaded race gas or methanol blend, but I personally never have an issue with the sensor lifespan. Also I have sold some PLX and AEM wideband last 15 years. All of them use the Bosch LSU4.2 or 4.9 but never heard back any complain from my customers. So I imagine those have been working well, too.

 

[DogWhistle]

Maybe the question should be, where is your sensor mounted vs. how long are they lasting?

Could vibration and/or too far upstream play a part in shortened lifespan?

 

[jdxnc]

I bit the bullet and purchased the Innovate heatsink bung years ago and never killed another sensor after that, even in the front o2 location. Before that it was at least one sensor a year.

 

[miliman13]

From personal experience, what I did to keep my sensor from not dying prematurely was lower the position of the bong , on the exhaust I think it’s about 18” from the hot side of the turbo . Once I did this I stopped killing the sensor.

 

[FIBA M - EC17PSE]

I think the LSU4.2 are more robust than the 4.9. My AEM UEGO uses the 4.2 and it works still to this day even being 10+ years old.


Been reading more and more, and it's something innovate changed in the programming of the LC2 vs the LC1. Read up on their "heat sink extension" they sell, and they admit that they programmed the LC2 to be sensitive and give an error code if certain conditions are met. But, I'd rather not take the chance and be prepared so that the AEM X-series wideband I'm getting lives nice and long. I'd be happy with a full year. Don't expect 10+.

I think thats correct the 4.2 are a stonger unit. Im an avid believer that over heating is a great way to keep a sensor safe as it removes the shock it see's from the turbo heat and moisture inside of it.

 

[danl]

I've never killed a sensor and I feel like I've done a lot of miles on them. Now that I've jinxed myself I'll provide details on how I have ran them.

1990 GST #1 - About 86K miles on this car in the early 2000's. Was my daily driver for a number of years and I took it to the track regularly. It saw 55 gallons of race fuel per year. Original LC1 mounted in the front O2 location on a 1g. The only issue I had is the LC1 required a lot of free air calibrations.

1991 GSX - Never a daily driver but I never had a tow vehicle so I drove it to/from the track accumulating about 5K miles over the 5 or so years I owned it. The same LC1 but this time I was running more E85. Also instead of a cast iron O2 housing I was running an ebay "stainless steel" O2.

2006 Evo 9 - Daily Driver. I did about 55K miles with a wideband in this car. Another LC1 but bought new in 2007 or so. The last 25K miles I did a lot of time with E85. Sensor mounted in primary O2 location on that car.

1990 GST #2 - AEM X series wideband. The wideband proper worked flawlessly for 1000 miles but then was unable to drive the stock computer's narrow band input so I switched to a LC2 this time. Another ebay O2 housing. I only have 500 miles on the LC2 and I also switched to the Morrison Fab O2 housing with Tial external gate option. He installed a fined "heat sink" O2 bung on his housing. I may only do 500-1000 miles on this setup each year but so far, it has been great and none of the issues with the older LC1's I had with requiring free air calibrations even with power removed for weeks at a time.

My friend has a 1G GSX has a zeitronix in the primary O2 location. He has at least 10K miles on it over 15 years and has not had to replace a sensor.

I'm not sure if it matters but I am pretty particular with keeping the sensors free of anti-sieze and other things like that. I've seen labeling on factory sensors that warn of using anti-sieze, RTV, and other compounds that could be introduced with the sensor. If I use anti-sieze it is a very light dab of some high temp stuff I got from Forced Performance a decade ago and only on the thread. I don't use RTV any where in the intake or exhaust side of my engines. Always dry gasket.

Im not even sure what is meant by pre heating the sensor. I turn my cars on and start driving. I wait until oil is up to temp (15-20 mins) then I expect it to do work.

I also run all the factory heat shields I can. Not sure how much that matters.

 

[CrackedDSM]

Innovate, AEM, PLX etc, many brands use the same Bosch sensor. The only difference is the control unit. Since I see very often that people complain about Innovate, IMO the Innovate control unit has some issue or perhaps simply there are more Innovate users than other brands.
I have had PLX, AEM and Auto Meter for myself, and I used to run often with high EGT, oxygenated/leaded race gas or methanol blend, but I personally never have an issue with the sensor lifespan. Also I have sold some PLX and AEM wideband last 15 years. All of them use the Bosch LSU4.2 or 4.9 but never heard back any complain from my customers. So I imagine those have been working well, too.

The updated AEM X-Series UEGO Wideband comes with an FAE/AEM Wideband sensor. It no longer uses the Bosch LSU4.9. I am extremely curious as to how well it holds up vs the Bosch unit. It can still use both and auto-detects it.

I bit the bullet and purchased the Innovate heatsink bung years ago and never killed another sensor after that, even in the front o2 location. Before that it was at least one sensor a year.

I was extremely curious about this, and it's what I had in mind but didn't want to "lead" any replies with a suggestion. I was 100% considering it. I think I'll end up pulling the trigger on it since it worked for you. For science sake though I'm gonna test this FAE/AEM sensor without the bung and see if it lasts/how long it lasts. They claim it was designed with race fuels/high temp use in mind. It's "leaded gas" approved. We'll see.

One more question for you @jdxnc , did you use washers to "orient" the hole like they recommend or did you just install it straight up? If so, how many washers did you end up using?



ALSO, JUST SO EVERYONE KNOWS

• To reiterate, my wideband bung is at minimum 18 inches away from the outlet of the turbo, and the bung itself is within the 10 degree above center line that is recommended.

• Preheating as I call it, refers to having key on and letting the wideband sensor fully heat up and start reading before you start the engine. Not before you start driving the car.

• It has never been mounted in or around the o2 housing ever. I've always used a stock narrowband o2 sensor in that location.

 

[jdxnc]

One more question for you @jdxnc , did you use washers to "orient" the hole like they recommend or did you just install it straight up? If so, how many washers did you end up using?

I installed it as instructed, its key to proper flow through it. I think if I remember correctly I took one thick washer and just sanded it down until orientation was perfect when it was tight.

I'm still using it with the Fueltech wideband sensor as well, againk still no sensor deaths.

 

[jdxnc]

Preheating as I call it, refers to having key on and letting the wideband sensor fully heat up and start reading before you start the engine. Not before you start driving the car.

This is actually contrary to what the Fueltech controller does, it actually delays the wideband heating for a bit to hopefully blow out any moisture from the exhaust so it doesn't contact the hot o2 sensor tip and shocking it.

 

[DSMPT]

The updated AEM X-Series UEGO Wideband comes with an FAE/AEM Wideband sensor. It no longer uses the Bosch LSU4.9. I am extremely curious as to how well it holds up vs the Bosch unit. It can still use both and auto-detects it.

I thought your question was specifically about the Bosch sensor as you mentioned in the original post. So I was talking about was only something that comes with the Bosch sensor to compare with. But my experiences are still the same that I have never had any wideband sensor lifespan issue, I have never actually cared that much about the installation location/orientation. I just follow the general things, doing nothing special. Many were in the factory front O2 sensor position, many were on custom exhaust just like most of people. I guess the only obvious difference from Innovate users who keep replacing the sensor often is I never use the Innovate unit.

 

[CrackedDSM]

This is actually contrary to what the Fueltech controller does, it actually delays the wideband heating for a bit to hopefully blow out any moisture from the exhaust so it doesn't contact the hot o2 sensor tip and shocking it.

Yeah, there just seemed to be some confusion as to what I meant by preheating.

Honestly if this sensor dies fast, I’m gonna wire the new wideband up to a relay that is triggered by the FPS solenoid controls in Link to not come on until engine temp is above 100* or something. Because that makes the most sense to me. Plus I live in Florida where humidity and moisture are abound in spades.

 

[Stapl3]

I have been on the same sensor on my LC1 since new. I always preheat the sensor. Always have done and always will! Its not gone wrong and I was advised ro do so back then so it works and works well. Ecmlink shows its super close to being spot on.

Same. I'd key-on until LC's red led did it's thing then I would start it. There's nothing behind me doing that aside of it just felt like the right thing to do.

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Before building that it lived in the stock o2 housing. All my other cars it lives in the o2 housing and I can't think of ever killing a sensor. You might have just had bad luck my dude.

I’m gonna wire the new wideband up to a relay that is triggered by the FPS solenoid controls in Link to not come on until engine temp is above 100* or something.

That's like no time according to EGT gauges I've used. The angle I would take to that experiment is applying 14v to the system via charger, then key-on and using a thermometer to the sensor. It would be interesting to see how hot the "heated" sensor gets vs time.

 

[CrackedDSM]

You might have just had bad luck my dude.

Abso-f*cking-lutely wouldn’t doubt it.

 

[chrisman287]

My MTX-L is in the front O2 location and simulating the narrowband sensor. I put a 25 second delay on it through ecmlink as that’s the time it takes for it to heat up and start reading. It’s wired in using the cig lighter as a trigger and using a Mitsu 4 pin relay to pull power from the fuse box. It’s grounded to a stud on the chassis.

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[danl]

I thought the heater circuit in a modern sensor has a temp feedback to the controller. If it gets too hot, the controller turns the heater off?

 

[1990TSIAWDTALON]

My MTX-L is in the front O2 location and simulating the narrowband sensor. I put a 25 second delay on it through ecmlink as that’s the time it takes for it to heat up and start reading. It’s wired in using the cig lighter as a trigger and using a Mitsu 4 pin relay to pull power from the fuse box. It’s grounded to a stud on the chassis.

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I don't use a relay but I do have a 25-30 second delay before i get a reading other than 7.0 on my Innovate LC2, which uses a Bosch 4.2 sensor. If the tune is good, the rest works good for my cars. Just my experiences guys.