The 14b Drag Race Discussion Thread

[jjrock5]

It's almost like buying a stock DSM.

 

[hubz91talontsi]

Phil you should just go ahead and drop some alumium rods in. I'd also look into a water/air setup. Those will big your 2 biggest power gains.

 

[jjrock5]

Since when do rods give you power gains?

 

[Enraged78]

Hey Phil!

I've decided to stop lurking in your threads and throw my two cents in.

First off, pistons and rods. While it's true that the machining of 1G big rods on 2G pistons might be a little expensive, enough that it can make going to forged seem like a better idea, you're forgetting a few things. First off, the 1G rally car we built at the shop last year used that exact same setup, and we were able to offset the costs by using our own aerospace machinist, who oddly enough works for beer. You probably remember him, as we borrowed his truck to put my motor back in the car. Since I wrote him a Subaru ECU, he owes me a favor or two, and a twelve pack goes a long way with him. So, if you can get a set of 2G (or EVO!) pistons, we can make sure that a good set will cost you much less than a set of forged pistons and rods. This combo is good for 500 at the crank easy, and I don't think you'll go over that with a 14b any time soon. Considering the local shop accounts we have, finding a cheap set of new pistons wouldn't be that hard. I know that you're trying to stick to a budget here, this will help a lot.

Second, machining. Our old machinist (Dave) still works for us, and still has all his equipment. He recently did my block, and if Greg can vouch for his work, then you know it's good. Call me later and I can give you a ballpark on how much this will cost. It's much cheaper than you think. You will have to hot tank and clean the block once he's done with it, but that's something you should do anyway.

Third, headwork. Our head machinist also still works for us, and does amazing work for very little money. It takes a while for him to get it done, but the good/fast/cheap analogy applies here. You only get to pick two. This is assuming that there is anything wrong with the head before hand. We can help with diagnosing it for you too.

Fourth, tuning. This engine combination that you're building is the EXACT setup that I tuned for the rally car we built at the shop last year. Good enough for Nick to abuse all winter in the snow means that it's going to be more than enough for you. I can do one of two things for you. I can either burn you a chip (meh...) with the studderbox, octane reset, 1G or 2G MAF, any injectors you want, extended timing maps, etc.; OR we can get you an ostrich and you can just start learning how to do this yourself (with the pre-tuend maps of course). Either way, all the work has already been done, and the tune should be 95% for you out of the box. I have a DSMLink account if you want to peruse the forums, but for the money, a $200.00 Ostrich setup with all of the tricks the DSM-ECU group has taught me will trump a $500.00 DSMLink setup every time. Rember that Bobby is running a very similar tune that I wrote for him. Ask him how he likes it....

You've helped out a lot of people over the years. It's time for us to return the favor. After all, you've helped me pull my motor how many times?

Give me a call when you have some time, and don't worry about the fate of the 16G. Nick and I have some plans for it.

Matt.

 

[hubz91talontsi]

Really...? When does reduction of rotating mass give you power gains..? Wow, I really don't know what to say. Someone is reading a drag discussion, and is going to post something like that.

 

[e85_4g63]

Really...? When does reduction of rotating mass give you power gains..? Wow, I really don't know what to say. Someone is reading a drag discussion, and is going to post something like that.

Your just joking when you said this right? You don't honestly believe what you posted do you? Maybe I'm taking what your saying the wrong way, but if what you say is true, when you sir, are not thinking clearly. (like I said, I might not be understanding what your trying to say EXACTLY, so don't take this as me trying to be a smartass or talking down to you).

 

[hubz91talontsi]

Yes, you obviously don't understand. I guess you don't understand drivetrain loss. You think people buy alumium driveshafts and flywheels just because.. Come on it's not hard to understand or figure out.

 

[Phil1320]

Phil you should just go ahead and drop some alumium rods in. I'd also look into a water/air setup. Those will big your 2 biggest power gains.

Yeah....I hear you, but, the more I decide to do, the longer it will be before the car is back out. I'm definitely working with a strict budget and need to get the most for my money. I would love some nice connecting rods. I like the idea of the water/air set up, but I'm not sure yet....like I've said elsewhere I want to start taking the car to the road course and water/air won't cut the mustard. So, rather than having to switch intercooler set ups, I'd rather do it once. However, everything requires work, so, I will still entertain that idea. I won't be making an I/C purchase for several months yet so I have time to contemplate the options. Thanks for the recommendations as always!

Hey Phil!

I've decided to stop lurking in your threads and throw my two cents in.

First off, pistons and rods. While it's true that the machining of 1G big rods on 2G pistons might be a little expensive, enough that it can make going to forged seem like a better idea, you're forgetting a few things. First off, the 1G rally car we built at the shop last year used that exact same setup, and we were able to offset the costs by using our own aerospace machinist, who oddly enough works for beer. You probably remember him, as we borrowed his truck to put my motor back in the car. Since I wrote him a Subaru ECU, he owes me a favor or two, and a twelve pack goes a long way with him. So, if you can get a set of 2G (or EVO!) pistons, we can make sure that a good set will cost you much less than a set of forged pistons and rods. This combo is good for 500 at the crank easy, and I don't think you'll go over that with a 14b any time soon. Considering the local shop accounts we have, finding a cheap set of new pistons wouldn't be that hard. I know that you're trying to stick to a budget here, this will help a lot.

Second, machining. Our old machinist (Dave) still works for us, and still has all his equipment. He recently did my block, and if Greg can vouch for his work, then you know it's good. Call me later and I can give you a ballpark on how much this will cost. It's much cheaper than you think. You will have to hot tank and clean the block once he's done with it, but that's something you should do anyway.

Third, headwork. Our head machinist also still works for us, and does amazing work for very little money. It takes a while for him to get it done, but the good/fast/cheap analogy applies here. You only get to pick two. This is assuming that there is anything wrong with the head before hand. We can help with diagnosing it for you too.

Fourth, tuning. This engine combination that you're building is the EXACT setup that I tuned for the rally car we built at the shop last year. Good enough for Nick to abuse all winter in the snow means that it's going to be more than enough for you. I can do one of two things for you. I can either burn you a chip (meh...) with the studderbox, octane reset, 1G or 2G MAF, any injectors you want, extended timing maps, etc.; OR we can get you an ostrich and you can just start learning how to do this yourself (with the pre-tuend maps of course). Either way, all the work has already been done, and the tune should be 95% for you out of the box. I have a DSMLink account if you want to peruse the forums, but for the money, a $200.00 Ostrich setup with all of the tricks the DSM-ECU group has taught me will trump a $500.00 DSMLink setup every time. Rember that Bobby is running a very similar tune that I wrote for him. Ask him how he likes it....

You've helped out a lot of people over the years. It's time for us to return the favor. After all, you've helped me pull my motor how many times?

Give me a call when you have some time, and don't worry about the fate of the 16G. Nick and I have some plans for it.

Matt.

Wow, Matt....I don't know what to say No, really, I'm having some trouble figuring out what to write That would be incredible

Ok, well, I guess we will have to talk soon and iron some things out. I don't have the oil pan off yet, or the head removed. I don't think anything is wrong with the engine at all--you mentioned diagnosing possible issues. But, I decided after the turbo exited stage left that it was now time to pull the engine out and remove the balance shafts.....and then thought that the head should be removed, disassembled, cleaned, and re-assembled with the upgrade lifters, valve springs, and the FP cams. At that point, it makes sense to inspect the cylinder walls, oil pump pick up, and what you can see of the thrust bearing and such. The only thing that will be a pain if we do any bottom end work is that I don't have the ability to drive the car down the road to get any type of break in on it. Guess we can cross that bridge when we come to it.......maybe get some miles on the dyno at FIM.

You know, I've always tried to help out as many as I could with mechanical work over the years...even sacrificing some college to do it. So, I appreciate that you've recognized that. At one point I had to stop helping so many as I was putting my own work aside alot. As always, I've enjoyed helping you over the years especially, we've always had fun, even when the going got tough, and the pizza was always great! As with the way I am, I wish I could have helped you more.

So, I appreciate this offer and look forward to talking about it in more detail soon. And yes, of course, budget is key so let's not get too crazy for the little 14b

I will let you know when the head is off, and oil pan is pulled. Maybe you can swing by and see what we've got to play with...although I'm sure you saw the pics above. The car is in more pieces than it has ever been Crazy But, I'm excited bigtime about making some changes with the car and it has totally renewed my interest. I must admit, even in the thick of finally hitting 11 seconds last year, and then whittling it to 11.49....I was nowhere near this excited. Seems crazy but that's the truth of the matter....am I saying that the original 14b blowing is what fueled this? I suppose I am--

Well, I'm glad to see you up here on the thread, really cool that you have followed it.

Talk to you soon! Huge thanks in advance too

Phil

Since when do rods give you power gains?

I think I understand what he means here....obviously rods themselves don't CREATE power.....maybe FREE UP power.....when I think lighter rods....I think quicker revs.....

Before I installed my ACT flywheel and DSS aluminum driveshaft my peak TQ number was about 282 at 21 psi. After installation of those two parts......peak TQ at 16 psi was 290, and at the same 21 psi=337. To tell the whole story, I swapped my 2G ported mani with the FP Race manifold at the same time the car was down for the flywheel/d-shaft---this could have helped as well, but not 55 ft.-lbs. worth....so the lightweight driveline parts help....

 

[e85_4g63]

Yes, you obviously don't understand. I guess you don't understand drivetrain loss. You think people buy alumium driveshafts and flywheels just because.. Come on it's not hard to understand or figure out.

Take what your about to read with a grain of salt. After reading your reply, I'm convinced your confused about somethings. I fully understand drive LINE loss. You stated, clearly, "when does reduction of rotating mass give you power gains" ... and well the answer is EVERY SINGLE TIME. Whether it be drive line or drive train (engine rotating mass), ANYTIME you reduce the mass, you gain power. If your saying that you don't gain power by reducing weight, then why do they make aluminum rods, titanium retainers, forged (as opposed to heavier, cast) pistons, lighter weight s/s valves, etc. etc? BECAUSE LESS WEIGHT = MORE POWER. I'm not trying to create an problems here, I'm not posting this to try and put you down, just trying to understand your point of view man

 

[bullettdsm]

The story of a DSM'er (or any other car enthusiast);

Well, the stock turbo blew up, I guess I gotta pull the turbo.

Well, since I'm getting another turbo, maybe I'll just port the new one (or, as many do, get a bigger one).

Well, since I'm pulling the turbo, maybe I'll just pull the enigne over the winter and clean things up.

Well, since I'm pulling the engine, maybe I'll just put in some cams.

Well since I'm putting in some cams, maybe I'll just pull the head and do the headgasket.

Well, since I'm doing the headgasket, maybe I'll just rebuild the the head.

Well since I'm rebuilding the head, maybe I'll just put in some springs and retainers.

Well, since I'm doing all that to the head, maybe I'll just tighten up the bottom end with some new rings and a hone.

Well since I'm putting in new rings, maybe I'll just punch it out a bit and put in new pistons.

Well since I'm putting in new pistons, maybe I'll just put in some high comp pistons.

Well, since I'm putting in new pistons, maybe I'll just put in some forged rods.

Well since I'm putting in new rods...........maybe I'll just put a bullet in my head

You can see how this can go on ad infinitum. You start with a $150 good used turbo and you're up to an eleventy billion dollar Veyron engine.

IMO, take the simpler way out. The extra comp is not going to help you all that much (and you know I like my high comp ) vs the cost of a new set of forged pistons. Honestly, the best avenue to take (for the money) would be the 2g piston set-up (provided the block is in great shape - which I believe it is with all the numbers we have seen). The only reason you may want forged over stock is the strength. But as Matt said, I don't think you'll be reaching the power limits of the 2 g pistons (keep in mind that this argument becomes null and void if you decide that the money is NOT a consideration. Then I would go with the forged high comp pistons).

Meh, just a little food for thought now that I found about 10 minutes to be on the computer.

MB

 

[pneumo]

Hey Phil!

Fourth, tuning. This engine combination that you're building is the EXACT setup that I tuned for the rally car we built at the shop last year. Good enough for Nick to abuse all winter in the snow means that it's going to be more than enough for you. I can do one of two things for you. I can either burn you a chip (meh...) with the studderbox, octane reset, 1G or 2G MAF, any injectors you want, extended timing maps, etc.; OR we can get you an ostrich and you can just start learning how to do this yourself (with the pre-tuend maps of course). Either way, all the work has already been done, and the tune should be 95% for you out of the box. I have a DSMLink account if you want to peruse the forums, but for the money, a $200.00 Ostrich setup with all of the tricks the DSM-ECU group has taught me will trump a $500.00 DSMLink setup every time. Rember that Bobby is running a very similar tune that I wrote for him. Ask him how he likes it....

You've helped out a lot of people over the years. It's time for us to return the favor.

Matt.

Yes, there is a lot of good mods that can be added to an EPROM chip. Phil has been running my chip for the past year or so, you should look into it before making other changes- I put some good mods in there. I'm sure a retune is needed for higher compression, cams, possibly a 16g? and to keep the tune safe for a roadcourse. You might be surprised at the mods I didn't put on the chip, too. One of my guiding principals is 'Just because we can do it doesn't mean we should". I don't know who said that, but it's good to keep in mind when deciding on phantom knock thresholds and knock decay rates.

Phil, thanks for posting pics of your engine. It looks very clean!

 

[Enraged78]

Yes, there is a lot of good mods that can be added to an EPROM chip. Phil has been running my chip for the past year or so, you should look into it before making other changes- I put some good mods in there. I'm sure a retune is needed for higher compression, cams, possibly a 16g? and to keep the tune safe for a roadcourse. You might be surprised at the mods I didn't put on the chip, too. One of my guiding principals is 'Just because we can do it doesn't mean we should". I don't know who said that, but it's good to keep in mind when deciding on phantom knock thresholds and knock decay rates.

Phil, thanks for posting pics of your engine. It looks very clean!

Thanks for the advice. I'd like to talk to you about this further. You've got PM.

Thanks,
Matt

Wow, Matt....I don't know what to say No, really, I'm having some trouble figuring out what to write That would be incredible

Ok, well, I guess we will have to talk soon and iron some things out......

No problem, buddy. I'll talk to Nick about your piston machining today. Give me a call on Sunday and we can work out the rest.

Thanks,

Matt

 

[Phil1320]

The story of a DSM'er (or any other car enthusiast);

Well, the stock turbo blew up, I guess I gotta pull the turbo.

Well, since I'm getting another turbo, maybe I'll just port the new one (or, as many do, get a bigger one).

Well, since I'm pulling the turbo, maybe I'll just pull the enigne over the winter and clean things up.

Well, since I'm pulling the engine, maybe I'll just put in some cams.

Well since I'm putting in some cams, maybe I'll just pull the head and do the headgasket.

Well, since I'm doing the headgasket, maybe I'll just rebuild the the head.

Well since I'm rebuilding the head, maybe I'll just put in some springs and retainers.

Well, since I'm doing all that to the head, maybe I'll just tighten up the bottom end with some new rings and a hone.

Well since I'm putting in new rings, maybe I'll just punch it out a bit and put in new pistons.

Well since I'm putting in new pistons, maybe I'll just put in some high comp pistons.

Well, since I'm putting in new pistons, maybe I'll just put in some forged rods.

Well since I'm putting in new rods...........maybe I'll just put a bullet in my head

You can see how this can go on ad infinitum. You start with a $150 good used turbo and you're up to an eleventy billion dollar Veyron engine.

IMO, take the simpler way out. The extra comp is not going to help you all that much (and you know I like my high comp ) vs the cost of a new set of forged pistons. Honestly, the best avenue to take (for the money) would be the 2g piston set-up (provided the block is in great shape - which I believe it is with all the numbers we have seen). The only reason you may want forged over stock is the strength. But as Matt said, I don't think you'll be reaching the power limits of the 2 g pistons (keep in mind that this argument becomes null and void if you decide that the money is NOT a consideration. Then I would go with the forged high comp pistons).

Meh, just a little food for thought now that I found about 10 minutes to be on the computer.

MB

Isn't this the truth---and I've been happy to not have fallen in to this trap thus far

I will most likely take the simpler set up for several reasons: Budget and following my orginal them are a couple. The max HP I will probably ever have in my car is 400 AWHP----so, the stock rods/cast pistons should be fine.

I wish I could decide that money was not a consideration, but, then my incremental approach would be gone.....the tracking of actual progression would be gone.....I think I would come in like many with a ton of new parts and never really know what gave me my newfound power. Even as we go now, I will be doing quite a few things---b-shaft removal, cams, and possible a better FMIC set up....and most likely a small compression bump. So we've got four things working here and will most likely have to guess at what will be responsible for whatever gains are realized.

Last note.....there is a chance that the balance shaft removal will be the only thing I do to the bottom end. If all looks good, I may just get the head done, new head gasket, and back together it goes. I actually would love to do it this way.....although I'm gathering that many would recommend the bottom end at least makes its way to the maching shop to check the deck and such, correct?

Anyway.....this is gonna be cool. I haven't had a significant increase in overall power since 2007, so I'm excited.

Yes, there is a lot of good mods that can be added to an EPROM chip. Phil has been running my chip for the past year or so, you should look into it before making other changes- I put some good mods in there. I'm sure a retune is needed for higher compression, cams, possibly a 16g? and to keep the tune safe for a roadcourse. You might be surprised at the mods I didn't put on the chip, too. One of my guiding principals is 'Just because we can do it doesn't mean we should". I don't know who said that, but it's good to keep in mind when deciding on phantom knock thresholds and knock decay rates.

Phil, thanks for posting pics of your engine. It looks very clean!

Glad you two linked up finally, I had told Matt that you had done the chip for me last year, and that it helped immensely.

I'll still be out on a 14b at least initially next yeat, but, I do plan to step up a notch at some point if I can.

As far as the road course work...that will be for 2012, most likely on the 16g at about 18-20 psi max, so we can collaborate at that time as I will not be running VP C16. Most likely unleaded 98-100 octane. But, that's for later.

Oh, thanks! In 2003, I polished the intake that's on my car now and swapped my orginal one off the car, at that time I cleaned the back of the head. I'm pretty retentive about having clean engines, even in my road cars. I just did the same with my VR4 when the intake came off of that to be cleaned. I'm not big into seeping gaskets and such, however hard to not have some of that. I frequently clean my engines! Also, in the Talon's case, it hasn't been a full duty road car since about 2000 and has not seen winter since I owned it....Oct. '96. That all helps

Thanks for the advice. I'd like to talk to you about this further. You've got PM.

Thanks,
Matt




No problem, buddy. I'll talk to Nick about your piston machining today. Give me a call on Sunday and we can work out the rest.

Thanks,

Matt

As I said above....glad the two of you linked up, your aptitudes for this stuff are in the same category

I'll call you later today

Something about an unopened stock 4G63 engine that makes me smile.

It is pretty cool to think that it is all original

But, being 20 years old, I think it makes sense to clean it up a bit at the minimum. I'm actually very interested to see what the head gasket looks like among other things.....but, believe me, I'll admit there is a tiny bit of fear that I'm tampering with something so pure and I hope it doesn't come back and bite me in the.........

Your motor looks brand new.

Thanks! I wish it was! I suppose it will be "like new" within the next several months

 

[e85_4g63]

I know I've only posted a couple of reply's in this thread. But I recently (today) went back and re read through it just to get "up to speed" on how fast the 14b turbo is being pushed too. I just wanted to say thanks to everyone that's posting here. Some of us (well me at least) are newly single (sucks for the holidays) and NEED some new goals. I doubt I'll be up there with the top contenders but, I bought a 14b off ebay this morning, so we'll see how it goes..

In no way do I think my accomplishments are better than any, but are noteworthy.

GOOD LUCK TO ALL 14B CONTENDERS AND HOPEFULS(newbies) in 2010!

Also good luck in the up coming 2011 season to everyone. I just wanted to point out (because I'm sure some read over this without thinking about it) the replay Phil made about his records. I'm not on his (censorship here) but it seems as though he is a GENUINELY HUMBLE person, not a big deal to most, but to me, people like him are ALWAYS welcome (and wanted) in this community...

 

[Phil1320]

I know I've only posted a couple of reply's in this thread. But I recently (today) went back and re read through it just to get "up to speed" on how fast the 14b turbo is being pushed too. I just wanted to say thanks to everyone that's posting here. Some of us (well me at least) are newly single (sucks for the holidays) and NEED some new goals. I doubt I'll be up there with the top contenders but, I bought a 14b off ebay this morning, so we'll see how it goes..



Also good luck in the up coming 2011 season to everyone. I just wanted to point out (because I'm sure some read over this without thinking about it) the replay Phil made about his records. I'm not on his (censorship here) but it seems as though he is a GENUINELY HUMBLE person, not a big deal to most, but to me, people like him are ALWAYS welcome (and wanted) in this community...

Cool, glad you're liking it up here. Sorry to hear of your new status, I've been there....and believe me, the car stuff was always there to take my mind off the negative happenings in my life. Awesome that you got a 14b, I think you'll find it to be pretty impressive.

Thanks for the kind words. These days I'd like to think I'm that person. I think I haven't always been.....especially when I had Mustang drivers as my number one competitors(and junk talkers) in the past. Many people didn't like me in those days and probably still don't. But, noone will ever say I beat around the bush. I was always straight to the point, no matter what. And, I do remember, I won't mesh with everyone. But, I'd like to think that the better part of the group feels the same as you do. I'm not one to try to keep anyone down up here, I think collectively as a group, we've got a cool thing going. Lots of help, experience, and advice is all around us. And, judging by the fact this thread had 1000 posts in less than a year and is the leader in that category in the Drag Race Forum, that seems to be proof of that. So, I appreciate the compliments bigtime and look forward to having you around with your own 14b story to tell. Good luck and have fun with it!

 

[9!'clipseDOHC]

Everything looks great Phil! Can't wait to see what you end up doing!

With my full 3" exhaust and now FMIC, my 14b is creeping a LOT. My MBC is backed all the way out and I'm boosting 13-14 psi until about 5k RPM and then it creeps up to 20+. This is way to much boost for my 450 injectors. I am also at stock fuel pressure. My next upgrade is v3lite and then bigger injectors but that's about $800 and I won't be able to do that until early next year (hopefully tax return). I can get a recirculated external wastegate setup (tial 38mm) for about half that new and hopefully less if I find something used. Is an external wastegate a good solution for the 14b? I haven't seen many 14bs with external wastegates. Also is that a good idea or should I just stick with my plan and get dsmlink and injectors first?

While I'm here, here are some pics of my new FMIC setup:

There are a lot more here: http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/articles-turbo-system-intercooler/386137-1g-vrsf-fmic-install.html

 

[SBstar]

Looks good! I would definately get the injectors and link before the external wastegate. Although a good mod, even on the 14b, you aren't going to see significant improvements worth the money. A proper tune and injectors large enough to handle what you're throwing at it are going to be a much better investment. Don't rule out used stuff either, my injectors are FIC 1050's I picked up for 200 and are in great shape and I love them with E-85!

 

[Steve93Talon]

With my full 3" exhaust and now FMIC, my 14b is creeping a LOT. My MBC is backed all the way out and I'm boosting 13-14 psi until about 5k RPM and then it creeps up to 20+. This is way to much boost for my 450 injectors. I am also at stock fuel pressure. My next upgrade is v3lite and then bigger injectors but that's about $800 and I won't be able to do that until early next year (hopefully tax return).

V3 lite is $375 and you can pick up a set of stock EVO injectors that'll be plenty for a 14b for around $100. I'd go that route. What are you running for an 02 housing? That's probably the biggest contributing factor to your creep issue.

 

[9!'clipseDOHC]

Looks good! I would definately get the injectors and link before the external wastegate. Although a good mod, even on the 14b, you aren't going to see significant improvements worth the money. A proper tune and injectors large enough to handle what you're throwing at it are going to be a much better investment. Don't rule out used stuff either, my injectors are FIC 1050's I picked up for 200 and are in great shape and I love them with E-85!

Ok, that's what i figured. Thanks!

V3 lite is $375 and you can pick up a set of stock EVO injectors that'll be plenty for a 14b for around $100. I'd go that route. What are you running for an 02 housing? That's probably the biggest contributing factor to your creep issue.

$375 + $30 for the EPROM conversion is $405. Also I only want to buy injectors once and since my future plans involve a 20g I was going to go with a set of FIC 850's (I'll be able to run those on a 14b with 'link right) . I guess I could get a cheap set of used 550-650's or so but I'd rather just do it right and do it once. So really it's more like $660 for V3lite and 850 injectors.

My o2 housing is a stock 2g unported one.

 

[91-gsx]

Nice setup you have there. Very clean.

I would also advise you to go with V3 Lite. Then you might be able to get away with increasing your fuel pressure and compensating for it. This should make your 450cc injectors act more like 550cc injectors. This also just so happens to work out for your setup because of the fact that you are not trying to run too much more than 25psi of boost.

The 255 fuel pump your running should not exceed 85psi in overall fuel pressure(If I recall correctly). So lets just say you bump up your your fuel pressure to 55psi and run 25psi of boost. You will stay under the limit of your fuel pump by a few psi, which means you might be able to go above 25psi of boost, but I would not advise that.

So, using the Dsmlink math. With that fuel pressure bump, you will have to remove 18% of your fuel with the global fuel setting in V3Lite. 18% is also what you have to remove with the 550cc injector upgrade.

This all works, but I would definitely upgrade your injectors as soon as you can. Just so you do not push everything for too long.

On another note, if your trying to go all out with your setup and the 1G MAS. I would try to make an adapter so that you can relocate the 1G MAS into the fender, and extend the MAS plug wires. It should help out a lot.

Good luck with everything!

 

[danl]

Ok, that's what i figured. Thanks!



$375 + $30 for the EPROM conversion is $405. Also I only want to buy injectors once and since my future plans involve a 20g I was going to go with a set of FIC 850's (I'll be able to run those on a 14b with 'link right) . I guess I could get a cheap set of used 550-650's or so but I'd rather just do it right and do it once. So really it's more like $660 for V3lite and 850 injectors.

My o2 housing is a stock 2g unported one.

Buy a set of evo 550's.

 

[Steve93Talon]

$375 + $30 for the EPROM conversion is $405. Also I only want to buy injectors once and since my future plans involve a 20g I was going to go with a set of FIC 850's (I'll be able to run those on a 14b with 'link right) . I guess I could get a cheap set of used 550-650's or so but I'd rather just do it right and do it once. So really it's more like $660 for V3lite and 850 injectors.

My o2 housing is a stock 2g unported one.

If you pick up a cheap set of 550-650s, you can recoup the money later if you need more. Incidentally, we've gone 11.0 @ 123 on a 20g with RC 550s so you can push them pretty far if you're on good gas and have enough fuel pressure.

The o2 housing is most likely your creep problem. Either get a tubular one with o2 dump or pull it and port it, focusing on the transition from the gate passage to the primary exit. You'll also ideally want to port the turbine housing to help direct flow through the flapper. The 2G o2 housing also has a different wastegate passage entry, so you'd want to get a 2G gasket and port match the turbine housing exit to match it. They made the change specifically to direct gasses around the flapper door better. Lastly, you'll want to port the wastegate hole itself, although if you crank the boost later you don't want to get too carried away with it or else you could end up losing boost up top.

 

[hubz91talontsi]

I hope to release my 14b build at the shootout. It will drop jaws I'm sure of that. Stupid military is taking up all my time though. I have my fingers crossed. It's going to be pretty hush hush though. You can ask questions after it runs I'll record dyno vids and runs locally with the gopro but no engine bay pics

 

[SBstar]

I hope to release my 14b build at the shootout. It will drop jaws I'm sure of that. Stupid military is taking up all my time though. I have my fingers crossed. It's going to be pretty hush hush though. You can ask questions after it runs I'll record dyno vids and runs locally with the gopro but no engine bay pics

I'm sorry but this really made me

Can't wait to see what you come up with.

 

[TSimage]

You probably didn't laugh as hard as I did.. No matter what, as impressed as people are about 14bs, they still wont drop anyones Jaws, I don't care what you do to it .