Alternative Fuel E85 Ethanol Corn Gas E70 (Beginner) [MERGED]

[311GSX]

THIS WILL BE RESERVED FOR BEGINNER E85 QUESTIONS, FOR TUNERS THAT HAVE NEVER HEARD OF RUNNING IT OR HAVEN'T RESEARCHED IT YET. THE ADVANCED E85 THREAD IS HERE FOR THE MORE ADVANCED QUESTIONS ---> http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/newbie-forum/372386-alternative-fuel-e85-ethanol-corn-gas-e70-advanced-merged.html

HOPEFULLY THIS WILL MAKE THE BASIC E85 INFORMATION MORE CENTRALIZED AND EASIER TO FIND FOR THE DSM'rs WHO ARE JUST GETTING THEIR NOSE WET AND ARE UNSURE OF WHAT E85 IS.

THANKS,

GOFER

__________________________________________________​

Has anyone tryed running E85 in their dsm? Their is a station in my area that sells it and it's not much more than regular gas. It is 85% ethanol and 15% gas and is 110 octane . It could be a cheap alternative to race gas.

 

[Absit]

It replaces the OEM but it's not an OEM replacement.

 

[MY1GDSM]

Something like this Click here Just make sure to pick the right filter in the Filter Element option

 

[MY1GDSM]

It's fine, so are your lines. You'll need to replace your filter a few times with a decent one and you may want to clean your injectors when you replace the filter.

While, I know some people have had problems with Black Goo.. I Don't understand why to are telling people to"clean" them, I guess it wouldn't hurt to pull them to check if their having issues...But it would be simpler to just top of with some gas.

OP
Like he said your stock lines will be fine. Make sure to change your Fuel filter after your first tank of E85 and a couple times in the first 500miles or so the occasional 1 out of maybe 20 fill ups with a tank of Pump Gas is recommend because some people have problems with black goo clogging them up... I really think it depends on the Source of you Ethanol since I've run E85 for over 3-4years and have never seen it on my injectors...

 

[Absit]

While, I know some people have had problems with Black Goo.. I Don't understand why to are telling people to"clean" them, I guess it wouldn't hurt to pull them to check if their having issues...But it would be simpler to just top of with some gas.

OP
Like he said your stock lines will be fine. Make sure to change your Fuel filter after your first tank of E85 and a couple times in the first 500miles or so the occasional 1 out of maybe 20 fill ups with a tank of Pump Gas is recommend because some people have problems with black goo clogging them up... I really think it depends on the Source of you Ethanol since I've run E85 for over 3-4years and have never seen it on my injectors...

Let's not fight friend!
Yes, running a tank of gasoline after every X tanks of E85 should be enough to combat the black goo.

 

[MY1GDSM]

Sorry, If that came off like I was tring to fight with you about it... .

I've just seen you suggest to people in other threads to pull them to have them cleaned or to clean them and was wondering what was your reasoning? Seems the majority of people that do have problems just do like I said an run a tank of gas...

 

[Absit]

Sorry, If that came off like I was tring to fight with you about it... .

I've just seen you suggest to people in other threads to pull them to have them cleaned or to clean them and was wondering what was your reasoning? Seems the majority of people that do have problems just do like I said an run a tank of gas...

For the same reason I generally recommend larger injectors and pumps than people actually need, I'm anal and overcautious.

 

[1TireFireTSi]

I did some forum searching and didn't really come up with definite solutions to easier cold starting on ethanol. My car is on E85 but I have future plans to go over to E98, which is even harder to start. Car runs linkv3.

Depending on the weather, my car takes 5-10 sometimes 15 tries before it'll start when it's dead cold. It's a little embarrassing and more draw on the battery (Optima Red Top) than I'd like. This is in a climate typically no colder than 30 degrees. I'm not running an Idle Control Motor right now so I just sit in there for a couple minutes until it idles on it's own, but that's an easy fix.

I might be way over complicating things but as far as I know there are no absolute solutions to easy cold starting ethanol; although it seems like some of the later Evo ECUs don't struggle as much and perhaps a battery with more CCA would help but...

Would it be possible to design a system that injected starting fluid into the intake? Actuate it electrically, using the car's existing circuitry and a separate reservoir with it's own small pump and line plumbed into the intake; or actuate a system using engine vacuum until the motor fires. I'm not really sure how you would meter the amount of fluid, inject it into the intake, or control the actuation in itself; but it could be a small isolated system, working with very small volumes of fluid because you wouldn't need hardly any to start it.

It's ridiculous I know, but if it were possible to create some way of pushing metered starting fluid (or even pump gas) into the intake, the rest would be fairly easy. I suppose buying a can of starting fluid and just popping the hood every time I wanted to start it would be easier but it wouldn't be near as cool as hitting a button inside your car Just a thought, open to less complicated suggestions/solutions.

 

[2GFWDbeast]

You sure you dont have some other issue with your car. I'm on E85 with nkg bpr8es spark plugs. I live in wisconsin, few days ago it was -30 with wind chill and my car started rite up no problems.

 

[cantgo2fast]

My buddy with a STI runs a block heater. Talk to the guys on the ECMlink forums you should be able to tune the motor to start at 30 degress. 0 degrees thats another story..

 

[banshee04]

Man, Ive noticed that the no start problem on E-85 in the cold is almost completely random. I work in a performance shop and see it quite a bit. Ive see 2 cars with almost the same setup and one of them had a hard time starting in the winter. I really dont know what it is. Some cars do it and some dont.

On my car I run a E-85 and a Ford 70mm TB with no idle control motor at all. I can go outside right now (20 degrees) and it will start up instantly. Like I said, I find it more random then anything.

 

[slow1gentsi]

Alright so I am new to the whole E85 scene I have pretty much spent 3 whole day searching like crazy trying to research every thing that I need to know but I am still stumped on one thing and thats timing. So I hear people say that when you run E85 you can run more timing or less timing with E85 what do you mean by that is it ignition timing

and when you say more or less timing is that the same as advancing and retarding timing?

 

[GRAVEDIGGER]

Yes to both questions.

More/less timing is refering to ignition timing.

more timing = more advance
less timing = less advance/retarded

 

[slow1gentsi]

For some reason I kept on thinking it was like cam timing anyways thanks that was the answer I was looking for

 

[gofer]

I'm going to mark this as [RESOLVED] and toss it in with our E85 MERGED thread.

 

[98mitsubishigst]

Okay guys, I have read the Merged post on E85 and a few others but just want to make sure..

Just installed my 255wal pump and FPR last night, along with my 1200cc injectors. I have full steel braided fuel lines pump to filter.

I just want to double check,

1200 * 0.67 = 804cc (Injector size for E85)

450 / 804 - 1 = .44% (global deadtime)

Is there anything else i need to change to run E85? i'm taking my car to someone to help with tuning, but i need to drive an hour away.. Just trying to figure out what all i need to change..

Thanks!

 

[snowborder714]

That is correct, and all that needs to be changed to get it running. You'll have other changes to make later, like leaning it out at the top end, but that will come as tuning progresses.

 

[98mitsubishigst]

That is correct, and all that needs to be changed to get it running. You'll have other changes to make later, like leaning it out at the top end, but that will come as tuning progresses.

Hmm, So as long as i normal drive it down to where i'm getting help with the tune, and don't drive like a moron, i am safe to go?

Thanks again man!

 

[snowborder714]

Well, all depends on what your current WOT AFR is. If it's the stock 9.4ish, then ya, I wouldn't really get on it much. If it's around 11, you could probably drive it harder

I just made the switch a couple weeks ago and just tuned it to be around 12.1 AFR and 19-20* timing.

 

[98mitsubishigst]

Well, all depends on what your current WOT AFR is. If it's the stock 9.4ish, then ya, I wouldn't really get on it much. If it's around 11, you could probably drive it harder

I just made the switch a couple weeks ago and just tuned it to be around 12.1 AFR and 19-20* timing.

Well; i just installed the Injectors; about to put my first 2 gallons of E85 in.. (i bought a jug of it from the place just so i can get her a base tune and everything set, then ill drive back up to the gas station and fill her up.)

I'm honestly thinking about not even getting into boost untill after i get my tune situated tomorrow morning.. I'm just making sure i'll be alright driving that hour to hour and a half in 5th gear cruising down turnpike..?

Lemme know!

 

[snowborder714]

I see no problems with you doing that.

Where are you headed to get it tuned?

 

[gofer]

I laugh, not making fun of course, at DSM'rs making the conversion to E85 on their first fill up because I remember my first time at the E85 pump. I drove there and I was nervous as hell that the damn car wouldn't even start, then on my way home my WB showed 14.7:1 cruising and E85 stoich is 9.8:1 so I'm thinking WT.F.! Had I known better though, 14.7:1 is what it should read on the WB on E85 or 91oct... In the end, over a year later, my car runs better on E85 then it does on 91 pump even idling and I have small injectors.

Of course take your time and get comfortable but I promise its not a huge difference outside a few sanity checks with your fuel adjustments. Outside of that, enjoy the new smell of E85 coming out the exhaust, cold starts in the morning, lower cost per gallon, shitty gas mileage, and the increased power you'll get going WOT once its tuned!

 

[snowborder714]

And I expect to see some logs before/after your tune session!

 

[MY1GDSM]

Well; i just installed the Injectors; about to put my first 2 gallons of E85 in.. (i bought a jug of it from the place just so i can get her a base tune and everything set, then ill drive back up to the gas station and fill her up.)

I'm honestly thinking about not even getting into boost untill after i get my tune situated tomorrow morning.. I'm just making sure i'll be alright driving that hour to hour and a half in 5th gear cruising down turnpike..?

Lemme know!

If your only putting that little of E85 In. I would suggest, since being this is your first time running E85. That you drain you tank dry or at the very least fill your tank completely First off. It will make your tunning process go a LOT smother.

I'd seriously just stay out of any load what's so ever as well. Since it definitely sounds as your not very familiar with tuning...

 

[GRAVEDIGGER]

if your only pitting that little of E85 in I would suggest since this being this your first time running e85 that you drain you talk dry it will make your tunning process go ALOT smother or at the very least fill your tank completely First of Id seriously just stay out of any load what's so ever as well since it definitely sounds as your not very familiar with tuning...

Holy miserable, jumbled up, mispelled, run-on sentence. I know you can do a little better than that.

But yes, I do agree with what you're trying to say.

 

[MY1GDSM]

Haven't posted lately since I've been real busy an my laptop has be down, But ya your right thanks for quoting me

Stupid phones ...