Resolved 2G Engine Rebuild

[RubyEclipse]

Hello everyone! I just purchased my 1996 Eclipse GST a few months ago, had some issues with a few different things. Most recent was car was smoking and running very uneasy, so I decided to pull the engine. I am going to do a full engine rebuild-ish, I bought new wisco heads, still looking at the rods I want, if there’s anything anyone thinks I should buy and upgrade I would love help! Trying to push more power but not an insane amount seeing how I want this to be more of a daily but not quite. Thank you guys!

 

[pauleyman]

Hoping no one is gonna say im an idiot and messed up big time, but i cleaned my transmission. I used purple power, sprayed the whole entire thing down, including the bell housing. Then i used a brass, or soft wire brush. Then I power washed the entire thing, it looks really really good. I’m like very happy and proud. The thing was black, all the way around. Now it’s silver and looking good. plus don’t tell me I really messed up…

It's a good idea to keep water out of the trans. Axle holes, breather hole etc. A little bit won't be a deal breaker but alot might suck.

 

[RubyEclipse]

It's a good idea to keep water out of the trans. Axle holes, breather hole etc. A little bit won't be a deal breaker but alot might suck.

Trying to drain everything out right now. Could i put oil in it to stop rust? Just in case you know?

Also, I get the new rings? Bearings, and full gasket kit tomorrow. I get clutch kit, axles, and whatever else next week hopefully. Where do i start for the rebuild tomorrow?

 

[CKOPOCT]

Trying to drain everything out right now. Could i put oil in it to stop rust? Just in case you know?

There shouldn't be any rust concerns. The trans is aluminum, and any steel parts would have a coat of oil on them. The water that may have gotten inside the trans wouldn't have contacted the steel. Just drain the trans. If you notice a layer of water come out first (significant - like when you squeeze mustard and got a large shot of "musquirt" before getting just mustard), then flush the trans with oil to rinse and push out any remaining water. After that, you should be good to go - fill 'er up and drive happy.

 

[RubyEclipse]

Alright gentlemen, parts came in, i am starting reassembly. Want to make sure im doing everything right. The rings came in pre gapped. I checked every single one and they looked and fit great. I have them all on the pistons but they are not at the correct spacing. I’ve used assembly lube on all parts that will be touching other parts and moving parts. Waiting to put the pistons in.

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I don’t know if this is right, they have opposite little notches im looking at, i crossed them and its all guessing.

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Okay so, my shop was awesome and gave me these notes, and said if we were to rebuild your engine, this is exactly how we would do it. Came with all torque specs, all the patterns including ring pattern so i just did that.

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Do the rod caps go like this? And what about the crank caps? Some said towards the exhaust side but I don’t know what that means.

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[DSMPT]

The #3 main bearing is in wrong orientation.

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I don’t know if this is right, they have opposite little notches im looking at, i crossed them and its all guessing.

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This too. Wrong orientation. The notch on the block and cap (or rod and cap) would be in the same side.

 

[RubyEclipse]

The #3 main bearing is in wrong orientation.

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This too. Wrong orientation. The notch on the block and cap (or rod and cap) would be in the same side.

Oh ok thank you. I had my pistons had wards. I spun them all around, it fixed all of the orientation. Just to be absolutely sure, when you had told me, I already had everything torqued and the oil pan off, so I took it all off and triple checked. It was all correct to what you said. I also checked that crank bearing and it looked good. Thank you for all of the help. I’ll show you guys everything that I’ve done so far, I really did so much today!!

 

[DSMPT]

Curious as to how you can tell from the photo... what was the indicator?

Notch's position.

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[1990TSIAWDTALON]

Wipe out every cylinder with ATF on your hand. Scrub it in good. It is a lubricant and a detergent. It will remove all of the grit from honing. You will repeat this procedure until a white paper towel comes out RED, no Grey or dark red. Bright red. That means the cylinder is completely clean and will not eat your rings in the first 100 miles. Just a tip.

 

[RubyEclipse]

Wipe out every cylinder with ATF on your hand. Scrub it in good. It is a lubricant and a detergent. It will remove all of the grit from honing. You will repeat this procedure until a white paper towel comes out RED, no Grey or dark red. Bright red. That means the cylinder is completely clean and will not eat your rings in the first 100 miles. Just a tip.

I uhh… am a ways past that point in all honesty. I did use brake cleaner and scrubbed it all down super good. All walls until it wasn’t gray or black. But now my block is almost fully together. I stayed up till 3 AM fixing it. About 8-10 hours in all honesty. Check this out.

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[1990TSIAWDTALON]

Well you did your best. Did you put engine oil on all the rings? They should be coated completely.

 

[RubyEclipse]

Oh shoot. No, no I did not. That was not something that was mentioned or said by anyone when I looked it up. Is that something I need to pull it all off for?

 

[1990TSIAWDTALON]

Well....at this point, and I'm very sorry I haven't been as active, but those rings need oil. Is the head off? I guess you can put a generous amount of thin engine oil in each cylinder and let it leak down but my "teacher/mentor" in 1976 always DUNKED the whole piston and rod assembly in a coffee can of oil to soak it all. I lube mine separately, then spin each ring around the piston to coat the rings and ring lands on the pistons 100%, ALWAYS. Then I install the piston/rod assembly after setting each ring in a proper orientation.
Trying to help you out. Sorry I wasn't in on your whole build.
Marty

 

[RubyEclipse]

Well....at this point, and I'm very sorry I haven't been as active, but those rings need oil. Is the head off? I guess you can put a generous amount of thin engine oil in each cylinder and let it leak down but my "teacher/mentor" in 1976 always DUNKED the whole piston and rod assembly in a coffee can of oil to soak it all. I lube mine separately, then spin each ring around the piston to coat the rings and ring lands on the pistons 100%, ALWAYS. Then I install the piston/rod assembly after setting each ring in a proper orientation.
Trying to help you out. Sorry I wasn't in on your whole build.
Marty

Don’t even worry about it, you’re totally fine. I am just going to take off the girdle and pan go from there. I have the bead and all accessories already on. Including intake and exhaust.

If there is anything else anyone can think of when I take this call back off, please let me know. Would it also be better to go underneath or on top?

 

[1990TSIAWDTALON]

Well now hang on. You could put 20wt (really thin) engine oil down each sparkplug hole and then let it drain out of the pan and see how much comes out. You don't want them to retain oil or you'll hydrolock and bend a rod. It depends on how much TIME you have. I'd have to tear it down but if you let the cylinders leak down and then rotate the engine 90* and do it all again for the best soaking of the cylinder walls and the rings and ring lands, this could work. I've not done that but have used spray fogging lube in engines that haven't spun in YEARS. Just an of the top of my head idea, so we should both see if we get any other comments from other members that build their own motors. I've done it for 45 years but am willing to listen to others ideas or opinions.

 

[RubyEclipse]

So im looking at this, I forgot exactly how much I have on. If you think this would work then I will happily do it, but it will take me a second. I’d much much rather do the oil method through the pistons. Would it actually do much though?

 

[1990TSIAWDTALON]

You will not regret your decision. I'll keep a closer eye on your build. I have helped on remote builds before, since my shop is a long ways from anyone, KS. Its not hard for me or a bother.
I think oiling the rings is the proper way. If you have time to let any type of oil run THRU the rings, into the pan, then drain it and see how much you are missing, it keeps from taking the time to get those pistons out and oiled. You can blow any extra oil out by leaving the plugs out and putting rags down the plug holes to catch any that blows out during cranking it over.

 

[RubyEclipse]

You will not regret your decision. I'll keep a closer eye on your build. I have helped on remote builds before, since my shop is a long ways from anyone, KS. Its not hard for me or a bother.

Thank you so much. I’ve very sorry to make you feel bad, it’s no one’s fault but mine for not researching more. How much oil do you think should be going down this cylinders, like a cup or 2 ?

 

[1990TSIAWDTALON]

If you pre-prime the oil system by spinning the oil pump with a drill and still have oil squirter, they will lube the from the bottom also. This is all new but can be done.
If in doubt, pull em out.

 

[RubyEclipse]

You’re saying if the pistons don’t get oil, pull them? And what bolt do I spin to spin the oil pump? All I can think of is the balance shaft.

 

[1990TSIAWDTALON]

Yes, to spin the pump, it would have been right before you put the timing belt on as you use the nut on the front that holds the pump sprocket on. You can't spin it while the belt is on and i have followed you enough to know you've already done that twice (or MORE?). You are almost a pro there man. You finally got it all right.
Let's hope we get some others opinions, which we can take gratefully.
What ever lube would be the thinnest to run thru the rings in a day then rotate about 90* and repeat and catch all that's left. Don't over oil but excess will be needed in this scenario. Start with half a cup.

 

[RubyEclipse]

I mean this is how far I’ve gotten. It’s been really nice and going decently smooth so far. But I’d really really like to not throw a rod or bed anything.

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Yes, to spin the pump, it would have been right before you put the timing belt on as you use the nut on the front that holds the pump sprocket on. You can't spin it while the belt is on and i have followed you enough to know you've already done that twice (or MORE?). You are almost a pro there man. You finally got it all right.
Let's hope we get some others opinions, which we can take gratefully.
What ever lube would be the thinnest to run thru the rings in a day then rotate about 90* and repeat and catch all that's left. Don't over oil but excess will be needed in this scenario. Start with half a cup.

You got it. I’ve done the timing more than 10 times. to too much not going to like I’ve gotten to be able to do it within 5-10 minutes.

 

[RubyEclipse]

Ok so, I used the oil, and it all came out the exhaust. All of it. All over the ground, then when I put oil into the head so I didn’t lock anything up, I forgot the drain port for the turbo on the bottom, and flooded everything, I mean at least 3 quarts of oil on the floor.

So I down know that to do, because oil down the spark plug hole did not work. I tried spinning the crank, so so oil I think got some places, but not many.

 

[Bigbeanbird]

The current state of the car is the head is off, completely naked, I took off all that I could. Replaced my cam position sensor that broke. This is the current state, I don’t know why there is so much carbon build up in the intake, I think from poor fuel? But I don’t know anything.

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Carbon is usually a sign of a rich A/F ratio

 

[RubyEclipse]

So now I have this broken speed sensor from the transmission. The question is, do I glue it back and keep using it, will it break, will it work? And, if I need to buy a new one, where can I go? All of the ones I’ve found are 150 and up. I’m also buying a new oil pressure sensor cause that broke too.

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[RubyEclipse]

So, it would appear i break more in this car than fix. I was trying to get my fuel filter pressure line off because the end that goes in the rail broke. Trying to get it off, it snapped the underlying metal pipe. Now I feel like an idiot, and have to replace it. : ) what am i gonna do? Put in a steel braided line? And I don’t even know where this line runs too and from. So this is just great, and I am running out of patience and time. I really just want this thing running, but it really seems to want to stay dead and or just hate me. I also fixed my sensor for the trans.

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