2G Who needs a 2g knock sensor

[1990TSIAWDTALON]

Found a few 2g knock sensors....I think.
I ordered one and the order went through for my 98 TSI, so if anyone is needing one, you might want to get on here and give it a shot. I am hoping that they don't cancel my order but when I ordered mine, the page said there were 10 left.
This is where I found them:
https://www.amazon.com/s?k=ks32+knock+sensor&i=automotive&ref=nb_sb_noss

Good luck and crossing fingers!
Marty

 

[lasthope05]

O'Riley's apparently also have them.

 

[1990TSIAWDTALON]

That would be great. My Oriellys cant get them, and Standard Motors is located right here in town. I am thinking that the Amazon thing may not go thru. I got a message saying they would notify me when it ships, which sounds suspicious.
I am TRYING to talk to some of the right people at our local plant to find out why they have ceased production. I have some family that work there but I don't know if I am going to find out or not. I told my cousin to have the plant make one more run of minimum quantity but that won't probably happen.
I'm triyin tho!

 

[lasthope05]

Yea, that's strange. The website says theyre available for online orders/ship to home.

https://www.oreillyauto.com/detail/...ignition-knock-detonation-sensor/ks32/5811910

 

[b00st3d]

I can still get it at mine too.

 

[b00st3d]

And I thought we could also use Evo knock sensors.

 

[1990TSIAWDTALON]

Now I don't think my "guys" are trying hard enough...I'm gonna find out.
Thanks for the replies.

 

[motomattx]

And I thought we could also use Evo knock sensors.

Not really, they are tuned for a different frequency.

 

[DSMPT]

I have never checked EVO 4/5/6 and 7/8/9 knock sensors. So I am not sure about those on 2g. but I think EVO 1/2/3 knock sensors work with 2g ecu without any issues. I had used EVO 3 knock sensor on my 2g for short term, it was working like a 2g sensor. I didn't see any difference from the 2g's and it was detecting knocks well. Probably the only difference between EVO 1/2/3 and 2G is the cable length.

Standard Motor Products KS263 is supposed to be a replacement for EVO 1/2/3 (MD198158) according to Rock Auto. So if assuming I am right, this one should work on 2G. And if it would work well, it could be a good alternate part.

https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo.php?pk=1353073&jsn=1242

 

[EVLGSX]

I use an evo 8 knock sensor on my 97 GSX. No issues and seems to behave just as my original one that came with the car. If there is a difference, it may be negligible and might be the reason they stopped making it for the 2g dsms........because the evo 8 is the same thing and works? just a guess.

All I do know for sure is that I have been using the evo sensor on my car for a little over a year now, I have been tuning by it and am happy with how the plugs read when I check them and am able to make all of the power my current installed turbo is rated for.

 

[motomattx]

[QUOTE="EVLGSX, post: 153717409, member: 163727"]I use an evo 8 knock sensor on my 97 GSX. No issues and seems to behave just as my original one that came with the car. If there is a difference, it may be negligible and might be the reason they stopped making it for the 2g dsms........because the evo 8 is the same thing and works? just a guess.

All I do know for sure is that I have been using the evo sensor on my car for a little over a year now, I have been tuning by it and am happy with how the plugs read when I check them and am able to make all of the power my current installed turbo is rated for.[/QUOTE]



Thats the problem right there, how do you know that your not missing out on knock thats there? by no problems what exactly do you mean? that your not picking up knock more than usual? that could be a problem. In my Link standalone software, there are different frequency settings for the Evo8 knock sensor vs the 2g knock sensor, that right there tells me they are different, the subject also came up on the Link forums and the guys at Link said that they are indeed tuned to different frequency's and are not to be interchanged.

 

[1990TSIAWDTALON]

Yea, that's strange. The website says theyre available for online orders/ship to home.

https://www.oreillyauto.com/detail/...ignition-knock-detonation-sensor/ks32/5811910

My Oreilly's looked online this week for a 1g sensor since I am mostly a 1g guy, and they found 2, one on the east coast and one on the west coast, so I had them order me one immediately and it is suppose to be in today. That is why I started looking, one last time, for a 2g sensor, in hopes of getting the 98 TSI running again and it probably has the original sensor in it. Still hoping my order gets filled, I will keep this thread updated on the progress for all to know. And thanks for all of the good comments on this topic so others can read and decide for themselves what they need or want.
That's what I love about this forum, different opinions and options for others.

 

[EVLGSX]

What do you mean thats the problem? I said Ive had no problems. Meaning no hammered rod bearings, knock readings that make sense when I get greedy with the tune, I read my plugs on the regular and like how they look, Ive confirm no knock with a knock mic I made, and if you pay attention to details, you know when your motor is not happy.

Maybe this is NOT for everyone buts its worked for me.

I am open to any data you may be able to present Motomatt. I remember you bringing the 2 different setting thing to the discussion in another thread on the evo sensor working in a 2g.............I understand your logic for sure but does this mean it cant/wont work? Wish we could get more info on this.


Ive tested it. With no other options I didnt really have a choice!

Im just glad that Im as stubborn as I am and have learned to trust myself over the years or I would not have spent the last year boostin all over creation.........over a knock sensor.

 

[Mello]

This thing about the 2G & EVO knock sensor is confusing me. I was under the impression that the actual sensor is only a passive devise & simply only a microphone. That all the filtering & count algarithums are done inside the ECU from the sensor signal input. Is there anymore test data available on how the actual sensor are different interenally. If I understand correctly the only difference show be the wire length, connector, what not.

 

[1990TSIAWDTALON]

WELL GROUP, here is the latest update from Amazon..........

"Again, thank you for ordering Standard Motor Products KS32 Knock Sensor. While we ship 99% of our orders on time or early, sometimes we fall a bit behind shipping your order because the warehouse got backed up. Either way, we know your order is a late and want to keep you updated. While you wait, if you have any questions just respond to this email or feel free to call us at +1 (800) 299-1028. If not, sit tight and our team will be working on getting you tracking information ASAP.

Thank you,

Autoplicity Customer Service "

i am still going to wait and see but just got this a little while ago.

 

[EVLGSX]

sensor itself appears to be identical in every way, wire length is different but non issue as far as reaching, plug is identical.

who know whats going on inside, all I know is it seems to work fine on my car.

Maybe Im completely wrong.......I really dont know, all I have to go by is what Ive found from trying it.

Ive been using it for over a year and I take the car out several times a week. Im constantly logging and doing pulls, in fact Im almost never not logging. This has been the case both before and after the evo sensor so Ive spent alot of time getting familiar with the sensors tendency as far as when it blips and why......both behaved the same on the same setup while changing nothing else ............ I will be certain to let you guys know how things go and if I do end up with any failures as a result of this sensors use.

 

[EVLGSX]

about the frequency the sensor is tuned for-

Im thinking there is a range the sensor is meant to cover, both sensors likely cover a similar range, one higher or lower than the other, but the evo sensor is not so far out of that range to where it still works just fine, possibly even better on an engine that is not stock........... we dont know.

Frequency output is altered as we create more power with our engines right? Possibly exceeding the range of the original sensor? IDK so Im asking

Could it be possible that this evo sensor is more appropriate for the frequency a built setup would put out?

It is possible right?

 

[Mello]

@EVLGSX I'm with you on this sensor stuff. No I do not think power changes the knock frequencies (or their harmonics). Knock frequencies are the result of the physical & machanical properties from material, size & shape. Going from 2.0 to a stoker motor would cause changes though. I'm having troubles agreeing with @motomattx on this & his rationalization is weak & doesn't make sense to me from what I've studied. Not trying to hijack this thread but I feel the EVO sensor is a option for 2G's. I think the 1G ECU is what cause the 2G sensor to not be compatible for 1G's & why 1G's can't use a 2G knock sensor.

 

[1990TSIAWDTALON]

I'd love to get my hands on a blueprint as far fetched as that sounds. But look at this 1g sensor out of my 92, you can ALMOST see all the stuff. This is a picture from months ago, if I didn't toss that sensor, I would tear it apart and take pictures.

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

 

[motomattx]

@EVLGSX I'm with you on this sensor stuff. No I do not think power changes the knock frequencies (or their harmonics). Knock frequencies are the result of the physical & machanical properties from material, size & shape. Going from 2.0 to a stoker motor would cause changes though. I'm having troubles agreeing with @motomattx on this & his rationalization is weak & doesn't make sense to me from what I've studied. Not trying to hijack this thread but I feel the EVO sensor is a option for 2G's. I think the 1G ECU is what cause the 2G sensor to not be compatible for 1G's & why 1G's can't use a 2G knock sensor.

This is not a theory or rationalization of MINE, its from the ecu manufacturers and car manufacturers themselves as well as the engineers that make aftermarket ecu's, if it makes you sleep better to convince yourself that you can run a sensor from another car in your car, go right ahead, but you wont convince me, if your running E85 you likely dont even need a knock sensor, if you ever run gasoline though you definitely do, in any event your car, your wallet, your choice, but i dont want others convinced that those sensors are the same thing, they are not, if it works for you good luck if it doesnt again good luck.

 

[EVLGSX]

I hate for this to end here, wish there was more on this

 

[motomattx]

I hate for this to end here, wish there was more on this

It would be nice, but the information is limited, with aftermarket ecu's many owners go with the Bosch donut sensor because its a wideband sensor and can read throughout a wider range.

 

[EVLGSX]

I would definitely advise anyone who chooses to use the evo sensor to be careful, pay attention to whats going on.

I wish there was a better option for this situation.

Im using pump gas with methanol to max out an evoIII 16g also. Thats all. Wish there was E85 here man. I live in a lame place.

Just to be clear here though- Im not trying to convince anyone. I am not convinced. To anyone who reads this thread- please dont be convinced!

I will say it again, I dont know........but its working for me.


If you guys really want you could find a used 2g sensor, all you have to do is stay on the classifieds, just a matter of time.

 

[DSMPT]

In my opinion, I think here nobody is wrong. Basically it is the way to think is different between two, who use a standalone ems with preferring accurate numbers and who use a stock ecu with wide range of average numbers. If strictly speaking, maybe 2G sensor and EVO 7/8/9 sensors are different since the sensor's part number is changed between EVO 1/2/3, 4/5/6 and 7/8/9, so there could be something different inside. If something different, I believe it would be the sensitivity, directivity or something like that, some improvements. If so, the output signal would be a bit different but still the same kind. So if the difference is not much and acceptable for the ECU then it should work. Sensor is just like a microphone as said, vibrating an electric plate inside (like a pic above from @1990TSIAWDTALON ) and sending signal. I guess ecu side is more different than sensor itself. like the filtering/gaining for the input level in ecu or so. As for the frequency, dsm and evo both has the same bore size and stroke, so should be the same or very close.

Before, I did a quick test to compare between the 2g sensor and the EVO 3 sensor. It was just for my curiosity. So this is nothing official and I don't/can't proof any differences mechanically/electrically. Maybe this makes nobody clear but just sharing my experience.

I use AEM series 2 on my 1g and when I rev up to high rpm in neutral like 8000-10000rpm range, the knock sensor starts to detect mechanical noises and shows some voltage movement, so I used it to compare. (As @motomattx said that Link has different configuration for 2g and EVO8 sensor, but AEM Tuner utilizes the same configuration for them. Not sure but I imagine it is because AEM utilizes 0-5 volt to show knocks)

With the same configuration for the both sensors and used Plex knock monitor with a Bosch sensor to make sure that the noise level is similar each time.
I rev up to around 8500 and held for a couple of seconds and compared the voltage range and the knock raw signal movement between 2g sensor and EVO 3 sensor. And it was similar (can't say it was the same this is because this never been the same even with the same sensor). According to the result, I think it can be said 2g sensor and EVO 1/2/3 sensor are functionally almost the same. (I personally believe they are the same sensor with different wire length).

 

[b00st3d]

I ran an evo sensor with 91oct for 2 years in my 98 Talon. I never experienced any problem, although I have seen that some people have seen phantom knock in the 4k rpm range. Based off my personal experience I'll run one in the spyder too. It worked fine for me and I'm not a grandma driver. YMMV.