The 14b Drag Race Discussion Thread

[TSimage]

I'd recomend feeding the 14b from the head using a stainless line. Remove the stock feed line, it has a restrictor built into it. The restrictor doesn't supply enough oil when the turbo is pushed really hard.

BTW I also like 4 spider center diffs. A welded center diff will send almost all power to the rear wheels on a hard launch, and the Tcase, rear axles, and driveshaft can't handle that much power.

You coulda mentioned that when I had the manifold off the car..

 

[Phil1320]

Feed the 14b oil from the head, too much oil pressure is what kills turbo seals.

Synthetic, well, I'd rather just say using a quality oil wouldn't hurt anything.

Frequent oil changes are a must on a car you drive hard anyways.

The track night didn't exactly go off as planned. We got there, begging and pleading it wouldn't rain on our parade. Sprinkled just a touch then quit so we got lined up to go. My buddy took his Ninja out and ran himself an 11.57 @ 122, not bad for a first timer. My night didn't go so well.

I set up and launched as usual, car gripped great as I started slipping the clutch out, apparently it gripped too good. It felt as if something gave up and I felt that feeling of fwd tire spin mode again and immediately let off as I started hearing a clunking sound. I pulled over to the side and found that I had snapped not one, but both U-joints on the driveshaft. Thanks to some awesome folks out there I managed to borrow a jack and a socket in order to pull my T-case and drive home in fwd mode...again.

Damn That sucks.....but, on the flip side, you are weeding out all the weak links.....at least you were able to drive home and get the next track visit without having to pay again.

I'd recomend feeding the 14b from the head using a stainless line. Remove the stock feed line, it has a restrictor built into it. The restrictor doesn't supply enough oil when the turbo is pushed really hard.

BTW I also like 4 spider center diffs. A welded center diff will send almost all power to the rear wheels on a hard launch, and the Tcase, rear axles, and driveshaft can't handle that much power.

Dave--I installed a welded viscous years ago per someones recommendation and absolutely hated it. It did exactly what you are saying, blazed the rear tires.......it was in the car less than one week. Been doing just fine without it. Would love the security of a 4 spider diff though, ya know, to harness that MONSTER power my car makes

 

[SBstar]

I think I've proved what a welded differential will do haha! Although it will help with better 60fts. it also is great for breaking things.

 

[YZFR1]

Damn it ..just bought a kit for $30 to feed oil from filter. Never seem to win with these things..

Do you guys think the pressure be still too high if i also use an in-line oil filter with it? Or something else to help with the pressure drop? Should be like a double wammy if that did work!!



Other than that i still have to finish porting my 7cm and match it to mani. Just ordered some ARP turbo bolts and a return line gasket. Can't wait to put it all together, just trying to do it right the first time around though.

 

[Phil1320]

Appreciate the welcoming!!

Originally, i intented to push for more boost and less timing. However, now with all this talk about 14b's blowing up and all at high psi range. I think it might be wiser to go for lower boost, higher timing numbers.

I know this has already been briefly touched upon in this thread but i'll ask anyways someone with some knowledge on the subject. What are some or all of the things we could do to help us save our 14b and make sure it stays sucking for a long time?

1. Feeding it oil from the filter side
2. More frequent oil changes
3. Mixing in 1qt or so of synthetic into the mix

Anything else?

Definitely, this is a pretty fun thread to be on and there's alot of knowledge flowing around here.......I run 100% synthetic oil.......I've run as much as 23.5 psi but run a solid 21 right now. Don't think I want to run it up to 24-25 or pull the wastegate line like some do. As much as I'm interested in improving my ET, doing that and blowing the turbo for a one shot run isn't worth it to me. I've had a long run so far and want to keep it going as long as I can, or until I decide I've reached the max potential.

I think I've proved what a welded differential will do haha! Although it will help with better 60fts. it also is great for breaking things.

This is what I was told years back with the welded viscous---"better 60 fts". That may be so, but it just plain didn't suit my driving style at the time. Although I did hear about the added stress to the driveline. I was quicker without it. I never really had any problems launching the car. When it was a street car I was fine with low 1.7's and the occasional high 1.6.

 

[SBstar]

Well the trans was built specially for me and I was told it was the way to go by a reputable trans shop. I think in the end it'll be the best choice, but I'll find the weak links along the way. I'm also considering the fact the 2600 isn't the best choice for damaging driveline parts either though haha! I picked up some U-joints today to replace the ones so I can get the car back on the road, but after reading about parts store U-joints not taking any abuse I'll probably grab my spare driveshaft and rebuild it with OEM ones and a new yolk from JNZtuning, going to call them monday about the availability of OEM u-joints or if I have to buy their complete "recall kit" to get the one that is included with the yolk. I'm not surprised or upset about breaking the 20 year old stockers on the car though, old rusted crap is going to break under stress, it's just an excuse to replace it and make it stronger in my opinion.


As for YZFR1, you can make or get restrictors if you're deadset on running the oil feed line you just purchased, or call up bonehead performance and order their budget line kit from the head, I personally got it on sale for 18 bucks which is probably close to what the restrictor will cost you (unsure never bought one).

 

[pneumo]

Right now I'm running a 16g with the oil feed from the OFH with no problem. I'm using a typical -3AN line. I think an inline filter should reduce the pressure slightly, not much.

 

[tstkl]

Right now I'm running a 16g with the oil feed from the OFH with no problem. I'm using a typical -3AN line. I think an inline filter should reduce the pressure slightly, not much.

The FP oil filters will reduce the pressure, even the journal bearing one has a small orifice drilled into it raher than a full -4an line or whatever it is.

 

[Phil1320]

Well the trans was built specially for me and I was told it was the way to go by a reputable trans shop. I think in the end it'll be the best choice, but I'll find the weak links along the way. I'm also considering the fact the 2600 isn't the best choice for damaging driveline parts either though haha! I picked up some U-joints today to replace the ones so I can get the car back on the road, but after reading about parts store U-joints not taking any abuse I'll probably grab my spare driveshaft and rebuild it with OEM ones and a new yolk from JNZtuning, going to call them monday about the availability of OEM u-joints or if I have to buy their complete "recall kit" to get the one that is included with the yolk. I'm not surprised or upset about breaking the 20 year old stockers on the car though, old rusted crap is going to break under stress, it's just an excuse to replace it and make it stronger in my opinion.
QUOTE]

I hear you, everyone has different likes and opinions on this. The other thing is that I love to turn corners, so welded diff or viscous was not for me either way. My car was a street car then and spent more time on the street than the track. A four spider diff would be the only consideration for me. And as much as my car is no longer a street car, at some point it will see some road course work, so, no "drag only" mods for my car.....like one gallon fuel cell, etc. At least not yet. I just can't bring myself to make it a 100% drag car. There's just not enough seat time in drag racing for me to do that. And to spend huge amounts of money to spend less time racing(quicker ET's) just doesn't make sense. As much as I used to really love the thrill of lining up with another car and running, drag racing is alot of sitting around and not much racing at all. It's definitely cool to see the fruits of your labor result in a quicker ET in the form of that timeslip being handed to you, and the path that takes you there can be fun, but, there's just not a huge amount of seat time that goes with it. Dollar for dollar, not alot of return, unless of course you are competing at a level that pays you when you win, and gives a trophy to throw on the shelf.

You will definitely find all the weak points along the way for sure, eventually they will all be eliminated and then you can be consistent.

 

[9!'clipseDOHC]

I just took my car out, I haven't driven it in about two weeks, and Wow! It feels like 13's for sure!!! I've been fixing some more boost leaks over the past week and was adjusting the MBC today and it feels great! My question is: Is 10.8-10.9 AFR at full WOT considered safe? Thats what I'm hitting at 15-16 psi. I don't have a logger yet because dsmlink is next and I'm saving up.

 

[SBstar]

I would consider that a safe AFR even on 93 octane. Many are running much leaner afr's, especially on any kind of race gas. The key is to watch your knock count as well and tune from there.

 

[SBR Joe]

Keep an eye out for an update from me this coming Friday! Track time babyyy! Also, i got a sponsorship from DNP, so hello free tubular manifold! Also got the torque solution front engine mount on, and the front crossmember urethane bushings in, that ought to benefit me a good bit in the 60' area .

Only stipulation is i have to sell 5 of their manifolds in return for the help, which is no problem. So anyone looking for a SICK manifold upgrade, keep an eye out for a killer group buy offer from me!

The car is RIPPING. If im lucky, my buddy will have his slicks, and ill be able to borrow his Weds sport wheels and good sticky Kuhmos and really rock it like its 1999, but either way, i cant predict anything slower than an 11.9 with how the car is set up, and feels, compared to the last shake down run a few months ago.

 

[Phil1320]

I just took my car out, I haven't driven it in about two weeks, and Wow! It feels like 13's for sure!!! I've been fixing some more boost leaks over the past week and was adjusting the MBC today and it feels great! My question is: Is 10.8-10.9 AFR at full WOT considered safe? Thats what I'm hitting at 15-16 psi. I don't have a logger yet because dsmlink is next and I'm saving up.

When I was running no fuel control at all, just the stock ECU controlling, my car would run rich and never went leaner than 10.8:1 so you are fine as SBstar says.....

 

[9!'clipseDOHC]

Thanks SBstar and Phil. That's good to hear. Hopefully I will have a great update (13's!!!) by the end of the day! By the way, I'm on 91 octane as that is as high as I can get out here.

 

[Phil1320]

Thanks SBstar and Phil. That's good to hear. Hopefully I will have a great update (13's!!!) by the end of the day! By the way, I'm on 91 octane as that is as high as I can get out here.

Anytime. Looking forward to it! Good luck!

 

[9!'clipseDOHC]

Well no great update. I couldn't get anything to work no matter what I tried. I made 8 passes with a best of 14.7 @ 97.48 with a 2.393 60'.

My 14.3 @ 101.1 run in San Antonio was a 2.439 60'. Granted it was a different track but ???

Most of my passes were low 15's which was very disappointing and I had the hardest time getting a launch. I was averaging like 2.6 second 60'ers.

It seems like something isn't quite right even though the car feels good.

 

[SBstar]

It's all about that 60ft. Even on street tires you should be able to get that down to the 2.1-2.2 arena. You're going to have to keep playing with tire pressures and launch rpms to figure out what is going to work best for you. After that you can start worrying about making more power.

 

[YZFR1]

Definitely, this is a pretty fun thread to be on and there's alot of knowledge flowing around here.......I run 100% synthetic oil.......I've run as much as 23.5 psi but run a solid 21 right now. Don't think I want to run it up to 24-25 or pull the wastegate line like some do. As much as I'm interested in improving my ET, doing that and blowing the turbo for a one shot run isn't worth it to me. I've had a long run so far and want to keep it going as long as I can, or until I decide I've reached the max potential.

Ditto that man. It stops being as much fun ones you start breaking your bank! Definetly not worth it for a one shot deal..

I wonder if it is somehow possible to beef up the 14b? I think it really sucks being limited so much without exceeding the potential of the turbo.


As for the feedline, i might as well come up with something since i've already purchased it. Those FP filters that were suggested sound pretty interesting i suppose. Thanks for the feedback guys!

 

[SBstar]

I've talked to FP before about their "monster thrust bearing" and potentially doing that to a 14b, apparently they do that to 16g's to help them cope with being pushed so hard. Not exactly a cheap option with rebuild though.

Pulling my exhaust I snapped the stud off the O2 housing, I would've been more careful but I had to get back from the track that night and was in a hurry to get the T-case off. Got that fixed up along with installing the new "used" driveshaft, hopefully this one will hold up, still thinking about ordering new U-joints for it though. I also developed a power steering leak from the rack, so this morning all the power steering stuff got pulled, car is NOT easy to turn with that tiny steering wheel so I may be getting a stock steering wheel from my buddy who just picked up a new shell. I'll be looking around for a manual rack but just surviving with it this way for now. Provided everything holds up I want to get back to the track on wednesday!

 

[Phil1320]

I've talked to FP before about their "monster thrust bearing" and potentially doing that to a 14b, apparently they do that to 16g's to help them cope with being pushed so hard. Not exactly a cheap option with rebuild though.

Pulling my exhaust I snapped the stud off the O2 housing, I would've been more careful but I had to get back from the track that night and was in a hurry to get the T-case off. Got that fixed up along with installing the new "used" driveshaft, hopefully this one will hold up, still thinking about ordering new U-joints for it though. I also developed a power steering leak from the rack, so this morning all the power steering stuff got pulled, car is NOT easy to turn with that tiny steering wheel so I may be getting a stock steering wheel from my buddy who just picked up a new shell. I'll be looking around for a manual rack but just surviving with it this way for now. Provided everything holds up I want to get back to the track on wednesday!

Good stuff. Go kick some azz! I still run a power rack with a loop from feed to return. I run a 13.8" MOMO wheel, but, I don't drive the car everyday, so it's tolerable for me......

 

[pneumo]

IIRC the cheapest way to get new OEM Mitsu U-joints is to buy 3 yolk kits. The kit comes with a new U-joint and circlips. For some reason buying the U-joint by itself cost more.

 

[SBR Joe]

I've talked to FP before about their "monster thrust bearing" and potentially doing that to a 14b, apparently they do that to 16g's to help them cope with being pushed so hard. Not exactly a cheap option with rebuild though.

Pulling my exhaust I snapped the stud off the O2 housing, I would've been more careful but I had to get back from the track that night and was in a hurry to get the T-case off. Got that fixed up along with installing the new "used" driveshaft, hopefully this one will hold up, still thinking about ordering new U-joints for it though. I also developed a power steering leak from the rack, so this morning all the power steering stuff got pulled, car is NOT easy to turn with that tiny steering wheel so I may be getting a stock steering wheel from my buddy who just picked up a new shell. I'll be looking around for a manual rack but just surviving with it this way for now. Provided everything holds up I want to get back to the track on wednesday!

Im gonna try and convince them to do an HTA upgrade to my 14b

 

[SBR Joe]

It's all about that 60ft. Even on street tires you should be able to get that down to the 2.1-2.2 arena. You're going to have to keep playing with tire pressures and launch rpms to figure out what is going to work best for you. After that you can start worrying about making more power.

Got that right. I was running 12.0-11.9 traps, but running 12.5 ETs because at the time, stock suspension and crap tires couldnt cut better than a 1.83 60'.

 

[DJ23GSX]

Well no great update. I couldn't get anything to work no matter what I tried. I made 8 passes with a best of 14.7 @ 97.48 with a 2.393 60'.

My 14.3 @ 101.1 run in San Antonio was a 2.439 60'. Granted it was a different track but ???

Most of my passes were low 15's which was very disappointing and I had the hardest time getting a launch. I was averaging like 2.6 second 60'ers.

It seems like something isn't quite right even though the car feels good.

I've been down the fwd road before. It was very frustrating for me. Hopefully you have a bit more patience than I did . Its gonna take some seat time to tame those 60' times but once you do the end result should be pretty satisfying.

 

[SBstar]

IIRC the cheapest way to get new OEM Mitsu U-joints is to buy 3 yolk kits. The kit comes with a new U-joint and circlips. For some reason buying the U-joint by itself cost more.

Thanks, that is what I've found too. JNZ seems to have the best pricing on it.