fast spoolin 450whp turbo?

[Fear]

have read some threads about the subject but not really found what i´m looking for.
engine spec is basicly a 7bolt evo3 engine with a ported head, e9 pistons/rods. will run on 98oct. dsm flange, evo x, t3 or other doesnt matter. most important is turbo supports around 450whp and as fast spooling on 4g63 as possible, also not interrested in big truck turbos like holset or chinese.
thanks!

 

[Black95TSIawd]

If you have E85, the the evo 16g is your best bet. For a little more peak power, a td06 20g. There is nothing else out there that will spool like this and make the same power.

 

[babyviper]

FP turbos spool fast, check out the FP-green and the red. 68HTA is awesome as well.

 

[counti41]

get a 6262 or 5858 with a .63ar turbine housing make sure yourexhaust manifold is a small one. and bty i had a holset hx35 with a 12cm holset turbine that was getting 30 psi by 2800rpm. on a 6bolt bottom head with 2gcylinder head on stock cams. what are you going for. run smaller cams to spool faster as well. what are you gonna be using the car for.

 

[counti41]

if wou wanna rev a bit higher and make more power contact Web Cam to make you a rally cam short duration high lift. if you run big cams you loose spool. get hx35 with small housing or pte 5858 with small turbine and youll spool so quick you'll shit yourself both have enough balls to get you 600whp.

 

[counti41]

http://www.dsmtuners.com/threads/hx35s-and-hx40s-w-or-w-o-turbine-housings.479293/

 

[SonySlave]

The 68HTA or HTAGreen from FP are fairly inexpensive (compared to their other offerings) and will reach the 450hp mark you're looking for. The 68HTA will likely need 30+psi to reach the 450hp mark but it can do it. The Green will do 450hp easy but spool a bit slower than the 68HTA. Both use a standard DSM turbine housing.

 

[camfast]

Fp Green HTA

 

[My1GLaser]

Bolt-on 7blade HX35. I wouldn't call it a big truck turbo since it really had excellent street manners! It's been years since I switched it to T3, but I believe I was hitting 25+psi by 3800 in 3rd gear. I was getting around 50lb/min back then. It spooled faster than the FP18g6SL2 I replaced it with! It spooled faster than my buddy's 20g powered 2g I rode in! Later on I was able to switch to T3 and maxed out the compressor at 59-60 lb/min at 37-38psi. Loved the turbo and ran it for 4 years before I outgrew it and just switched to a Super 40!!!

 

[mowgli5555]

I am going with an MHI TD05 20g with similar ideas in mind. Although, I am going to keep the boost down until I can afford a better transmission set up.
The E316g was the turbo I was looking for originally, but locally found a 7 blade HX-35 in sweet condition.
While searching for a used dsm housing & 02 housing for the HX-35, I found the MHI 20g.

It was an external waste gate set up and still required a new O2 housing or exhaust manifold.
If I had to do it again, I would probably just have run the HX-35 since usually they can be found by anyone, locally. Josh

 

[jbeaton9292]

what is wrong with going hx35 it will get you where you want to be and get you there cheaply and easily and they spool fast almost like a big 16g in my opinion it is the best street friendly turbo setup yet its very reliable too just think cummins trucks are known for well over 300k miles and them turbos take a beating on them trucks they are alot more displacment obviously and they run 20ish psi stock and if you have ever drove a deisel with a bad turbo they have no balls what so ever so they have a great peak power

i had this turbo on my built 1g and it was a very fun turbo i would do it again if i were going to build another dsm but next build is gonna be an evo8 and not a daily so im going big!

 

[Fear]

thanx for all replys!
i have some experiences of holsets and can get hold of both standard or super hx35/40s cheap, they are probably a good & cheap choice. what i meant were that they are kind of big & bulky & i know there are smaller turbos that will get me where i want, if there isnt a big advantage in spool & power with the holset i wouldnt go that way.
the car will not be a daily driver but will be driven on the street so i dont want it to be too laggy. also will run on pump 98, no e85, the cams will be evo3 if i wont need other?
the pt 6262 seems way to big for my goals and the e316g way to small?
i have a mhi td05-20g on the shelf but figured it wouldnt get me where i want on pump & probaby not easy either?
i really thought people would recommend something like a td06 20-25g or something?

but since the best choice seems to be the fp green or the holset hx35, if compared to each other what are the pros and cons? which would spool faster and how much power can they make?

 

[911gdsmboostin]

Little off subject where in the world are you getting 98 Oct gas on the pump??

 

[911gdsmboostin]

Ohh wait.. Your in Europe! You get 98 Oct on the pump!? That be awesome!!

 

[Fear]

i read about different RON or something(dont really know alot about it) but our 98 might not be all that different from your 93? even though it sounds like racefuel in comparison

 

[911gdsmboostin]

I can get 100& 110 on the pump down the street its considered race gas and it cost almost 9-10$ a gallon

 

[jbeaton9292]

i would say go holset but then again ive never used the fp green but i personally didnt think the holset was all that bulky i had it on my qg and didnt have to modify anything it fit right in there i was very happy with it and the spool was very impressive and they love high boost so you can crank it up and push it hard and it will love it that is what they do all day on cummins trucks they are pretty impressive

now on the other hand a lot and i mean a lot of people have made great numbers on the fp green and with that being said i would take it by price if you talking a new fp green hta turbo its gonna cost you a pretty penny $800 with no port work no oil feed or drain just the turbo its self where you can get a hx35 used have it rebuilt get it ported and get a new oil feed and return and spend odds are less then the fp green and being ported and all that will odds are put out better numbers with it

so my vote would be the holset simply because its cheap good power and very very streetable

 

[counti41]

What cams are you running as i said before that has a great affect on how you spool a turbo. the bigger cams you have the slower you spool but the more you have up top. the smaller cams the faster you spool and loose top end. thing rally car turbo response(small cams) vs dragster(big cams) turbo spool. what are you doing with the car? i know you said not daily driven. in my its my opinion and experience that ive seen quicker spool than any fp turbo even the hta68 with my Holset running stock cams.

1. Stock 7bolt bottom 2g head stock head and cams, e316g)21psi at 3100rpm 310whp 346tq)
2. Built 6bolt bottom 2g head stock head and cams,e316g: 26psi by 3200rpm best of 340whp and 367tq)
3. Built 6bolt bottom 2g head stock head and cams, Holset hx35/W holset 12cm turbine 30psi at 2800rpm 510whp 450tq
4. Built 6bolt bottom 1g head stock head and cams, Holset hx35/W holset 18cm turbine)36psi at 3800rpm 570whp 531tq
5. Built 6bolt bottom 1g head stock head and GSC S2 cams,PTE 6266 W .86 turbine)30psi at 4000rpm 660whp 548tq
6. Aluminum rod built 6bolt bottom built 1g head head and GSC S2 cams,PTE 6266 W .86 turbine)45psi at 4600rpm ???whp ???tq)

 

[CrackedDSM]

Holy, 510whp/450tq. Plus 30psi at 2800rpm? Was that a 2.0L or a 2.3L? I assume that was using a divided manifold as well? That sounds like it'd be an incredible powerband for the street. You don't have a log I could view do you? Because if you're spooling like that on a 2.0L w/divided setup I may want to just jump straight to the HX40 w/ T4 17cm TS housing/divided manifold. I planned on trying out an HX35 first but that fast of a spool + torquey 2.4 would be a transmission killer.

 

[My1GLaser]

It's will kill transmissions without being a 2.4! I'm on tranny number 6 in 4 years. I just switched from a T3 7 blade 35 to the Super 40 in a BEP T3 .70 A/R housing. It's not really noticeably laggier when going WOT from a decent RPM (3500ish) It pulls incredibly hard up top and doesn't have the huge torque hit of the HX35 when it reaches full boost. (will save trannies) It's not as linear of a spool up as I would have thought a 60mm turbo would have! It still reaches full boost very fast from the time it sees 5-10 psi. The Super 40 isn't really any less streetable and I ran the HX35 for 4 years in the .55, .63 and .70 housing.

 

[JusMX141]

FP turbos spool fast, check out the FP-green and the red. 68HTA is awesome as well.

The Green and Red are both 4000+ spoolers. I wouldn't exactly call either of those a "fast spooling" turbo option based on the builder alone.


Depending what you're looking to spend; if you want to want something more direct-fit, a billet TD06SL2 20G would get you there....a HX35 in a Bullseye housing if you're not afraid of an external gate and fitting some oil lines. If you have really deep pockets, a DSM76 from FP is likely your best bet.

No reason to rule out a "big truck turbo" like HX35 or S256 which would do everything you're looking to do just because of where it came from...that's not thinking outside the box too well.

 

[counti41]

Holy, 510whp/450tq. Plus 30psi at 2800rpm? Was that a 2.0L or a 2.3L? I assume that was using a divided manifold as well? That sounds like it'd be an incredible powerband for the street. You don't have a log I could view do you? Because if you're spooling like that on a 2.0L w/divided setup I may want to just jump straight to the HX40 w/ T4 17cm TS housing/divided manifold. I planned on trying out an HX35 first but that fast of a spool + torquey 2.4 would be a transmission killer.

It was undevided t3 manifold with a stock divided holset with lots of contouring and port work. i made sure it was knifed perfectly and the taper was almost perfect into the volute. it was a 2.0 with 2g head. gasket matched intake and exhaust but otherwise stock head with stock cams. it was a fun setup for street racing but it was also my daily and driving at 80mph at 3200rpm the slightest tip-in on the throttle and you're boosting. sucked for gas mileage. with the larger turbine and 1g head i was averaging 34mpg at 80mph cruising in vacuum. and close to 40mpg cruising at 65mph. made it to Vegas from Phoenix on 3/4 tank thats about 350miles. make sure you do some port matching make the turbine housing slightly bigger than the gasket and as perfect as you can. it helps with the spool alot. thats how i was able to get mine to spool so quickly. i sold my hx35 to some guy with a supra and he called me asking how quick it was supposed to spool after i sold it to him, he said it spooled way too quick for him for being such a large turbo. positive shifts will keep you from breaking shit. don't have to be the quickest shift. missing shifts kills transmissions. its only till my last setup that i actually finally got a built trans.

 

[counti41]

whatever turbo setup you choose. choose wisely. me skillful and precise and port match(i normally port with a small lip after the gasket(discharge side of gasket.) create a step. go as large as you can or even match the gaskets inlet side(head to gasket) and the inlet size perfectly but leaving a lip on the discharge side creates less turbulence and increases velocity. thats why you also gotta try and knife edge if using an undivided manifold and create or accentuate the velocity stack design at the inlet of the turbine housing. it will make and for me has made a 2-300rpm difference in spool characteristics. it was all trial and error. and all done over weekends as the car was my daily for a few years.

 

[Seamus]

Got a lig of 30 psi at 2800 rpm. What gear is that in?

 

[Fear]

counti//
honestly i really dont know what i´ll be using the car for? i got a drag car, a daily driver, this car doesn´t really fit a purpouse other than i think it would be a cool build and i really like it? i just would like it to have a wide powerband and not to much lag. the engine got the cams, intake manifold/thr body and a ported head from evo 3, pistons & rods evo 9.
i gotta say the comparison you made between your builds was awesome and made it easy for me. feels like the hx35 would be a really good choice for me, also i really appreciate all your input you put in my thread! thanx a lot!

any thoughts regarding turbine housing size with my engine spec in mind?
i can also get a new super hx35 real cheap but that i´m thinking it might be overkill for me and make it laggier for no reason?

justin//
thanx for the suggestions!
direct fit is allways nice, on the other hand if i get better results with a custom made setup i have no problem with some fabrication.
i think you missunderstood me or maybe i didn´t make myself clear (i´m swedish by the way so my spelling and grammar may not allways be correct)
i wasn´t bashing the hx35 when i said "a big truck turbo" i meant the outer dimensions of the turbo are rather big as of all truck turbos i´ve encountered hx, gt, and so on.
this engine & drivetrain from 2g is going into an peugeot 206 (wrc wide body), and if i got more or less bolt on mhi/fp turbo it would be about as compact engine package as possible. with a bigger turbo i may need to make changes to the body if possible (have only testfitted an 4g63 engine without ex mani/turbo and there isn´t all that much extra room in the enginebay)
with that said if i could get as good results with a bolt on mhi, fp or so on i would go that way but with your statement the fp spools at 4000rpm versus countis hx35 spooling @ 2800rpm it´s definetly worth to fit the hx35 and make the necessary fabricating.
also would a cast exh mf and bulleye housing make a lot of differece in spool versus an equal length tube header & t3 turbine housing?