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Evo 3 16G "GT"?

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No the power would not decrease , but inadvertadly increase considering that this N/A motor has already made 450 on the motor. Any true race car builder will state to build the engine like it was an N/A car. Start with the rotating mass ,get into forged rods, higher spec cams and work with fully building up the block and tranny befor you even start playing around with the turbo.

Because most dsmers arent building a race car the e316g is a perfect fit for their needs.

In regards to displacement , a turbo will flow an X amount of air per second, and yes a turbo depending on what "level" of tune the car is in - might become a restriction , but then again those standards might lead to f-1 caliber cars. The only difference in displacement is how much exhaust is being fed to the turbo at a given time . It's safe to say that a 2.3L will exhale X amount of gas vs. a 2L's Y amount of gas at a given amount of time. X being more gas then y.

Point being a turbo is their to use the spent gases from the engine to force more air into the cumbustion chamber hence equalling more power.

In regards to this "gt turbo" I would like to see how it would stalk up to weekly abuse any other normal turbo would see.

I wonder if their would be any shaft play after a certain amount of miles.
Can it hold psi from 10 unto 24 psi realiabely?
Their are alot of things I wont knock,, until I have first hand knowledge.

A turbo is a turbo and if it come's with a warrenty then maybe some one should try it and see for them selves.

I will state this though I highly doubt that the same materials will be used for the housing /blades making this ultimately an inferior clone to it's predoccessor the e316g.

I first read this thread because I was actually contimplating what could be a great new evo turbo.

So I asked myself what if you could use the evo 6.5 center section and mate it to a modified evo3 housing? hmm :confused:
 
Well, wouldn't the simple fact that trying to force all of a 455hp NA motor's exhaust flow through a Mitsubishi 7cm2 housing cause adverse affects on that engine?
 
I wish Slowboy would have tested the EVOIII 16g on a normal 2.0 Liter motor. Why do I say that? Because both Engine Analyzer Pro and Dyno 2000 show a 15-30 h.p. DROP starting at 5000 rpm for a 2.3 Liter stroker as compared to a 2.0 Liter, NOT an increase. The airflow limit of the turbo at this point is irrelevant because the horsepower difference between the 2.0 Liter and 2.3 Liter is due to cylinder wall frictional losses. I wonder if they could have hit 415-430 w.h.p. if they ran a 2.0L?
 
prostreetdsmx1 said:
they do indeed come with a 1yr. warranty so it does allow you to be a little at ease, i haven't ruled them out as "junk" i just am going to wait until we get to really put one through the trenches before i pass any kind of judgement.

Who is going to Warranty it?

You?

Turbochargers.com?

The Chinese army?

Are you kidding me?

MGH
 
I would like to know how many pounds of air they were flowing and at what ambient temperature-so I would know how much more if any potential there was to the turbo. notice they didn't run that much boost and the motor was only 7.8 compression. I wonder if with colder air and a smim and more boost they could have made more power-it all depends on if it was maxing out its airflow on the setup they had. I would also like to know what timing and a/f ratio they were running and actual temps of air going into the intake manifold. All just because I am trying to max out a evo3 that I have from slowboy-trying to see if 400-420whp is possible with water/alcohol injection on this turbo at 44-45 lbs airflow on 93 octane with 20-30 degree ambient air.
 
TalonRcR said:
Well shit time to bolt one on my car and see what happens :) my turbo is about to take a shit so it will be a good test. See how long it lasts. :thumb: :dsm:

Chris

this last quote was post#48 and posted on 1/27/05

User can be left out of this.. posted on 1/28/05

I just got off the phone with logic and they said that the GT will come with the same warranty as the EvoIII. They've been using one for 10k and haven't had a problem yet. So I guess we will just have to see what happens. But if this GT turbo does come with a warranty I'd like to try one. Worst case, it breaks, and I just exchange for the MHI evo. If it doesn't, I have a turbo that "might put out" slightly better numbers than the evo for a bit cheaper. Logic also said these are or "should" stand up to punishment like the MHI evo. I guess we'll have to wait until the numbers are out.

Now something tells me unless they drove back and forth across the country twice, and did that under 36hrs and still had time to bolt that turbo on.. something just doesnt jive with that story! .. I have drove across the country before.. it took 42hrs none stop one way a little over 3k miles :thumb:

Thanks
Mark
SBR
 
And you got clocked doing 107 mph in the state of WA because you are a fool and the Montana state police let me off with a warning for 100 + mph blow by HA-HA.

Cragger
 
This is a response form SSAutochrome in regards to the evo III variant they sell.

"We have a good reputation - unless you are talking about the flame posts
>on that TURBO that is CRACKED in half that is not even ours
>so - go ahead - believe everything you read - and only believe one side
>
>
>thanks"

:rolleyes: :rolleyes:
 
As a dsmer i would like to say thank you to all the Vendor's for clearing up this problem. It's nice to know you guys care more for us than you do for making money. I am looking in to buying an Evo316g in the future and this has definitely influenced my decision. RU2SLOW, you better take good care of that turbo and have fun considering you got it for an outstanding price. Thanks again everyone! DSMers ROCK!
 
Listen, I'll break it down a LITTLE bit for y'all: This is ALL ABOUT SlowBoy Racing hating TC.COM and vice versa. These turbos DO NOT come from China like SAS Auto Chrome's turbos, check your facts...I've seen these turbos myself, and they are BETTER than MHI turbos simply due to the fact that MHI uses total crap metals to make their turbine and center housings. Anyone ever seen a new 14b turbo, I mean brand new? I have-the castings are total shite! The wastegate flapper port is horrible looking, to say the least. MHI turbos are not exactly the best in the universe, man.....The EVOIII GT turbo has a higher nickel concentration than the MHI turbo, thus lesser chance of cracking. The EVOIII GT turbo was tested for EIGHT days of constant load at 850 degrees ambient temperature and didn't fail or crack.....keep in mind people, turbos are NOT overly complex. As long as the quality of materials is good, you're ok. Turbos don't fail becuase they skip time, a turbo is a fan that spins on bearings. What matters is attention to detail of the manufacturer-I'll take the time and gut one of these turbos some time next week, and if I can find even ONE flaw on one surface, I'll post it, but judging by the castings alone, I think these turbos are BETTER than Mitsubishis. Doesn't anyone remember reading about mitsubishi getting sued because their Televisions caught on fire? I have a 1gDSM that is a PIECE OF JUNK, albeit a fast one-mitsubishi is not hard to improve on. Anyone seen the exhaust inlet on a unported EVOIII? Looks like hell.... just my 2 cents....
 
As far as buying the turbo itself, Turbochargers.com wanted me to fax them a copy of my credit car. F*** that I ordered from Extremepsi. Got an EVO III ported w/ a 34mm wastegate, not the EVO III GT.
 
Tech9Talon said:
As far as buying the turbo itself, Turbochargers.com wanted me to fax them a copy of my credit car. F*** that I ordered from Extremepsi. No offense to slow boy.
Should have just bought one on ebay, man. They're all over there.
 
As I said in a previous post, just because it's an MHI turbo does not deem it bulletproof. They're designed for OEM, low boost use and we're running 20+psi with them. The bottom line is that MAYBE these knock-offs will prove to be as reliable, or prehaps even better than the Mitsus. Maybe not. What pisses me (and SBR and the other vendors who sell the real deal) is the deceptive marketing of this imitation. Now that the cat's out of the bag, everyone's back-pedalling but the fact remains that they took people's cash under the presumption that it was a MHI turbo. Not to mention the fact that they're not really any cheaper. If they were introduced as an aftermarket alternative to the EVO3 for say $400, maybe more people would be comfortable experimenting - but let the buyer know what he's getting instead of blatantly misrepresenting the product.
 
Steve93Talon said:
As I said in a previous post, just because it's an MHI turbo does not deem it bulletproof. They're designed for OEM, low boost use and we're running 20+psi with them. The bottom line is that MAYBE these knock-offs will prove to be as reliable, or prehaps even better than the Mitsus. Maybe not. What pisses me (and SBR and the other vendors who sell the real deal) is the deceptive marketing of this imitation. Now that the cat's out of the bag, everyone's back-pedalling but the fact remains that they took people's cash under the presumption that it was a MHI turbo. Not to mention the fact that they're not really any cheaper. If they were introduced as an aftermarket alternative to the EVO3 for say $400, maybe more people would be comfortable experimenting - but let the buyer know what he's getting instead of blatantly misrepresenting the product.
Yeah, to mis represent this turbo as a mitsu turbo is pretty wrong, I 100% agree. Isn't that illegal?
What pisses slow boy and the other vendors off is the fact that they hate tc.com, period. It has nothing to do with justice or truth or any crap like that, SBR and tc.com hate each other, and SBR only piped in on this thread to damadge tc.com-it's purely business, and it's a revenge thing. When tc.com told everyone that SBR completely stole a bunch of turbos and a full race block, I guess SBR has a right to get back at them.
 
I'm not taking any sides here, but on turbochargers.com home page it still says this about the GT turbo:

This Evo 3 Big 16G turbo is sold also as a GT model. Both turbos have smaller turbine scroll for quicker spool up. The GT turbo at $580.00 is the same turbo with the additions of a full port job and 34 mm waste gate port and flapper disc.
(emphasis added)
To me, that seems misrepresentative.
 
T3r80 said:
Yeah, to mis represent this turbo as a mitsu turbo is pretty wrong, I 100% agree. Isn't that illegal?
What pisses slow boy and the other vendors off is the fact that they hate tc.com, period. It has nothing to do with justice or truth or any crap like that, SBR and tc.com hate each other, and SBR only piped in on this thread to damadge tc.com-it's purely business, and it's a revenge thing. When tc.com told everyone that SBR completely stole a bunch of turbos and a full race block, I guess SBR has a right to get back at them.


wait a minute.. I have to disagree.. We are only discussing the misrepresentation here.. It has nothing to do with Vendor hates, not even entertaining that subject. But, on the concept of these GT 16gs. We are upset about the naming and claims as to what they are. We (SBR) may even end up offering these turbos.. BUT, it will have the correct labeling of the product if we do. AS for the material these turbos are made.. get them analyzed. The TRUE Evo 3 16g has a higher nickel content over the preceeding small and big 16g. You can see that in the color of the turbine housing. So if MHI sucks so bad as someone stated earlier, why did the engineers change this? If MHI is so bad... how many people have had a 16g of any size (small, big, evo3) have any problems unless induced by something else?? i bet a handful. And there are thousands of 16gs out on the market. So dont be so quick to bash MHI. As for quality and analyzing the "gt" turbo.. I bet only 15% of the DSMers on here know what material is used to make the turbine wheels in EVO3 16gs .. and would anyone notice if in these "gt" turbos they used something of lessor quality? Mitsu electronics and MHI are two different companies. not worth comparing.. Ford had roll over issues with the explorer Did everyone stop buying them ??? NO.. All this thread was to explain to DSMers that this is not an EVO III with mods.. It is a replica with similar style features. It may perform.. it may not.. We just wanted to advise everyone with what was going on.. thats all. If anyone has any questions about these turbos (differences and similarites) feel free to contact me. If we begin to carry these. You will know.. as for now.. we will be offering a special of a TRUE MHI 16g as another option in this price range..

Thanks
Mark
SBR
 
Seriously, I'd like to see a vendor step up and do a test of one of these turbos. We can tout them or degrade them as much as we want, but in reality, all of this is BS until we get: a) dyno numbers, and b) reports from people who have built up significant mileage on the turbo. Then we'll know what their potential is, both for power and reliability.

Feel like stepping out of the crowd, vendors? Do dyno tests on the same car, the same day: MHI Evo3 16g vs. "Chinese Army GT Turbo". I have a feeling that whichever turbo wins out, you will gain both respect and business from DSM tuners on this site.
 
joemathews said:
Seriously, I'd like to see a vendor step up and do a test of one of these turbos. We can tout them or degrade them as much as we want, but in reality, all of this is BS until we get: a) dyno numbers, and b) reports from people who have built up significant mileage on the turbo. Then we'll know what their potential is, both for power and reliability.

Feel like stepping out of the crowd, vendors? Do dyno tests on the same car, the same day: MHI Evo3 16g vs. "Chinese Army GT Turbo". I have a feeling that whichever turbo wins out, you will gain both respect and business from DSM tuners on this site.

Although dynoing these two turbos side-by-side would be fun, I highly doubt the hp numbers are going to be that different, and even if they, it has no effect on reliability. My main concern with this turbo is durability. Although it may not seem this way, Mitsu over engineers parts quite often. You can put an EVO 3 16G through hell an back and they keep going. I dont think the "GT" will do the same, however only time will tell.

Nate
SBR
 
wait a minute.. I have to disagree.. We are only discussing the misrepresentation here.. It has nothing to do with Vendor hates

I have to disagree with your disagreement, at the risk of sounding redundant. You may say it has nothing to do with vendor hates, however, inadverntently, it is a part of this conversation. And I feel that if Slow Boy Racing does in fact have an issue with a vendor, they should have made clear that they have in the past had conflicts with them. Because it is one thing for a relatively unbiased (no one, and I repeat NO ONE is completely unbiased in what we call the real world) vendor to come on to this forum and post an opinion about a product, and totally a different thing all together for one to come here and post an opinion colored with such negative past experiences. My examples of Slow Boy Racing opinions:

Just what we need, more people selling SSAUTOCHROME type products in the DSM marketplace!
And here I thought we were talking about a product and not another vendor? What did this add to the discussion of the "Evo GT" turbo? This is several lines down in the same post...

maybe try "2 cent piece of crap, made by people who make $0.40 a week" turbo....
I'm not taking pot shots at maturity level here, but...as a respected vendor, what value does this comment have, really?

comparison does not include the Chineese Kung Fu Evo 3 GT59er .70 A/R ghost rider model.
And what exactly does this comment have to do with the turbo as well? Not once did you post any kind of substantive information about the product we are discussing.

AS for the material these turbos are made.. get them analyzed. The TRUE Evo 3 16g has a higher nickel content over the preceeding small and big 16g.
This still tells us nothing about the "Evo GT" turbo we are talking about. I'm impressed with the fact the Mitsubishi Heavy Industries added more nickel to their exhaust houses for the EVO III 16g, but once again, what does that have to do with the turbo you are absolutely bashing (and I am not exaggerating when I use that word) in all of your previous postsm, by employees of Slow Boy Racing. T3R80 even states that the "Evo GT" does have a higher nickel concentration then the EVO III, which does decrease the risk of cracking (see here, atleast in one respect, higher quality product). Because he makes a claim, I hope he has actual research and/or proof to back it up.

Are these guys using the same internal bearings as the Mitsu version? Doubt it.
Same tubine/shaft material? Probably not.
Is the cast housing going to crack in a few thousand miles? You bet.
Once again, I'd like to point out you do NOT give any concrete information, only guesses. And, once again, as a respected vendor, I do not understand why you are putting guesses out on the table when someone is asking for the actual differences between the turbos, not a vendors assumptions?

This is what leads me to my original point, that there does in fact seem to me some kind of previous resentment here in the Slow Boy ranks. Also, in 1990greengsx's post, not once did he argue any of the claims that there is in fact a feud or argument (whatever you want to call it) with tc.com.

The reason for this post is because I was disappointed with the repsonses given by SBR, which I held in a high regard as a vendor, and as people, which I can say I have personally met and talked with a few of you at the annual GT meets and whenever I call to place an order. Just my two cents.

-Bill
 
QuickSilverGSX9 said:
I have to disagree with your disagreement, at the risk of sounding redundant. You may say it has nothing to do with vendor hates, however, inadverntently, it is a part of this conversation. And I feel that if Slow Boy Racing does in fact have an issue with a vendor, they should have made clear that they have in the past had conflicts with them. Because it is one thing for a relatively unbiased (no one, and I repeat NO ONE is completely unbiased in what we call the real world) vendor to come on to this forum and post an opinion about a product, and totally a different thing all together for one to come here and post an opinion colored with such negative past experiences. My examples of Slow Boy Racing opinions:


And here I thought we were talking about a product and not another vendor? What did this add to the discussion of the "Evo GT" turbo? This is several lines down in the same post...


I'm not taking pot shots at maturity level here, but...as a respected vendor, what value does this comment have, really?


And what exactly does this comment have to do with the turbo as well? Not once did you post any kind of substantive information about the product we are discussing.


This still tells us nothing about the "Evo GT" turbo we are talking about. I'm impressed with the fact the Mitsubishi Heavy Industries added more nickel to their exhaust houses for the EVO III 16g, but once again, what does that have to do with the turbo you are absolutely bashing (and I am not exaggerating when I use that word) in all of your previous postsm, by employees of Slow Boy Racing. T3R80 even states that the "Evo GT" does have a higher nickel concentration then the EVO III, which does decrease the risk of cracking (see here, atleast in one respect, higher quality product). Because he makes a claim, I hope he has actual research and/or proof to back it up.


Once again, I'd like to point out you do NOT give any concrete information, only guesses. And, once again, as a respected vendor, I do not understand why you are putting guesses out on the table when someone is asking for the actual differences between the turbos, not a vendors assumptions?

This is what leads me to my original point, that there does in fact seem to me some kind of previous resentment here in the Slow Boy ranks. Also, in 1990greengsx's post, not once did he argue any of the claims that there is in fact a feud or argument (whatever you want to call it) with tc.com.

The reason for this post is because I was disappointed with the repsonses given by SBR, which I held in a high regard as a vendor, and as people, which I can say I have personally met and talked with a few of you at the annual GT meets and whenever I call to place an order. Just my two cents.

-Bill

Bill,

I think you missed th entire point.

This turbo in question is without a doubt a very large piece of crap... Did you miss the part where I said we rejected this turbo 6 months ago? I know more than enough about this turbo to pass judgement. Please do a little more research before posting your BS.

MGH
 
I went ahead and re-read the entirety of the posts in this thread. Not once was a single fact or figure of this turbo mentioned, beyond your all-ecompassing "a very large piece of crap" judgement. If you have actual facts and figures as to why exactly this is a mechanically or structurally bad turbo, please, enlighten us.

Also, you answered none of my questions or concerns in your extensive post. I'm at a loss as to why you would completely ignore them, unless of course, you have no answers?

But then again, I'm just some college kid...what do I know?

-Bill
 
QuickSilverGSX9 said:
I went ahead and re-read the entirety of the posts in this thread. Not once was a single fact or figure of this turbo mentioned, beyond your all-ecompassing "a very large piece of crap" judgement. If you have actual facts and figures as to why exactly this is a mechanically or structurally bad turbo, please, enlighten us.

Also, you answered none of my questions or concerns in your extensive post. I'm at a loss as to why you would completely ignore them, unless of course, you have no answers?

But then again, I'm just some college kid...what do I know?

-Bill

I am not here to hold your hand Bill... this is from the first page...

"If you want, I can tell you the place that makes them, in China... because I sent a turbo there almost a year ago for them to look at.... was not happy with there service, or there product, and did not pursue this turbo... and now somehow it has surfaced again..."

Did you miss this.... ????

MGH
 
Slowboy said:
I am not here to hold your hand Bill... this is from the first page...

"If you want, I can tell you the place that makes them, in China... because I sent a turbo there almost a year ago for them to look at.... was not happy with there service, or there product, and did not pursue this turbo... and now somehow it has surfaced again..."

Did you miss this.... ????

MGH
Thats funny, you did it twice. First you said it was crap politely and then proceeded to say it was just crap. I think the 40k or so DSMTuners members would like some sort of factual information to form their own opinions. Just because you deem it crap does not mean someone else doesnt want to know more about it. Thats just my .02.\

P.S.
Something to consider is the fact that everytime you make a post you make yourself more known. The way you present yourself as a company shows everyone what kind of a company you are. If your happy presenting yourself as an ass to the community I wish you the best of luck.
 
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