Alternative Fuel E85 Ethanol Corn Gas E70 (Beginner) [MERGED]

[311GSX]

THIS WILL BE RESERVED FOR BEGINNER E85 QUESTIONS, FOR TUNERS THAT HAVE NEVER HEARD OF RUNNING IT OR HAVEN'T RESEARCHED IT YET. THE ADVANCED E85 THREAD IS HERE FOR THE MORE ADVANCED QUESTIONS ---> http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/newbie-forum/372386-alternative-fuel-e85-ethanol-corn-gas-e70-advanced-merged.html

HOPEFULLY THIS WILL MAKE THE BASIC E85 INFORMATION MORE CENTRALIZED AND EASIER TO FIND FOR THE DSM'rs WHO ARE JUST GETTING THEIR NOSE WET AND ARE UNSURE OF WHAT E85 IS.

THANKS,

GOFER

__________________________________________________​

Has anyone tryed running E85 in their dsm? Their is a station in my area that sells it and it's not much more than regular gas. It is 85% ethanol and 15% gas and is 110 octane . It could be a cheap alternative to race gas.

 

[xxsupralvrxx]

wow how much was it a gallon?? and hollywood beach is south i think an hour north of miami (i use to live in hollywood, not hollywood beach near the hard rock casino)

 

[gsxtasy]

Yeah I think I ninja answered the WBo2 Question when you were typing.

But alot of my searching came to your post.
Thanks alot Glenn.

For some reason I dont wanna leave this turbo [FT BigT28] without pushing her pretty far. Just cause it seems no single person has solid advice about this turbo other then "Yeah it was on my car I ran a 14.2 but I had no other mods, now I have an E316G."

Im thinking STM's Tank to fuel rail kit may be what I goto after a few OEM filters are used. And I dont DD this car for the most part, weekend fun car.

I have a nice little stash of the OEM filters so I will use them and then move onto the STM kit.

But It seems like I am ready to go.

So...
Save my current 93 settings.
Get Low on gas
Fill her up with E85
Add appx 30% more fuel and change the dead time
And tune to 12.0 and 0 knock?

Do I up my global?

Im a little lost on how to set up my "Base" settings for E85.

Thanks

Yeah, you will up your global, for pump gas your 880's should be at roughly -49%=
((450/880)-1), if you make those 30% smaller(estimate) 880 *.7=616cc/min, so
((450/616)-1)= -27%-ish.

You can start in that area and all i would do is change it then watch your STFT, and get that close to zero. After that you can fine tune your LTFT's with airflow sliders and you should be set. You may have to play with deadtime a little, but it should be around the same as for pump gas. It's fun stuff, good luck!

 

[xxShaneOmac]

Good post xtacy

So I guess Ill have to ride her on E one day and start the E85 road.

Going to be good.

Im thinking an STM Tank to rail kit may be a good investment.

Not only will I have the SS Lines but the main part is the filter.
Im not sure if that is the exact filter that everyone is talking about but Changing OEM filters every few gas tanks dosn't sound that pleasing.

 

[gixrman]

Anyone thought of brewing there own ethanol? I've been reading up on this alittle. You can make this from corn, rotten apples, and grape skins from a winery. You can get still plans for around $60, but materials could run you about $600. they claim you can make five gallons a day for about $1.40/gallon. The only permit you need can be obtained from the ATF as long as you produce under 10,000 gallons a yr. E85 is'nt available in my area so i've been thinking about this.

 

[Winglessflight]

I've heard of the corrosive properties of E85, and any alcohol fuels for that matter, but what do they do for oiling to retain any reliability??

 

[natertater]

methanol is corrosive, not ethanol. both alcohols, but different properties.

 

[matthewdesigns]

... but what do they do for oiling to retain any reliability??

Please be more specific regarding 'oiling'. Are you asking about fuel system lubrication (ie dried out rubber bits), engine oil contamination by alcohol fuels, ???

 

[natertater]

i guess he forgot about his post...

 

[PandaMan]

Yeah, looks like he forgot. But if the OP comes back to this, I would like you to know that many people run e85 and have zero problems besides changing the fuel filter if necessary and possibly cleaning the injectors after a couple thousand miles. But, some people don't even have to do that!

 

[2gGSX]

methanol is corrosive, not ethanol. both alcohols, but different properties.

E85 is absolutely corrosive, however it just does not act as quickly as methanol.

 

[toofast82]

Some long term E-85 users have developed a "black-goo" on the injectors over time. They say using a tank of gasoline every so often may prevent this or using "Top Lube", which is used with full methanol should prevent this as well. Then some guys still haven't encountered this at all. Could be a demographic issue or how often the pump is used,etc.

 

[PandaMan]

Sounds good then.
If anyone else wants to chime in with there 2cents I would appreciate it.

I would say go bigger with your injectors, I have fic 950's with my pte 50 trim and they are at 100% idc on e85. Yes, I was running around 30 psi with this setup but why not just go 1250's or 1450's and save upgrading later.

 

[habitatguy187]

I was just browsing through some of the pages in this thread and now I'm confused! Some people say you only need to add 15-20% more fuel and some say 33%, anyone know for sure what it is?

 

[jrohner]

It just depends on how you tune / what your car likes. I just divide the injector size by 1.4 and put that in for injector compensation, and then lean out the maps a bunch (12-12.5:1).

 

[habitatguy187]

It just depends on how you tune / what your car likes. I just divide the injector size by 1.4 and put that in for injector compensation, and then lean out the maps a bunch (12-12.5:1).

Well this is a little disappointing, my plan was to throw in these 750s I recently bought (36% larger than my 550s) and run it without a tune until I go SD (after I buy a wideband)

I figured I'd go a little richer than 30% just to be on the safe side when fuel trims don't matter (wot) but now I might be far too rich under wot since the stock tune is already extremely rich! I guess I'll just wait and see.

 

[matthewdesigns]

Some long term E-85 users have developed a "black-goo" on the injectors over time. They say using a tank of gasoline every so often may prevent this or using "Top Lube", which is used with full methanol should prevent this as well. Then some guys still haven't encountered this at all. Could be a demographic issue or how often the pump is used,etc.

The goo is hit and miss. I've been running e85 for a year and only developed a light film of the stuff on my injector tips...literally enough on all 4 injectors combined to only discolor the end of a single Q-tip. Others around here can go through a quarter tank of e85 and they have symptoms of the goo, and in a few tanks have a relatively high amount of the buildup. I have all stock lines except for about 6" b/t my rail and afpr, a Walbro 255, FIC 950's (multi-orifice ball/seat tip), and a stock fuel filter.

The 'Top Lube' (there's a thread here about it somewhere...found it) was tried by one of our local members who seems to have the worst issue with goo buildup (the one who has issues after only a 1/4 tank), and it did nothing for his problems. He's just picked up 5gal of e85 from the station I use to see if it affects him or not. That will help determine whether it's station or fuel-system based.

We have a huge thread going on my local board about e85...Link. It is an incredibly informative thread, including some analysis of the goo by a chemical engineer on our board. If you have an hour or so have a look...Cliffs are that most people using it experience some side-effect of using it, but running a tank of gasoline through the system every once in a while cleans it out really well. I wouldn't let a little goo keep you from using e85...the benefits greatly outweigh the minor annoyances.

 

[forcefed86]

What is a good e85 compatible rubber for intank fuel pump wrap?


Just purchased a TT supra denso pump to replace my intank 255 walbro (not the HP). I know it's not a huge upgrade but my walbro was suspect anyway.

I'd like to wrap some sort of rubber around the pump for sound deadening purposes. What would be a good material for this? I'm just using standard type SS hose clamps to secure the pump to the OEM pump hangar.

Thanks!

 

[JayRolla]

Actually that denso is pretty quiet. I dont think you will have a problem. I use the walboro wrap with e85 for over a year and its still fine.

 

[forcefed86]

Actually that denso is pretty quiet. I dont think you will have a problem. I use the walboro wrap with e85 for over a year and its still fine.

Thanks....

I guess Neoprene rubber is compatible with gas and ethanol and works well if anyone is interested.

 

[spawn87]

guys ive been reading a lot of E835 threads and i get the main points of it like what it takes to run it and what kind of mods needed to support it

im currently rebuilding my engine and it will have the following:
e31g6 fully ported
255lph walbro pump
delta 272
DSM graveyard stg1 head
6bolt bottom end with b/s delete kit
evo 9 pistons with .20 over
ECM LINK V3lite
afpr

and i plan on getting 950cc injectors at the least.

after reading i know im going to have to change my fuel filters a couple times and as far as the rest goes my fuel set up can handled it. but i read that e85 changes though out the year and seasons and that retuning is require, is this true? am i going to have to retuning constantly or is to once i have the car tuned right ill be ok and thats that?

 

[KazooGS-T]

You're going to want to look into replacing the factory fuel lines and fuel filter. STM, a vendor here, sells a complete setup for a decent price.

Also make sure you have an AFPR, and a second wally might not be a bad decision although your single should cover it.

There is different blends of E85 offered throughout the year, depending on where you live. You would want to check with your local stations or even E85 representative to know the specific blends that you may run into.

As far as tuning goes for different blends, it's not necessarily a must do, although it's a good idea to have a couple of backup tunes that are readily setup for the changes in E85 quality that occur during the year, which would allow you to simply load your winter tune or summer tune if what you are offered locally is seasonal blends.

 

[AK Maniak]

I'd rewire the 255 and probably go with bigger injectors just so you have some room to grow

 

[68442]

Looks like your about set. The mixes aren't that big of a deal. Go thru the chart for your region.

E85 Mustangs.com - Regional Fuel Chart by state

 

[Devilman]

on my 1g ive been running e85 for 2 years

stock fuel lines, filter, rail, even stock reg for stock appearing class
now on an afpr

change your filter after 2 tanks or so

255 rewire and 1150s

sounds like u have a pretty good list going
evo316g love e85

i'd get alittle bit bigger injectors than 950s just for growing room.

with different blends of e85 you can just get one "safe" tune during mid summer when its true e85 then run the same tune the rest of the year. there will be higher amounts of gasoline in the blend which will just make the car run alittle bit richer.

 

[JayRolla]

Agreed, I have ran e85 on stock fuel lines and fuel filter for almost 2 years. 255lph, stock wiring and stock FPR. Slightly aggressive tune, 32psi falling too 26(38lb/min), 22* timing, 12.5 AFR. Car loves it.

I never have to retune when the weather changes and if so its very small.