ECMlink SD Tune is gone after Aeromotive FPR install... DSMLINK HELP!

[Archer Fabrications]

If the timing tables are funky because of a non-existent problem, then go get the Evo 8 timing tables and put them in so they're more "normal".

it could also have actually been my waste gate raddling on my power steering pump a little bit as well creating false knock, but at the time it was better safe then sorry, and i was in the car while someone experienced tuned, not i. im thinking if i go to a stock timing table or an evo 8 one that with my size turbo ill just blow the shit outa my motor.. i dunno though. my profile mods are current

 

[Archer Fabrications]

turns out the bucking was the CAS connection to the crank emulator... soldered the connection (had a stupid butt connector) and i havent seen bucking yet, i was able to get into boost just fine. here is a log if anyone knows what i should do to adjust for fuel trims..

 

[snowborder714]

Log ISCPosition. I'm going to guess it's higher than it should be (which is 30).

After the car is warmed up, adjust BISS slowly until you get a stable 30.

Then watch this video and replicate on your car. You'll be adjusting applicable SD cells (can figure out which by turning on Track datalog) instead of MAF Comp sliders.
http://www.ecmtuning.com/demos/fueltrim.html

 

[Archer Fabrications]

just logged my isc after i arrived to work, it was around 6- not sure if thats -6 or just 6 with a dash, but i just need to get that to 30? is it the tighter i screw the BISS the higher the number? cause the biss is pretty loose right now, loose enough to leak during a BLT, everything else is sealed beside a very small pin hole in the throttle body elbow seal, probably will just RTV that part.

 

[snowborder714]

You'll need to screw in the BISS to make the ISC value raise. If it's leaking, consider getting a new BISS screw o-ring.

 

[Archer Fabrications]

You'll need to screw in the BISS to make the ISC value raise. If it's leaking, consider getting a new BISS screw o-ring.

is that something that i can just pick up at napa? just a regular O ring of appropriate size?

 

[snowborder714]

I've always used an OEM part, so I don't know if any normal o-ring would work.

 

[Calan]

I believe it's something like a #5 o-ring. You can get them at any ACE hardware store.

EDIT:

From the VFAQ page, a #5 3/8" OD x 1/4" ID x 1/16" will work.

Or just go with a factory replacement as Brian mentioned. The P/N is MD608806, and is $4.55 from ExtremePSI.

 

[Archer Fabrications]

I believe it's something like a #5 o-ring. You can get them at any ACE hardware store.

EDIT:

From the VFAQ page, a #5 3/8" OD x 1/4" ID x 1/16" will work.

Or just go with a factory replacement as Brian mentioned. The P/N is MD608806, and is $4.55 from ExtremePSI.

thanks calan, since its just an o ring, and it alreadyu leaks, ill go to ace and grab that just like you sugguested, if it doesnt work, off to extreme i order! ha ill post another log soon, maybe you guys can tell me if there is anythign that needs tweekin

 

[turboglenn]

i. im thinking if i go to a stock timing table or an evo 8 one that with my size turbo ill just blow the shit outa my motor.. i dunno though. my profile mods are current

I was running my 67mm turbo at 30psi with timing that was as high as 22* in the top. at 22-25psi on decent pump gas you should easily be able to get away with a curve that starts at 9* in the peak torque areas and ramping smoothly up to 13-14* by redline to keep the burn process early enough in time for peak cylinder pressure to be present through out the RPM sweep. But i would honestly try and run a few degrees more if i could.

Is your boostEst correct? i'm just wondering since you have the 4bar map and it reads high in the logs or at least says you're running well in exces of 35psi which is territory i haven't taken a car to on pump gas ever before (saw a peak of 43psi if the log opened correctly (kept getting a filetype error)**note; thinking i don't have the correct log but i'm going to try downloading it again


But either way it seemed as if you were silly low on timing in a bunch of areas, which you explained was knock sensor testing, but either way it would trhow overall smooth operation of the engine out the door wiht the values i saw

I agree on getting a good timing map and maybe backing off the sliders a little bit if you're scared of knock and ramping them up the smoothest and as repeatable of a curve as possible..Timing attack both in decreasing of angle as well as rapid increasing of angles can cause detonation and rattling of the engine parts due to the rapid transistion of cylinder pressure angles when making swings from 25+* to low teens and single digits during a cruise to boost transition of retarding and re-feeding the timing too fast

 

[Archer Fabrications]

i dont think boost EST is correct, i definitely am not running 35PSI as i am running on my 19PSI tial WG spring and my hallman isn't even hooked up yet. i see a max of 22psi according to the OMNI, i just ignore the boost EST and use omni but is there a way to help it match or is that where the SDairflow per rev comes in to dial it down to .26? as for the timing table, i'm just really scared and timid to mess with it, like i said i wasn't the one tuning the car, all i really have messed with is fuel and the VE table. i have a new knock sensor and haven't seen more then .7 degrees of knock only once or less per log i take. the car is actually running very smooth now since i soldered the CAS/Crank sensor cable i haven't had one bit of bucking what so ever. i'm going to go to my tuner and see what he thinks about the timing table and seeing if he can boost it up. when we were tuning it it wasn't testing the knock sensor, but we believed it could be bad due to the phantom knock i was getting (haven't seen any as of now) but this knock could have also been due to my tial WG touching my power steering hard line, its freed up now though. as of right now until i can make it to ground vision performance, or even English im gonna keep the timing table as it sits. do you guys see anything else wrong with fuel trims, i noticed the STFT and COMBFT are pretty close in line, but i'm seeing some -20s in the combFT from time to time. WB seems to be good at open throttle in the beginning at 11:1 but then will lean out to 12 or even 13 at full boost. obviously that's not good. i have been messing with the COMBFT adjust tool, but i think i need to strap on the MAF again and run the SD ratio adjuster as well.

 

[turboglenn]

i dont think boost EST is correct, i definitly am not running 35PSI as i am running on my 19PSI tial WG spring, i see a max of 22psi according to the OMNI, i just ignore the boost EST and use omni, as for the timing table, im just really scared and timmid to mess with it, like i said i wasnt the one tuning the car, all i really have messed with is fuel and the VE table. i have a new knock sensor and havent seen more then .7 degrees of knock only once or less per log i take. the car is actually running very smooth now since i soldered the CAS/Crank sensor cable i havent had one bit of bucking what so ever. im going to go to my tuner and see what he thinks about the timing table and seeing if he can boost it up. when we were tuning it it wasnt testing the knock sensor, but we believed it could be bad due to the phantom knock i was getting (havent seen any as of now) but this knock could have also been due to my tial WG touching my power steering hard line, its freed up now though. as of right now until i can make it to ground vision performance, or even english im gonna keep the timing table as it sits. do you guys see anyting else wrong with fuel trims, i noticed the STFT and COMBFT are pretty close in line, but im seeing some -20s in the combFT from time to time. WB seems to be good at open throttle in the beginning at 11:1 but then will lean out to 12 or even 13 at full boost. obviously thats not good. i have been messing with the COMBFT adjust tool, but i think i need to strap on the MAF again and run the SD ratio adjuster as well.

ok, then i either had an error or it's way off,i was seeing 43psi in the log i was looking at but when i clicked the log link in this thread it wouldload up the SCMlink software and put a log in front of me but would also give me a file type loading error so i can't be sure who's end the bigger error is on

as for adjusting the map, don't load general maps/files/tables, just adjust the cells in yours where you're leaning out, if the tune respond correctly and can be made safe and satisfactory by changing these cells you KNOW you're general setup and installation of the ECU is correct.. if you putlarger values in the cells and the engine doesn't go in the direction you're tuning it then you know you have some issues some where in your setup or installation of the ECU and sensors

THis is how "tuning" is done, it's adjusting the map to suit your specific needs instead of dealing with lacked performnance from a "general base map", timing is the same, you should be advancing it the best you can as severely retarded timing as seen in your logs is gonna drive EGT's through the roof smoking exh. valves and turbine wheels at worst case, and suffer in performance as a given.

Timing isn't just advancing things until the ragged edge and hoping for max power from it. It's getting the burn cycle lined up with crank/piston position relative to the state of the burn speed to provide smooth, reliable and as a bonus powerfull operation of the engine. Having the most timing won't always make the most power, but severely retarded timing in a case of boost this low on pump gas should be a sign right away something is either severely wrong or the tune is severely off because you're way outside the values that a health properly running engine should be able to run and run best at.

you should be able to make some general changes on your own and like i stated above if the system is installed and setup corectly should fix your problems or at leat improve engine running

 

[Calan]

...when i clicked the log link in this thread it wouldload up the SCMlink software and put a log in front of me but would also give me a file type loading error

Glen, you'll need to download the latest version of the software. You get that error when a log is made on a version of ECMLink later than the one you are running.

****

OP - What injectors are you running? (I don't see them in the profile or thread)

You absolutely 100% need to load a default timing map back in and start with that, but then do as Glen said and just make small adjustments until it's right. No way in hell I'd run the car with -8* timing across the board at WOT; you are burning most of your fuel in the exhaust manifold.

I would start with the Evo 8 stock or "mod 1" replacement timing and fuel maps available on the ECMLink wiki.

After that, use the SD VE Adjust tool for cruise and idle VE adjustments until fuel trims are in line, and then start working on the open loop areas in your VE table using the WB error.

 

[turboglenn]

Glen, you'll need to download the latest version of the software. You get that error when a log is made on a version of ECMLink later than the one you are running.

OP - What injectors are you running? (I don't see them in the profile or thread)

thank you sir! off to upgrade my ECMlink download

I don't run it but i do read a lot of other peoples logs for both personal enjoyment and offering troubleshooting/tune help

 

[Archer Fabrications]

And I'm not trying to sound like a smart ass but asking for help and having a few people mention something only to say your not going to take their advice, is kinda like saying, "thanks but I'm smart enjough to know that's not the problem, but please come up with a differnt suggestion that i might wanna try because i can't figure it out"

i am just very inexperienced with tuning, i understand the program a fair bit, i am a computer tech, but the reason im saying i dont wanna change the timing is because i simply dont trust myself, its not about saying i know better. i actually dont know enough to even touch it in fear of ####ing up my new motor.. id rather have someone sit down with me and help me out before i started changing values blindly, i mean i do have an idea of what to do, and i know about the track log function and that stuff but like i said, i simply dont trust myself, thats why i had someone tune it in the first place. ill probably end up going down to english one of these days to get the run down on what they think the settings should be and have them tune me something nuts. my main reason for the OP was to figure out the bucking, which i did so technically i can mark this thread as resolved, but i was curious about the fuel tables, which is the thing i HAVE been futzing with.

Glen, you'll need to download the latest version of the software. You get that error when a log is made on a version of ECMLink later than the one you are running.

****

OP - What injectors are you running? (I don't see them in the profile or thread)

You absolutely 100% need to load a default timing map back in and start with that, but then do as Glen said and just make small adjustments until it's right. No way in hell I'd run the car with -8* timing across the board at WOT. I would start with the Evo 8 stock or "mod 1" replacement timing and fuel maps available on the ECMLink wiki.

After that, use the SD VE Adjust tool for cruise and idle VE adjustments until fuel trims are in line, and then start working on the open loop areas in your VE table using the WB error.

running PTE 1000CC (flow rated at 940) thanks for the info i will look into the evo 8 timing maps and see how different they are from stock. just really scared about it..

oh btw, i have +5* of base timing.

also question here: im looking at the Evo 8 timing table and i see its calculated by RPMXload, but what are the numbers in each cell representing. timing degrees? and if so how much adjustment per cell should i make before checking the outcome? and do you smooth the timing out similar to how you smooth out the VE table, making the color transition the most fluid possible?

am i gonna destroy anything ill get a log of my drive home from work, should this log just be a consistant cruise log, or should i do a few pulls in there as well..

 

[turboglenn]

i am just very inexperienced with tuning, i understand the program a fair bit, i am a computer tech, but the reason im saying i dont wanna change the timing is because i simply dont trust myself, its not about saying i know better. i actually dont know enough to even touch it in fear of ####ing up my new motor.. id rather have someone sit down with me and help me out before i started changing values blindly, i mean i do have an idea of what to do, and i know about the track log function and that stuff but like i said, i simply dont trust myself, thats why i had someone tune it in the first place. ill probably end up going down to english one of these days to get the run down on what they think the settings should be and have them tune me something nuts. my main reason for the OP was to figure out the bucking, which i did so technically i can mark this thread as resolved, but i was curious about the fuel tables, which is the thing i HAVE been futzing with.

And sorry i re-read your last post and decide to reword what i was saying there, you just "quote grabbed it" before i was done. i didn't mean to come off harsh and saw you said you'd mess with it, so i wanted to get that before itcould be taken in offense.

Anyway, the help you'll get from most of us will usually lead you in the right direction, some of us are more knowledgable in certain areas compred to others so it's safe to not jump on everything your told to do, and learning who's advice to trust and run with compared to who's to just read and keep in thought for a while judging it is an important part of membership

also, there's several members here that could easily write you a map to load up that looks a ton better and is still an ultra safe starting point for any healthy engine at said boost and gas octane uses. I can garauntee you that loading up something by me, snowboarder, or calan would be an honest and knowledgablly made improvement overwhat you have as well as would be safe to run, all you'd have to do is watch the normal gauges and made sure AFR's stayed safe and knock wasn't coming on hard to make sure it's safe for daily high boost use and abuse we do this because some of us really enjoy tuning and helping others with their tunes, not becaue we want to see if yo0u'll load a map thta we are hoping might pop your engine or make big HP numbers one or the other lOL

EDIT: personally i don't like the look of any of thosemaps on the DSMlink link. They are all like ultra conservative in most places,even the "agressivetune"is what i'd call a "crude base map"

 

[Archer Fabrications]

i hear ya, and no offence taken!

if you would want to remap me id be much obliged ill give it a shot and post a new log

For easy refrence

Bolt-on Modifications:
PTE SCM 6152s DBB// DNP Tubular// VRSF FMIC// Viscious LSD// Megan Racing 3" catless Turbo Back// Tial Q 50mm BOV// Tial 38mm External Wastegate Hallman MBC//, Koyo Aluminum Radiator, FP 4" Intake, Aeromotive A1000 FPR, VIS OEM Carbon Fiber hood

Engine Management:
PTE 1000CC Injectors, 95 Eprom ECU with DSMLink V3, Speed Density AEM UEGO WBo2, Auto Meter Boost/Vac Gauge 30+/30-, Walbro 255HP, Omni power 4 bar, GM IAT, Apexi Turbo Timer, AEM Oil pressure Gauge 0-150 PSI

Engine Internals:
6 Bolt 2.0, 2g Head, BC 272/272 Cams, Mahle Forged Pistons .020 Over bore. 9.2:1, Scat H-Beam Connecting Rods, ARP Head Studs, ARP Main Studs, ACL Race Berrings (main and Rod), Felpro PermaTorque Headgasket, Topline 3G Lifters, balance shaft eliminator, balanced and blueprinted

Drivetrain Modifications:
ACT 2600solid 6 puck Clutch, ACT Street Lite Flywheel, Three speed Scatter Shield (not installed yet)

 

[turboglenn]

that's the attitude to take! nothin to stop you from re-loading your current map if a new one spooks you, as long as you think about what's going on which you're easily capable of there's really little to no chance of things going wrong

I'll take some time and work up a version of timing improvements for ya here in a bit, i'm sure others will have offerings to, snowboarder helps tons of people with map smoothing/improvement and i've seen posts where he's put in lots of time dialing in Maps and making people happy, good call!

 

[Archer Fabrications]

that's the attitude to take! nothin to stop you from re-loading your current map if a new one spooks you, as long as you think about what's going on which you're easily capable of there's really little to no chance of things going wrong

I'll take some time and work up a version of timing improvements for ya here in a bit, i'm sure others will have offerings to, snowboarder helps tons of people with map smoothing/improvement and i've seen posts where he's put in lots of time dialing in Maps and making people happy, good call!

thank you very much!!! glad that im gettin somewhere!

 

[turboglenn]

No problem, i'm working on something now but being a little slow in ECMlink for not knowuing how to grab a large number of cells and smooth the values between them im filling each on by hand, so although slow i'll havea decent and safe set of AFR and Timing values for you to load into your currenbt setup, it's gonna take me a littel while

I'm gonna start with both minimum and maximum oct values the same with room to tweak the genral tune in either direction. I usually don't utilize dual tables anyway just because it can cause a variance in what i see in my logs vs. what i have entered intothe cells

 

[Archer Fabrications]

No problem, i'm working on something now but being a little slow in ECMlink for not knowuing how to grab a large number of cells and smooth the values between them im filling each on by hand, so although slow i'll havea decent and safe set of AFR and Timing values for you to load into your currenbt setup

thanks alot man. as far as grabbing multipul cells, try shift. also how come you dont run link yourself?

dont forget this is on Speed density

 

[turboglenn]

thanks alot man. as far as grabbing multipul cells, try shift. also how come you dont run link yourself?

n my logs vs. what i have entered intothe cells

dont forget this is on Speed density [/QUOTE]

I wouldn't run a MAF meter unless it was absolutely needed to operate the car or you paid me to do so, i'm hardcore SD tothe end

I dont' run it because before it's V1 was ever on the market i had already gutted my OEM harness and wired in a haltech pure stand alone ECU, it would cost me 3times the price of DSMlink to put things back to being able to use it, the OBD-II port and OEM harness and sensors(i run all GM sensors on my haltech install and 3 bar GM MAP)

I wasn't impressedwith the fist two DSMlinks for their price and features compared to a 1200-1400 dollar stand alone install. But since V3 has been released if you have an OEM harness left in the car to utilize DSMlink i think it's all that 95% of DSM tuners and drivers need.. they pulled a complete180* of my opinion on them by adding all they added with V3 and keeping the price the same..good move on their behalf!

 

[Archer Fabrications]

glen, if you want me to take a short cruise log in 4th and 5th i can do that, as well as a nice 3rd gear pull, 2k-7k

 

[turboglenn]

After loading this map i'm working on it would be nice to see a log or two. I"m not so much making adjustments to calibration factors but just writing the raw basic map cell entries that should be the base default when nothing else but aside from RPM, And Map sensor readings are being used to calculate what's being fed to the engine. The current trimming values should be fine for now,i'ts getting a good tuning foundation in line that you're most in need of

 

[Archer Fabrications]

After loading this map i'm working on it would be nice to see a log or two. I"m not so much making adjustments to calibration factors but just writing the raw basic map cell entries that should be the base default when nothing else but aside from RPM, And Map sensor readings are being used to calculate what's being fed to the engine. The current trimming values should be fine for now,i'ts getting a good tuning foundation in line that you're most in need of

oh alright, so im definitly not in danger of damaging anything right now right?, unless i see knock, which im pretty sure the timing is SOOOO concervative that knock wont be an issue.

i might not be able to get a log tonight of your maps, because i leave work in about 10 minutes no worries man if you finish it tonight ill load it on tomorrow morning before i go to work