2G Upgraded too quickly, next step advice?

[BIGGZNOW]

So when I got my 2g GST the turbo had a massive oil leak, and to fix said oil leak I replaced the turbo but figured since I’m replacing might as well upgrade, got a 16g, which is currently far too much boost and I’m hitting fuel cut at anything about 4K rpm. Figured the proper next step would be to get a boost controller and set it low enough to where fuel cut wouldn’t be a concern but for whatever reason my boost controllers not really controlling much which I’m still troubleshooting. In any case, I’m thinking the next important step is to get some fuel management software and learn to tune on this car so as I can get injectors and a fuel pump and no longer have fuel cut. Sound about right? Anything else I should keep in mind/think about doing as well? Any help is appreciated!

 

[DSMPT]

I’m hitting fuel cut at anything about 4K rpm.

How do you know it's fuel cut?

Figured the proper next step would be to get a boost controller and set it low enough to where fuel cut wouldn’t be a concern

whatever reason my boost controllers not really controlling much which I’m still troubleshooting.

You can't set the boost lower than the wastegate pressure you have. A boost controller is to raise the boost higher than the wastegate pressure. To minimize the boost, just turn off the boost controller. So if you would still have the same issue after turning off the boost controller, then replacing your boost controller won't solve the issue.

 

[IHeartMyHonda]

A boost controller will not allow you to lower the boost level. If you are seeing excess boost, and the waste gate actuator is functioning properly, you may consider porting the turbine housing around the flapper and upgrading the o2 housing/downpipe to help the excess exhaust gasses escape more easily

 

[BIGGZNOW]

How do you know it's fuel cut?


You can't set the boost lower than the wastegate pressure you have. A boost controller is to raise the boost higher than the wastegate pressure. To minimize the boost, just turn off the boost controller. So if you would still have the same issue after turning off the boost controller, then replacing your boost controller won't solve the issue.

To the fuel cut question, I could say I don’t, but I mean as soon as I hit bout max boost she starts stuttering and I lose Aton of power, can’t go any higher in the rev range because of it. From what I’ve seen in videos and whatnot, and what my older dsm friend has told me im pretty sure it is. And to the boost controller and whatnot, would my best route then to be adjusting my wastegate?

 

[pauleyman]

To the fuel cut question, I could say I don’t, but I mean as soon as I hit bout max boost she starts stuttering and I lose Aton of power, can’t go any higher in the rev range because of it. From what I’ve seen in videos and whatnot, and what my older dsm friend has told me im pretty sure it is. And to the boost controller and whatnot, would my best route then to be adjusting my wastegate?

It is not fuel cut. Fuel cut is sudden, violent and unmistakable. Feels like you broke something. Sounds like you have a misfire. What maintenance have you done. What boost are you running? 16g on stock fuel needs to be limited.

 

[DiSeM]

What are you considering to be max boost? How much psi? These cars have a bad rep because of people that make unwise decisions while modifying them. They need tender love and care to be reliable, but they can be if we take the right steps. If you already have engine management sorted out, and plan to address the fuel issue in the near future then I would eliminate your boost control completely and connect your wastegate vacuum line to the one coming from the exhaust pipe. Don't rip on it because it sounds to me like you don't have enough fuel to handle it yet. With the wastegate routed directly to boost, it will open up at the minimum amount that the spring allows. It will be a lot safer to drive your car this way and it will be effectively the same as setting your boost control to zero. But even though the boost is set lower, the car will run like crap because it isn't tuned for the turbo, it will have less power than before the upgrade. This is because the equation that the stock ECU uses to manage the engine change. If the turbo changes so does the airflow, so then you need more fuel. But even with an upgraded fuel system, you need engine management for proper tuning. It might be best to consider fixing the issue that led you to buying an upgraded turbo. Also, doing routine maintenance and replacing old hoses first, then moving on to the free mods.

 

[DSMPT]

To the fuel cut question, I could say I don’t, but I mean as soon as I hit bout max boost she starts stuttering and I lose Aton of power, can’t go any higher in the rev range because of it. From what I’ve seen in videos and whatnot, and what my older dsm friend has told me im pretty sure it is. And to the boost controller and whatnot, would my best route then to be adjusting my wastegate?

What boost controller and ECU you have? Please make your car profile. And upload pics, videos if you can. That would help us a lot to see the situation. If you feel loss of power, to me it sounds more like ignition related like misfire/blown spark or/and boost/exhaust leak. But we can't tell anything for sure without knowing about your car condition and mods.

And don't forget to run a boost leak test. That's always the first thing to do especially if you have a MAF sensor.

 

[BIGGZNOW]

What are you considering to be max boost? How much psi? These cars have a bad rep because of people that make unwise decisions while modifying them. They need tender love and care to be reliable, but they can be if we take the right steps. If you already have engine management sorted out, and plan to address the fuel issue in the near future then I would eliminate your boost control completely and connect your wastegate vacuum line to the one coming from the exhaust pipe. Don't rip on it because it sounds to me like you don't have enough fuel to handle it yet. With the wastegate routed directly to boost, it will open up at the minimum amount that the spring allows. It will be a lot safer to drive your car this way and it will be effectively the same as setting your boost control to zero. But even though the boost is set lower, the car will run like crap because it isn't tuned for the turbo, it will have less power than before the upgrade. This is because the equation that the stock ECU uses to manage the engine change. If the turbo changes so does the airflow, so then you need more fuel. But even with an upgraded fuel system, you need engine management for proper tuning. It might be best to consider fixing the issue that led you to buying an upgraded turbo. Also, doing routine maintenance and replacing old hoses first, then moving on to the free mods.

I will say it is pretty freakin sudden I mean like I said as soon as I hit a certain amount of boost it starts to stutter very hard, but nothing before it. I’ll have to delete the boost controller then if that’s the case. I can’t say for certain the boost I’m at as my boost gauge has a slight vac leak that I need to fix by replacing the hose, previous owner had one far too big on. But I’m pretty sure it’s getting to around 15-16 psi and then immediately that’s where the issue hits. And I am already starting to order all of the belts and hoses and am planning on having pretty much a full week of trying to catch up on as much maintenance as possible.

What boost controller and ECU you have? Please make your car profile. And upload pics, videos if you can. That would help us a lot to see the situation. If you feel loss of power, to me it sounds more like ignition related like misfire/blown spark or/and boost/exhaust leak. But we can't tell anything for sure without knowing about your car condition and mods.

And don't forget to run a boost leak test. That's always the first thing to do especially if you have a MAF sensor.

Grimmspeed boost controller, think it’s the stock ecu but can’t say for certain as I’ve only had the car a month and honestly wouldn’t know what I’m looking at whether it was stock or aftermarket as it’s my first dsm. Trying to learn as much as I can as quickly as I can but it’s quite a lot to take in I’ll also have to do that boost leak test as I do have a MAF sensor, have to look into how to do it and whatnot and find the time but will do. I don’t have a video of what I’m thinking the fuel cut is as of right now, I will take one tomorrow morning on my way to work and will reply then with that. Thank you for the help! I’ll actually see if I can get it to make the steering whine I had been talking about in my other post as well, but it’s not super common and sort of hard to replicate all the time so that’s a maybe for tomorrow.

 

[pauleyman]

It's isn't a breakup. It's a hard hit. Violent and sudden.

 

[BIGGZNOW]

It's isn't a breakup. It's a hard hit. Violent and sudden.

Interesting I guess I’m wrong then. Will post a video early in the morning and you guys can see for yourselves I’m very interested in what y’all will think. Thanks!

 

[pauleyman]

what maintenance have you done?
Run a direct line to the wastegate actuator, bypassing boost controllers and wg solenoid. that's the lowest it will go.

 

[BIGGZNOW]

what maintenance have you done?
Run a direct line to the wastegate actuator, bypassing boost controllers and wg solenoid. that's the lowest it will go.

Interesting, I had anticipated that as I was installing a larger turbo that a boost controller would be necessary but it looks like I shoulda done more research. Was a little cramped on time but nothing a lil time and elbow grease can’t fix. The turbo is the only mechanical maintenance I’ve done so far as it was quite expensive and being 19 I’m on a slightly stringent budget so the turbo hit me pretty hard. I’m working on ordering all of the belts and hoses to change soon.

 

[FIBA M - EC17PSE]

Does it happen in all gears or just under 3rd? When i was on stock ecu and i jectors on my 16g hybrid i hit fuel cut mostly in 3rd at 7k ish revs. Thats the most load its going to see. You will get broken back fires and sputtering and when you cruise its fine in lower revs. It can happen in other gears high up the rev range but i never got that myself so cannot confirm this even though i went to 7k + sometimes. I had an adjustable WG so all i did was lower the spring rate and ran gate pressure until i was able to control it properly via ecmlink.

Thats a fix for now instead of a boost controller. This gives you more adjustment to tune later on also with stiffer springs so is not a waste of money really. Somecan get away without fuel cut and some dont.

 

[BIGGZNOW]

Does it happen in all gears or just under 3rd? When i was on stock ecu and i jectors on my 16g hybrid i hit fuel cut mostly in 3rd at 7k ish revs. Thats the most load its going to see. You will get broken back fires and sputtering and when you cruise its fine in lower revs. It can happen in other gears high up the rev range but i never got that myself so cannot confirm this even though i went to 7k + sometimes. I had an adjustable WG so all i did was lower the spring rate and ran gate pressure until i was able to control it properly via ecmlink.

Thats a fix for now instead of a boost controller. This gives you more adjustment to tune later on also with stiffer springs so is not a waste of money really. Somecan get away without fuel cut and some dont.

It is in every gear and is pretty consistently around the same rpm’s. I maybe get to 4500 in 5th befor it starts stuttering I can’t even really go above 85

Here are the videos guys please give your thoughts. Also like I said I can’t really go off the boost gauge rn as the bad line is loose and dosent read accurately but nonetheless.

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[pauleyman]

100% not fuel cut. I would suggest at least looking at plugs and wires. Lower the boost. It's 2$ in vac line to do that. Same for boost gauge. Couple dollars in vac line and maybe a fitting. If there is any clear nylon line in the install throw that away.

 

[SixBolt_16G]

Agree with @pauleyman. Similar to my car when my spark plugs are bad. What plugs are you using and what do you have them gapped to?

 

[BIGGZNOW]

Agree with @pauleyman. Similar to my car when my spark plugs are bad. What plugs are you using and what do you have them gapped to?

Now that I think about it I haven’t actually changed my plugs yet, was gonna do em when I changed my oil and just had put it off. I’ll change them after work today. My only concern would be with that I might want to leave it how it is as of right now until I delete that boost controller and reroute the vac lines, and get the boost gauge working properly as well.

 

[chrysler kid]

delete the boost controller and run the vacuum line directly from the boost source to the waste gate nipple

the most boost you can run safely without hitting fuel cut on a 2g car is about 13psi. when shifting from second to third the car will boost higher to 14 or 15 so you want to set boost in second gear to 12 or 13 psi

for now hook boost line directly to the wastegate and the car should run 8psi. once its running low boost we can establish if there is another problem.

fuel cut feels like all 4 cylinders are misfiring and you are about to throw a rod out of the engine, its not just a little stutter its a big massive hit under the hood

you shouldnt have to re route any lines, just unhook the vacuum line from the wastegate from the boost controller, and then run that tube to the boost nipple on the j pipe or housing nipple

 

[SixBolt_16G]

Know that I think about it I haven’t actually changed my plugs yet, was gonna do em when I changed my oil and just had put it off. I’ll change them after work today. My only concern would be with that I might want to leave it how it is as of right now until I delete that boost controller and reroute the vac lines, and get the boost gauge working properly as well.

Use the cheap $12 NGK copper plugs (BPR6ES) gapped at .028 unless someone else sees a need for colder range 7's.

 

[dwb]

New spark plugs and especially new spark plug wires.
Boost leak test (and fix any noticeable leaks).
See how it behaves after that. If it still misses, start troubleshooting your boost controller/wastegate. Even boost leak test your wastegate actuator and make sure it isn't leaking.
A new turbo all by it's self didn't cause the issue.

 

[1990TSIAWDTALON]

FWIW, fuel cut feels like you hit a BRICK WALL, very distinguishable.

 

[DSMPT]

to me it sounds more like ignition related like misfire/blown spark or/and boost/exhaust leak.

And don't forget to run a boost leak test. That's always the first thing to do especially if you have a MAF sensor.

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It looks like as what I said already. Also should listen to the other's advises.

 

[BIGGZNOW]

It looks like as what I said already. Also should listen to the other's advises.

Indeed nowhere around me has plugs and wires for whatever reason so I ordered them and they’ll be here Wednesday. Still have to look up how to do the boost leak test and will be doing it as soon as possible. I really appreciate all of you guys help

 

[pauleyman]

For future reference get the spark plugs specifies fir a 1g car. 2g specs are ekn double electrode. Unnecessary. 1g is bpr6es or number 7131. There are 200 oreilley stores in Tennessee and they are 4$ ea. Less online at rock auto. I buy them by the box they're so cheap. Wires buy for 2g as the lengths are different

 

[BIGGZNOW]

For future reference get the spark plugs specifies fir a 1g car. 2g specs are ekn double electrode. Unnecessary. 1g is bpr6es or number 7131. There are 200 oreilley stores in Tennessee and they are 4$ ea. Less online at rock auto. I buy them by the box they're so cheap. Wires buy for 2g as the lengths are different

For sure, when I went up and had them ordered it was at oreilys and they didn’t have any copper NGKs in stock but he ordered them, have them and my wires here Wednesday. I’ll try to get the vac line situation with my boost gauge figured out before then to make any trouble shooting or anything far easier. I’m worried after actually having the top 3k rpm’s of the engine available I will probably hit fuel cut due to the 16G with no supporting mods