Check my build plan please

[GSLENK]

Tax return is on its way, and I don't want to waste it... (well I am, but at least not in vain...) This is for a DAILY DRIVER. Street gas only 93 octane.

If you don't wanna read my profile, so far I HAVE (installed):
DSMlink V3-lite-SPEED DENSITY
PR FMIC
WBo2 (and gauge)
Boost gauge
MBC
3"DP with factory cat+catback (i hate loud all the time)
The rest is factory (fuel, 14b, etc...)
20g ready to bolt on
ACT2600 + flywheel, ready to bolt on (still need some oem parts listed below)
No boost leaks, maintenance pretty much up to date.
PTE 680cc injectors installed

*****I changed this area to reflect the route I ended up going, It's gonna make some peoples really relative and informative posts look out of line, sorry*****

I have LINED UP to get:
Exhaust: DMH e-cutout valve 3" -still have to order...
Transmission: street disc, oem tob, clip, ball, fork, -still need to order/find
Fuel: FIC 950cc *see below*, wally 255, buscher/aero/Flab AFPR. Still need to order/find
Turbo: (have 20g)
Misc:
ARP head studs

Any problems with above? anything I missed?

Here are some questions:
Exhaust:
Im gonna weld a cutout to the 3" DP. Its going to point to the ground.

Trans:
Already have new streetlite, and 2600 PP, all i need a disc and random OEM wear parts.

Fuel:
How far will 680s take a 20g? Would FIC 950s handle ~30psi on e85?

Turbo:
Grabbed a rebuilt 20g

I have put in hours or searching, and I could use some input from some people who have done this already.

 

[jpmxrider489]

Fuel
Many people say you cant go to big of a injector. But once your get above 1000cc it becomes hard to get them dialed in for idle and cruise. I know from experience becuase I put in 1600cc and my AFR were all over the place. I currently have 1000cc that flow at 940.

Exhaust
I dont know much about cut outs but I have my AEM wideband in my stock front o2 housing. I have had no problems so far. But I dont know if your wanting to pass emmsions. I dont know if putting it there will void it or not. But I have other problems that are emmssions related.

Turbo
I would reccomend a evo 16g. It more bolt on than any other option. You can consider a 50 trim or 20g but I like the e16g. You can run a hx35 but theres much more modification involved.

 

[supraevo87]

to me it all sounds good ive done the same research and myself im going with the hx35. hope everything comes out good for you.

 

[GSLENK]

Fuel
Many people say you cant go to big of a injector. But once your get above 1000cc it becomes hard to get them dialed in for idle and cruise. I know from experience becuase I put in 1600cc and my AFR were all over the place. I currently have 1000cc that flow at 940.

Exhaust
I dont know much about cut outs but I have my AEM wideband in my stock front o2 housing. I have had no problems so far. But I dont know if your wanting to pass emmsions. I dont know if putting it there will void it or not. But I have other problems that are emmssions related.

Turbo
I would reccomend a evo 16g. It more bolt on than any other option. You can consider a 50 trim or 20g but I like the e16g. You can run a hx35 but theres much more modification involved.

Ill stick to 950s and lower then. Anyone run 950s and have perfect idle?

My car will be registered historic once the rest of my 1.5 year registration is up. Im sure it will pass emissions, my station doesnt really look under the car, they only sniff its idle for 30 seconds, no spinning wheels... I just don't want the exhaust to be inefficient (I heard turbos could ideally be exhausted at the exhaust wheel), or affect WB accuracy.

FP green isnt bolt on? I was under the impression that the FP turbos are pretty much bolt on (except for exhaust manifold, thats where I get a FP mani.) And Green is way more power, with about the same lag as a 20g right? Are e316gs really that fun on the street? I just want more... I have a feeling it will get old fast. I have driven 600cc crotch rockets, im not easily impressed with cars anymore.

 

[preludeachris]

Ill stick to 950s and lower then. Anyone run 950s and have perfect idle?

My car will be registered historic once the rest of my 1.5 year registration is up. Im sure it will pass emissions, my station doesnt really look under the car, they only sniff its idle for 30 seconds, no spinning wheels... I just don't want the exhaust to be inefficient (I heard turbos could ideally be exhausted at the exhaust wheel), or affect WB accuracy.

FP green isnt bolt on? I was under the impression that the FP turbos are pretty much bolt on (except for exhaust manifold, thats where I get a FP mani.) And Green is way more power, with about the same lag as a 20g right? Are e316gs really that fun on the street? I just want more... I have a feeling it will get old fast. I have driven 600cc crotch rockets, im not easily impressed with cars anymore.

80% of the time bikes are going to win....think about it power to weight on a bike ...a lot of newer bikes are pushing 185 to 200 hp ...they only weigh around 400lbs...thats like a 3000lb car pushing over 8-900+ horse power

 

[jpmxrider489]

I have perfect idle with mine. As long as its mitsu flanged it will work. If its down fireing you will need a coupler that will work.

 

[GSLENK]

80% of the time bikes are going to win....think about it power to weight on a bike ...a lot of newer bikes are pushing 185 to 200 hp ...they only weigh around 400lbs...thats like a 3000lb car pushing over 8-900+ horse power

I know. Im just saying, I know what fast really is. and I come from v8s, so i know what real TQ is. I know it wont be the same as bike or v8. Im just saying, again, a 16g might get old fast and that's why. also one of my employers drove a 350whp evo. it was pretty fast. I wanna be faster.

I have perfect idle with mine. As long as its mitsu flanged it will work. If its down fireing you will need a coupler that will work.

IC piping is the least of my worries, I have couplers, and such. I can weld mild steel if i need a temporary setup.

So you would say 950s idle the same as 450s? (feel the same, I know 450 flow less for more time, 950s flow more for less time...) no surging, fluctuating, roughness etc...

 

[jpmxrider489]

I have no problems at all. My idle is like I never changed them. Do you have dsmlink? If so its real easy to tune.

 

[doayamaha]

e3 16g 25psi, 1250cc injectors, e85, put the car on a diet, 255hp, fuel feed mod, afpr, arp's, and never look back.

buddy of mine had a evo that is probley compairable to what you are talking about with the guy you work with. his car compaired to mine i wasn't very impressed with his and mine was built just as i am saying you should build yours. If you want much more than what the e3 can give you, you will be talking about atleast a better bottom end and some cams to help the spool of a larger turbo.

 

[etay89]

So basically, you want a daily driver that's around 300-400whp? Here's what I would get in addition to what you already have:

-Wally 255lph fuel pump and AFPR
-between 650-950cc injectors. FIC is recommended
-New clutch and all is great but it may be overkill for what you wanna do. (I recommend the ACt2600 pressure plate+ southbend kevlar disc+ fidanza flywheel)
-As far an exhaust cutout, not necessary unless you want loud (which seems like you don't like loud). I'd go with 3" all the way back, your choice if you wish to have or not have a cat
-As far as turbo, an evo3 16g is a pretty good recommendation. If you insist on a holset, you may want to consider external wastegate options as well.
-If you go with the evo3 16g, invest in a good set of cams (264/272 is a good street combo).

It's your car though. Only you will be happy with YOUR setup. Consider how much you wanna spend totally, the power you're looking to achieve, if you EVER consider changing your setup in the future, and research different installations people have done.

 

[GSLENK]

I have no problems at all. My idle is like I never changed them. Do you have dsmlink? If so its real easy to tune.

Yes, I aware the tune is as simple as selecting a drop down menu option . It is that simple right?

e3 16g 25psi, 1250cc injectors, e85, put the car on a diet, 255hp, fuel feed mod, afpr, arp's, and never look back.

I dont want worse MPG, and e85 is not really easy to get all the time.
Im not dieting, neither is my car.
1250cc (too big, I assume these are to compensate for added e85 flow. ill also assume they are the equiv to 950s on 93octane)
afpr and 255 in the future for the new turbo.

ARP studs, slipped my mind . good point!

 

[jpmxrider489]

There are videos on dsmlink website. You bassicaly tell it the fuel pressure and deadtime and global fuel and it will do it for you. There are also fuel sliders as well but I dont use those. If your worried about idle just make sure your AFR is around 14.7 and your o2 is cycling. Your tps sensor and isc have a part of it also. Once you watch videos it should all fall into place.

 

[GSLENK]

So basically, you want a daily driver that's around 300-400whp?

Consider how much you wanna spend totally, the power you're looking to achieve, if you EVER consider changing your setup in the future.

mid 400 whp is what I want. Ill settle if im short and in the high 300s. The option to get up to 500awhp with perfecting the final setup will be nice. 500 will break too much stuff too often no mater how strong it is. IMO over 500 is pointless on the street. a FNF 10 second car would be cool, but how many times do you 1/4 mile on the street? (close to none...) I have little ambition to track the car on sticky tracks and push it to the max and break stuff faster, and less ambition to wrap it around a pole.

Honestly, I was planning on installing all this stuff (less the turbo) and get the most I can out of the 14b on this setup (around 18-20 psi right?) Then when I can afford a green or similar (ill leave out the holset adventure/nightmare for now), be able to drop it in, and go. only modifications being fabbing up IC pipes and/or Exhaust pipes. Budget without turbo is around 1000-1500
800 for clutch+components (i did look into sbr, and south bend... ACT is winning price wise, and relatively proven setup)
250 for injectors
300 for pump +afpr kit
180 for e-cutout (I have everything else vs. 400+ for DP back exhaust)
I think with a little shopping, and package deals, used (lightly used) stuff, I can easily stay below 1500. Then save 1500 or whatever for the turbo+installation item specifically for turbo.

My OP is the direction i have chosen, I just wanted to know if something is way out of line, incompatible, unrealistic, or not Daily Drive-able. Ill think about cams, smim etc later.

 

[etay89]

If that's the case, then I would recommend an HX35. It's a cheap, powerful turbo that as long as it's properly oiled, it will outlast the car. If you want to keep a stock exhaust manifold, then get the BEP housing, otherwise, you will need a t3 manifold. Holsets are internally gated turbos stock but for better boost control at higher levels, externally gating them is a must. If you are trying to keep your engine as stock as possible internally, then with a holset setup...you may get over the 350whp hump.

Take a look at these 2 HX35 setups to get an idea...
DSM Forums - View Profile: 90AWDTalon
DSM Forums - View Profile: dsmmike50t

 

[wranglerunner22]

Get a hx35 and a matching twinscroll manifold. Skip the cutout. Just get a good quality muffler and the packing will not burn out like most cheap fart cans.

 

[snowborder714]

FWIW, my 1150's idle perfectly and have no cruise tuning issues. It's typically once you get into the 1250-1600cc sizes that you notice some issues.

 

[dexterholland04]

OP: I've had two sets of 1000's and a set of 1250's, all of them idled perfectly on DSM Link. They drove like stock at part throttle/cruise. Holset turbos arn't the "adventure" you claim them to be, they are actually quite simple to use. All you have to do is choose whether you want an HX35 or HX40, and then purchase the turbine housing that you prefer (I chose T3 on my HX40 Pro). The E3 16g is a great street turbo (even though I am not a fan), but you could make 400+ on a Holset so much easier. They are cheap, and if you don't feel like going the T3 route, the bolt-on DSM-housed versions still made awesome power.

One last thing, any turbo I can rebuild to include: new turbine wheel/shaft, compressor wheel, and bearings/seals for a under $200 is a true winner in my book.

 

[GSLENK]

Get a hx35 and a matching twinscroll manifold. Skip the cutout. Just get a good quality muffler and the packing will not burn out like most cheap fart cans.

ok, i'm reconvinced to go the holset route. I will get a BEP and twinscroll housing with it so twin scroll is an option. cant afford a $1k manifold right now...
BEP bolts to factory 1g manifold right?

Im doing the cutout. its the same as a full exhaust, no better no worse, and its cheaper. and sometimes I like quiet over performance, but not always.

So, heres the update:

-ACT 2600, still there, no one has advised against it.
-Will 1150s take the hx35 up to its max potential given more supporting mods? or should I be going even bigger? (I want to idle/cruise ets...) Along with 1 255, and an afpr, is that enough?
-Holset: BEP, 1g manifold, internally gated (sorry its the cheapest way)
-Oil routing, and Oil pressure sensor, Will oiling (pressure) be easier with the balance shafts still in?
-ARPs

I want to get a setup that will welcome an hx35 and pump some nice power over a 16g. then be perfected (with external gate, twin scroll etc) to be near 450+hp

Is the BEP housing internally gated?

 

[etay89]

BEP is NOT internally gated. Would have to get it machined.

 

[Archer Fabrications]

FP green isnt bolt on? I was under the impression that the FP turbos are pretty much bolt on (except for exhaust manifold, thats where I get a FP mani.) And Green is way more power, with about the same lag as a 20g right? Are e316gs really that fun on the street? I just want more... I have a feeling it will get old fast. I have driven 600cc crotch rockets, im not easily impressed with cars anymore.

FP green is bolt on, but you will need more supporting mods for the power... FP turbos are only bolt on if they have the 7CM DSM flange... which guess what.. the FP manifold has the same 7CM DSM flange as the stock 2g manifold. evo 3 16G will be fun to play with. i was going to go that route then decided to go PTE 6152 DBB. i had the same thinking.. i want more and something small will get old fast. WELL this turbo i have now is more then enough kick in the pants for me. and i used to have a GSX-R 600 and i know what you mean, but my dsm scares the shit out of me. at est 500AWHP

btw.. the injector size it is marketed at isnt always its actual flow rate, as stated earlier the PTE 1000's actual flow is at 950 (also what im running)

boost is addicting. stick with your 14B and get the supporting mods for some crazy turbo and dont look back.

i dont getta have fun with my tax return as i owe the gov 500 bucks

 

[GSLENK]

BEP is NOT internally gated. Would have to get it machined.

so how about I use the original exhaust housing, and t3 FP mani. It wourk fine right? just not optimally?

*********** (off topic) One of the perks of being a college student in a recession. I get the first 2k back 100%, and the second 2k, up to half back. My return could be as big as 3000+ federal deductions so almost 4k If I pay that much in taxes, and blah blah... If your paying taxes, either you make too much, or your arent paying enough up front , jk. , my actual tax rate was about -10% Yes, negative. This year . I actually got refunded more than I paid. back on topic... *************

 

[Archer Fabrications]

so how about I use the original exhaust housing, and t3 FP mani. It wourk fine right? just not optimally?

*********** (off topic) One of the perks of being a college student in a recession. I get the first 2k back 100%, and the second 2k, up to half back. My return could be as big as 3000+ federal deductions so almost 4k If I pay that much in taxes, and blah blah... If your paying taxes, either you make too much, or your arent paying enough up front , jk. , my actual tax rate was about -10% Yes, negative. This year . I actually got refunded more than I paid. back on topic... *************

i effed up my W4 but what ever. and i am almost positive FP does not make a T3 manifold if they do id like to see it. infact, scratch that.. i am 100,000% positive they dont make it in T3

 

[GSLENK]

1-FP green is bolt on, but you will need more supporting mods for the power...
2-btw.. the injector size it is marketed at isnt always its actual flow rate, as stated earlier the PTE 1000's actual flow is at 950 (also what im running)

3-boost is addicting. stick with your 14B and get the supporting mods for some crazy turbo and dont look back.

1-So what else would I need? im trying to avoid internals until something blows, or until i get another engine to build. Im positive I could run a conservative tune until internals/bottom end is ready. I cant wait to sh!t out my first trans WTF (not).
2-Im pretty aware of that, however FICs are flow tested/matched and tend to do the rating or better, and thats the brand Im going with.
3-So im finding out. Thats the plan Im going with. First up is injectors, then clutch, then more fuel. that should max out the 14b. I just want to make sure 100% everything will be fine with the 14b, and that it will be ready for the big ass turbo later on.

I must be having a clouded memory then . I swear there was a relatively cheap, somewhat factory looking manifold for t3? no? t3 is the rounded square right?

 

[etay89]

any t3 manifold should work fine. i don't know how well (i don't know anything about t3 manifolds) but just do a little bit of research and you should find out a few things.

 

[Archer Fabrications]

1-So what else would I need? im trying to avoid internals until something blows, or until i get another engine to build. Im positive I could run a conservative tune until internals/bottom end is ready. I cant wait to sh!t out my first trans WTF (not).
2-Im pretty aware of that, however FICs are flow tested/matched and tend to do the rating or better, and thats the brand Im going with.
3-So im finding out. Thats the plan Im going with. First up is injectors, then clutch, then more fuel. that should max out the 14b. I just want to make sure 100% everything will be fine with the 14b, and that it will be ready for the big ass turbo later on.

I must be having a clouded memory then . I swear there was a relatively cheap, somewhat factory looking manifold for t3? no? t3 is the rounded square right?

for an FP BB turbos your only really going to need an oil feed kit from the head. if it has a T3/T4 oil drain flange, you might need a T3/T4 oil drain tube, FP sells these and is also what im running. literally if you were to get an FP green, as far as the turbo is concerned. you pretty much only need the turbo.. if it is recomended to feed from the head (i dont know if it is or not) then do that.. if it is supposed to be fed from the OFH then that turbo will be bolt on, pretty much toss your J pipe and get a 90 degree coupler or weld an elbow to the turbo outlet and be good to go. although the Evo 3 16G is 100% bolt on as far as comparing it to the 14B

T3 is a square like shape, T4 is more rectangle, standard DSM flange is circular. FP does not make any T3 variant for the DSM manifold, although you COULD get a T3 adapter.. but at that point you might as well get a T3 DNP

any t3 manifold should work fine. i don't know how well (i don't know anything about t3 manifolds) but just do a little bit of research and you should find out a few things.

What ever you do stay AWAY from ebay anything! unless its from private seller selling used brand name parts..

A T3 manifold vs a dsm flange manifold (if we are speaking tubular.) will be EXACTALLY the same with the exception of the flange going to the turbo being different, of course which brand you choose will determind the quality of welds and bends, if it is reinforced or not. (for crack resistance.) I bought a DSM DNP manifold with a tial 44MM wastegate provision, put a 38mm adapter on that and am running a standard DSM flanged manifold on a DSM flanged 60-1 trim turbo with an external dump for only $550. my turbo does get full boost at 5k rpm though, but it scares the shit outa me

side note: even when i was planning to run an Evo 3 16G i was planning for forged internals... just FYI