1G Blower motor not working... [heater speed control resistor]

[Mike1992]

Motor and tranny are in my old parts car, AKA my new daily driver. I converted the 90 talon to all 91 wiring along with 91 engine wiring. Well its cold/rainy and I finally decide to take it out for a good 20 min drive (NO plate/tags/insurance cant go far) Took me a good 5 mins to figure out how to get the windshield wipers workin , So then the windows start foggin up since its 35 degree's outside. I go to turn the heat on and i get nothing No air comes out until I turn it to the last dial (full blast) can someone explain to me if something isnt hooked up its chilly and i wanna go drive, and i cant see through the fogged up window.

I let it sit warming up for 30 mins and I got no heat either just cold air coming through the vents

Ok took some of my dash apart to find the AC/HEATER cable came off, also the recirculate cable was loose so that ones fixed to. I got heat again!!!! Ok now wheres the selector cable at for switching feet/defromt/middle is that on the driver side?

Why dont i get any air coming out the vents until i turn it to full blast? Maybe the electronic connector in back isnt plugged in or its bad?

 

[luv2rallye]

I'm confused which switch he took apart and which plug he has pictured??

I'm assuming the fuse he replaced with a wire is #13 on the hot side of the blower motor relay because it is a 10A and in the inside fusebox both of which he states. The dash switch he's talking about I believe, is the blower switch since his picture exactly matches the connector (and wires) for it. When the brushes of the motor wear way down to the point of shorting, they often are intermittent with the spinning, vibration, and where the armature stops which is why I think it "worked for a moment".

 

[GTM]

...
The dash switch he's talking about I believe, is the blower switch since his picture exactly matches the connector (and wires) for it. When the brushes of the motor wear way down to the point of shorting, they often are intermittent with the spinning, vibration, and where the armature stops which is why I think it "worked for a moment".

Unfortunately I could not download the full electrical PDF file perhaps because of popup window blocking and couldn't read everything. However, that same plug is used on other Japanese products with similar color coding and maybe on the 1G for the ignition switch?? Most of the scenarios offered are well within the realm of possibility so nothing can be ruled out. Yet it seems to be getting away from the path of the least resistance (pun not intended) to diagnosis by making it too complicated.

I am quite familiar with the fact that _some_ blower/fan/starter motors have brush carriers which can short when they wear down. I'm also familiar that some of these Japanese made motors do not have a brush holder/spring which can ever short. This may have been because the brush holder was made of molded plastic?? Off the top it's been so many years I can't draw a picture but did make a mental note that should I have a short in the system I wouldn't have to worry about the brush holder and the problem that is being associated here. Some of these motors are spotwelded and never meant to be serviced, I remember taking a hacksaw to cut one open to find where the open circuit had occured. Many decades ago when imports were called "foreign cars" parts were scarce so you went down to the parts store and found a brush which was slightly oversize and you then filed it to shape and fiit.

Like the fuel pump when they start to fail from brush wear and intermittant contact there will be a discernable pitch and running change. The comutator can get out of round from the arcing giving an obvious pulsation or a growl.

I hate to keep harping on it but unplugging the motor is the easiest path for determining whether it has a major short. Since I'm no DSM expert I can't say where the plug is located but usually you can get your hand on it.

Cheers,
GTM

 

[LunarEclips]

The only reason why the the wire would heat up and burn like that is a negative and positive charge resisting each other. In other words, you have a positive charged wire after the fuse box coming from the power distribution that is touching metal or something conductive. Follow the fused wire to see where it could be grounding out.

 

[GTM]

The only reason why the the wire would heat up
...

I would like to welcome you if it was not done to DSMtuners.

Also I would encourage you to read the complete thread with all the posts so you can formulate an idea or concept which has not been covered. I don't think you meant any disrespect in your reply so I am taking the time to give you what others did not.

The automotive industry as a whole is made up from many different skill levels and that also includes those who asked if they would be wisemen on this site. There are those who have vast knowledge about the exact pitch of a turbine blade for a turbo charger at various RPM. It would be foolish for someone to offer advice outside their skill levels even when they are an expert on Turbos.

When you elect to make an offering post make sure you will not be insulted from those who may know more than you.

Please participate and as you did in this case explain yourself, ask millions of questions, remember the question not asked is the most stupid. If someone addresses your question with an insulting tone then they may not be the person to ask. Just because I made mudpies at 5 doesn't mean I'm a defect.

Cheers,
GTM

 

[blk98tsi]

It was a short in the blower switch.
Here is what I did, and let me preface this by saying that I am a bit of a hacker, so I probably didn't do things like I was supposed to.

I replaced that 10 amp fuse under the dash, & the 30 amp under the hood.
Then I went ahead & unplugged the blower motor, and plugged in the blower moter switch and turned it on. I don't remember if the fuse blew, but I believe it did at that time, because I didn't pull the blower motor. So then I replaced the fuse, & plugged the blower motor in again, and turned the switch on, and it blew for sure this time. Tried it again to make sure it was in any position and it blew again.
Then I replaced the fuse, and ran a jumper wire from black ground, to the black/yellow & the blower ran fine on high (the jumper wire did heat up a bit, it was a smaller guage). Next I tried jumping the black to the other wires for the different settings. All worked and the blower ran at the proper setting, I let it run for a while on one of the lower settings and no fuse blowing. So it must have been a short in the switch. The blue/red wire which goes to the 10 amp fuse looked like it was heated a bit, the shielding near the switch looked a little melted. I'm guessing since electricity flows from negative to positive, thats why the black/yellow was melted. :dunno: I took the switch apart again, and there are 2 little plates in there that make contact. there is only a thin layer of glue that was seperating them, I guess it wore off in a spot or 2 :dunno:, but here is a pic of the switch inards on the tap that went to the contact for the bule/red:

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Don't know how I didn't see that the 1st time. (Quite possibly it became that way after I jumped the 10 amp fuse on my 1st day of looking at this, which may have been after I opened the switch)(On one side, the switch has 2 little plates that had that white stuff between them. The other side had the contacts from the harness on it. )

Now what I did after I found out it was the switch:

 

[blk98tsi]

Ok, so the switch was bad.
I called a few places, and this is definatly a dealer item. The nearest mitsu dealer wanted $45, and he would have to order it. I saw it online at a dealer for $28 + shipping, and planned on ordering it from them.
But 1st I wanted to play with the switch a little bit to see if I could get something done temporarrily until the part came in. The switch was broken anyway, so there wasn't anything to lose.
1st I sperated the 2 contact plates that sit on top of each orther on one 1/2 of the switch, and I tried to glue them back together with a thick glue that would have kept them seperate. Dried the glue in the oven quick, and put the switch back together and tried it- No blower action. I probably got some glue on teh other half of the switch and dirtied the contacts.
I took the switch apart again, and said #### it.
I removed teh tabs & contact areas for the blue/red from teh 10 amp fuse & for the white wire with a black stripe that goes to the ac switch.
I then removed those wires from the switch harness, which was a good idea because the blue/red is right next to the black/yellow that melted that part of the harness pretty good, its possible they could have come into contact with each other. I made a quick little female to female connecter, joined those two and taped them up. Now this means my ac compressor can stay on if I have the blower turned off, I'll have to make sure I remember to turn it off with the ac button for now.
Then I cleaned all the contacts in the switch and put it back together and tried it. I had to take it apart a couple more times to file down a plastic section that wasn't as worn as the metal contacts were, and bend the tabs a bit. I also removed that little glue seperator I tried, and now the 2 little plates are in contact with each other. I haven't seen the inside of a good, non broken switch, I think they should have contact, but I'm not sure where, but it doesn;t matter, because all it is doing now is controllign the blower. If it shorts anything, it will only run the blower faster than it should.
As a final thing that I always wanted to do, but never knew how, I left switch b-92 unplugged and taped up the end. This is the little switch that turns the ac on when you put the vent in the defroster position. I should have done this at the start of winter, cause the air is pretty dry anyway, and I don't think I need it. If I do, I can always press teh ac button.

So my car is all back together for now. I should still order that blower switch, but I probably won't until this goes again. I definatly won't be getting a new switch until I get a new harness end thing. I won't be too hard to replace the end once I find one, but I have to find someone parting a 2g willing to just cut that end of thje harness off ( or take the time to poke the wires out and send me just the connector). So this may be one of those temporary fixes that has to work for a while.

I want to thank everyone who helped me with this. It didn't turn out to be the blower, but you all got me pointed in the right direction and thinking about this more than jsut throwing in higher amp fuses. I certianly appreciate all the input from everyone.

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[GTM]

...
So my car is all back together for now. I should still order that blower switch, but I probably won't until this goes again. I definatly won't be getting a new switch until I get a new harness end thing. I won't be too hard to replace the end once I find one, but I have to find someone parting a 2g willing to just cut that end of thje harness off ( or take the time to poke the wires out and send me just the connector). So this may be one of those temporary fixes that has to work for a while.
...

Good business there, I didn't think it was going to be the blower and I certainly didn't want to see you pull it out only to find it was something else. This is why it's so important to figure out a proper game plan in advance so you don't have to do extra work.

Your profile doesn't show your car or where you live. There are several Pick Your Part yards where you probably can buy the parts for $10. You _may_ find the switch is the same for several years and only the knob is changed.

They make a pronged tool for removing those connectors but you can use a large bobby pin to bend the locking tab. From experience I can tell you replacing the connector only usually never works out well, you just can get the crimp as good as the factory tools. You can take just one from another plug and make a "Western Union Splice" rather than splicing everything. Make your winds tight and then back it up with a solder joint and then tape. This will not fail. If you have to splice more than 1 wire make sure you use the stagger so it doesn't bulk up. If the wires have blackened from heat you will need to sandpaper them clean, if they are brittle then you will need to cut further away from the plug.

Here is a pict of the splice, you will need 3/4"-1" of bare wire.

http://www.tpub.com/content/neets/14176/css/14176_46.htm

Cheers,
GTM

 

[luv2rallye]

Congratulations on a job well done! I'm impressed that you figured out all this yourself. I'm glad it turned out not to be the blower (like I and some others thought) as that would have been more expensive. [I can see now how a short in the other bank of the blower switch would blow the 10A fuse. That side doesn't even connect to any wires in the first bank so I never considered that a short there to the first bank, like to the black/yellow wire's contact, was even possible - lesson learned]. Ingenious short term fix also.

 

[paintball4fun21]

My fan/blower will not turn on, on any of the settings, even high. Ive checked the fuses with no luck. The only things ive done to affect it were a turbo timer and messing around under there installing a pocket logger. Any help would be appreciated (especially before winter!!!

 

[luv2rallye]

So it used to work before you put in a TT and PL? If so try disconnecting them. If not or that doesn't work, it can only be 1 of 5 things: 30A fuse, blower motor relay, blower motor, blower resistor, or blower switch. Try grounding the black/yellow wire on the blower switch connector (or the black/yellow on the blower motor itself) with key on. If the blower now goes on hi you have a faulty blower switch (that's it's hi position) which is usually the culpret. If not, check if the blower motor relay is clicking on with ignition switch. It's the right one above the inside fusebox. Post back if these check out.

 

[Defiant]

If it's not some muck-up with what you did to the wiring, check your fan speed control resistor.
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=97686

 

[NotAsin]

my heater settings 1,2, and 3 are not working, only setting 4. does anyone know how to fix this problem.

 

[GSX93DSM]

Check you heater resister switch. Located on your heater box.

 

[NotAsin]

what does the heater box look like, and where is it located?

 

[GSX93DSM]

It is most likely on passenger side under the dash. You might have to take the glove box out not for sure, but it is diffently on the passengerside under or behind glove box. Wherever your blower motor is the switch is right nexted to it.

 

[Pirrofab]

either check the switch itself to make sure its not broken but i would put money on it being the resistors are shot.. u can see if for whatever reason they were corroded and u might be able to solder them but most of the time u have to replace the unit... it did it on my suburban... my dsm just makes noise like leaves are in the blower motor when on high...

 

[GSX93DSM]

At the autoparts store the resister is like $25. If you replace that if that does not work possibly heater blower switch.

 

[akdsmer]

To make all 3 speeds die, most likely it is the diode in the resistor. Check for power from the switch at the resistor. If there is power in on all three inputs, but no power out to the motor, then the diode is bad. You can be an electrical wiz and put in the proper diode, or just suck it up like the rest and buy a new resistor pack.

 

[blackzorro2002]

how exactly did you remove the blower motor i have that same problem turn it on low it works turn it on high loud grinding noise or if i hit a bump or take a bumpy road.

 

[Trav83]

I'm bringing this thread back because I'm having a problem with my vent blower as well. When I turn the knob it works on the first three settings - [Low] [Medium] & [High] but when I click to the last setting - [Very high] it just shuts off.

I tried replacing the blower resistor that's near the glove box (mentioned on the first page of this thread) but it didn't change anything. What else might be causing this?

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[JoshPA]

I just wanted to thank everyone who posted in this thread for all of the help.

I worked my way through all of the suggested steps until I thought the blower motor was bad. I pulled it out and opened the top. I am not sure if the brushes had been out of the slots before I opened it or not. I put it all back together correctly and it works like a charm now.

Thanks again!

 

[AKUMA1975]

OK i been working on my car for like a 3 week . And I only Have 2 Problems . 1 Rear Defroster does not work and my a/c also. i just want my blower to work . I checked relays and fuses nothing is blown . That i can see . I even changed the blower relay behind that glove box . and still i get no air unless i have the car moving . so i guess that last thing I can check is the blower . Question is do the a/c and blower link with the defroster in someway? Because they both do not work ?

One more thing is there is a socket that does not have a plug in it ? next to the blower near the front of the glove box right side ? I know my car had a/c before ...
this is pissing me off i want heat in the morning .

 

[buhay6]

Ok I'm experiencing a similar problem talked about in the above posts. But I do need some clarification on how the the blower wiring is. I know the 10amp fuse in the drivers side kick panel feeds the 30 amp fuse, I've checked every fuse in the fuse panel and checked for continuity.......no fuse has power in the panel and all connectors are hooked up. Its a little confusing Im not very good with reading wiring diagrams, so I'm wondering if some one can give me a walk through.

Nevermind I think I found my problem.

 

[1gdsmnt58]

ok got a good question for you guys hopefully you can help me out I am about ready to pull my hair out and light the car on fire.... About 5 days ago no I was driving home and all of the sudden my heater blower stopped working. Assuming it was the blower like a idiot i just went and got a new one. Put it in and still nothing. Then I decided to swtich out that silver cylinder looking thing with the one from my tsi.... still nothing so then I pulled out the heater relay beside the fuse box under the dash on the driver side well on my tsi it ended up breaking so I couldnt use it. So I ordered a new one for my es and just put it in and I still don't have anything.... help please!

 

[luv2rallye]

Usually (95% of the time) the culpret is the blower switch and I'd say that is your problem too.

But if you want to test things (which you should have done before throwing $ at it replacing things): First with key on, check to make sure you have +12v on the blower's large blue-white wire (can unplug to test). If so, the heater relay is working. Now plug it back in and ground these wires, one at a time, on the blower switch harness side connector (can unplug it) which should make the blower go on different speeds from hi to lo: black-blue, black-yellow, black-red, black-green. If all works the resistors are fine and your problem is a bad blower switch (or the black wire coming out of it no longer is connected to ground).