300 to 400 horsepower mark

[Eclipseturbo4]

hey everybody i have a 96 talon n/a.. right now i have a cheap cold air intake on it with a 75 shot of nitrous.. with that im pushing about give or take 215 horse on the bottle off its probably close to stock and idk what the torque would be.. the motors in really good running condition and nothen wrong with it at all.. im wanting to be at the 3 to 400 mark for power and maybe 2 somthen for torque.. anything that i could do to pull it to that mark?? what parts would get me the best power gains..

 

[RoryBarron]

ok one more question does a 75 shot of nitrous equal to about 75 horse?

Supposedly yes, though that is also measured at the crank. Considering drivetrain loss it will also be less than that added at the wheels. Basically you could say you have 140hp (at the engine) and add a 75 shot of nitrous. You would theoretically have 215hp. This is likely not realistic or a true number though since that is at peak performance and conditions for both I am sure.

 

[Eclipseturbo4]

Supposedly yes, though that is also measured at the crank. Considering drivetrain loss it will also be less than that added at the wheels. Basically you could say you have 140hp (at the engine) and add a 75 shot of nitrous. You would theoretically have 215hp. This is likely not realistic or a true number though since that is at peak performance and conditions for both I am sure.

ok just thought id clear that up thanks everybody

 

[JusMX141]

ok one more question does a 75 shot of nitrous equal to about 75 horse?

I believe this particular mod adds power as a percentage, not an actual HP number. If you put a 75-shot on a 5hp Briggs & Stratton, you don't have an 80hp Briggs & Stratton.

 

[dplakosh]

I believe this particular mod adds power as a percentage, not an actual HP number. If you put a 75-shot on a 5hp Briggs & Stratton, you don't have an 80hp Briggs & Stratton.

Correct you have a Blown briggs & Stratton motor

 

[gsxeclipse97]

Implying your factory 2.0L qualifies as a "real" car over his...420a's have a 2.4L build just like the 4G63 does so don't try pulling that one. Give me a ####ing break. The only thing that separates them is yours came with forged internals and turbo from the factory, he just needs to add them.

It's not cheaper or practical to sell his car and buy a different model versus building what he has.

It's hilarious how much you guys "think" you know about the 420a. If you're going to compare the car based on what other cars the engine is found in then you have a nice "sporty" Hyundai Sonata.

OP:

You can hit your goals for about $3500 and you will have a fresh forged engine, all NEW turbo components, all NEW tuning/fuel mods (full standalone MS if you choose), NEW clutch. Add another $400 and you'll have an LSD.

So you can take your $3500 and get a tired 4g63 car in worse shape than yours with 150k+ miles that will need maintenance $$$... Or you can spend that money and have a new forged engine ready to go another 100k+, new clutch, as well as new parts that wont need maintenance for a long time.

Also the 420a is not a 2.4 it's 2.0 on the eclipse.. By the way. The 4g64 that's comes in the spider non turbo is a 2.4. But again us factory turbo guys don't know anything.. Being that the rs was my first eclipse.

 

[Revmoto]

This might be good advice or bad advice depending on how you take it and the outlook you have on your car but if you are serious about making serious power then think about a motor swap so you can have a turbo'd vehicle. It is very easy to make that off bottle on a 4g63 especially with the turbo's we have today. I know it can be costly but a mild build and twin scroll FP turbo will make tons of power.

 

[gsxeclipse97]

This might be good advice or bad advice depending on how you take it and the outlook you have on your car but if you are serious about making serious power then think about a motor swap so you can have a turbo'd vehicle. It is very easy to make that off bottle on a 4g63 especially with the turbo's we have today. I know it can be costly but a mild build and twin scroll FP turbo will make tons of power.

Swapping the motor would cost more than the car is worth. And you don't need an fp turbo to make 300hp. Thats quite excessive unless you talking about the t28. 14b or 16g is plenty for his goal if he had a factory turbo already.

 

[JusMX141]

I know it can be costly but a mild build and twin scroll FP turbo will make tons of power.

Say what now? The only twin-scroll FP turbos that I see available are for Evo VIII, IX, and X models.

 

[Revmoto]

Swapping the motor would cost more than the car is worth. And you don't need an fp turbo to make 300hp. Thats quite excessive unless you talking about the t28. 14b or 16g is plenty for his goal if he had a factory turbo already.

FP sells stock replacement turbos but if you want a bad ass kit I would have a custom manifold made to adapts the twin scroll evo turbo. Twinscroll technology is the way to go. I don't think I can ever drive a single scroll car unless I only cared about 1/4 and I am far from a drag car.

Also yes a motor swap can cost more than your car especial if your specific vehicle isn't that expensive but it is all about the base you are working off of and the goals you have in mind. For 5k you can get it done to a degree.

 

[gsxeclipse97]

There is already a manifold for us to use the twin scroll turbos.. The manifold is something like 600 dollars or more. Assuming you are a 4g63 user. Any how back on topic.. He can't do it unless he does some serious work to his current motor.

 

[Revmoto]

There is already a manifold for us to use the twin scroll turbos.. The manifold is something like 600 dollars or more. Assuming you are a 4g63 user. Any how back on topic.. He can't do it unless he does some serious work to his current motor.

4G63 in an Evo I was talking about doing it in conjunction with a built motor.

 

[gsxeclipse97]

I have seen once on another forum they swapped the evo motor into an eclipse.. But there are many thing that will have to be changed not just motor and tranny, ecu.. It wad quite an involved job.. Not that it's impossible just not practical. For 5 grand you could get yourself an awd version of the car, tsi or gsx. Not to mention 286hp on your fwd.. You really should consult some of the gst or (na w/turbo) before you make this move..

Before I get jumped on by the fwd people.. I'm just explaining that going through all that trouble just isn't worth when he could pick up a gst for 3500..

 

[Mike02rt]

Implying your factory 2.0L qualifies as a "real" car over his...420a's have a 2.4L build just like the 4G63 does so don't try pulling that one. Give me a ####ing break. The only thing that separates them is yours came with forged internals and turbo from the factory, he just needs to add them.

It's not cheaper or practical to sell his car and buy a different model versus building what he has.

It's hilarious how much you guys "think" you know about the 420a. If you're going to compare the car based on what other cars the engine is found in then you have a nice "sporty" Hyundai Sonata.

OP:

You can hit your goals for about $3500 and you will have a fresh forged engine, all NEW turbo components, all NEW tuning/fuel mods (full standalone MS if you choose), NEW clutch. Add another $400 and you'll have an LSD.

So you can take your $3500 and get a tired 4g63 car in worse shape than yours with 150k+ miles that will need maintenance $$$... Or you can spend that money and have a new forged engine ready to go another 100k+, new clutch, as well as new parts that wont need maintenance for a long time.

420a's have a 2.4L now huh? Good thing you "know" that.
For $3500 you could easily buy a 1g with a bad head and build a 3-400hp car.
For example:
New head, 2g pistons/1g rods, new bearings, new oil pump, new water pump, oem gasket set
New FP 255 fuel pump, used 850 cc injectors, new dsmlink v3 lite, used 3in catback, new wideband and boost gauge,
parts that came with my $500 91 TSI AWD: 16g turbo, 3in 02 housing delete downpipe, enkei rims with new tires, 272 regrinds, extra transfer case, traded 3 bolt rearend at junkyard for 4bolt for $150.
So to sum up: Fresh long block, new fuel system, full 3in exhaust, and um a new used car with a drivetrain capable of handling the power without any modifications for less than $3500.
Also good luck if you think you can build a 3-400hp 420a motor up on a $3500 budget and be "maintenance free for a long time."

 

[jcmotorsports]

Just my 2 cents, but ive seen a few crazy HP 420a engines around. Search youtube for "DSM ZERO" Granted his car has tons and tons of money dumped into it. You can make power on the 420a, you just need to spend cash. Im doing my second 420a turbo build now. My first made some very good power and i didnt really spend THAT much money.

I would suggest doing a nice set of internals. Low compression pistons. Get a nice set of head internals. The head build is everything!! A decent size turbo, maybe a 20g. I would highly recommend MegaSquirt. As stated above, you cant tune a 420a ECU. Obviously your going to need to upgrade yor fuel and spark, so just do some research on the best setup.

Dont let anyone discourage you man, we all have our hobbies. But i will say, its more impressive to build a 420a, then put DSMlink on your already turbo GST or GSX and call it fast =]

Good luck on your build. Send me a PM if your running into obsticles

 

[caseyrock]

I've actually been doing some reading. I am kinda thinking about building my 420a too. It seems like the best option is to put the 2.4l Chrysler motor in. There is pretty much a complete write up on this website (or maybe it was 2gnt) on how to do it. I've been reading on neon.org as well, they make great power with that motor. The srt4 forged internals are a drop in replacement and will hold 400+hp and cost at most $300 for the rod/piston combo. What you save there will allow you to spend the money on the swap (which is actually pretty cheap to do). Only custom things you need are the oil pan, balance shafts removed, and the pass mount. Then fiddle with the injector order (its all in the writeup) and you have a 2.4l low comp forged block ready for 400+hp.

So pick up the motor cheap from a pull it yard. Pay someone to cut and reweld the oil pan and make you a mount. Spend $400 on srt4 interanls (rods/pistons, bearings, rings), spend another $200 at the machine shop for boring honing the block and turning the crank, get a full top end gasket kit and some arp head studs for around $150, $300 for a UDP and cam gears, get a $1000 turbo setup (way less if you pull a stock turbo system off a 2g63t and just change the manifold and dp), maybe a set of CROWER cams and springs for $400, get MegaSquirt for around $500 (i think), and that sould be most of the big items. Then just little stuff like gauges, boost controller, etc. For full details on the 2.4l swap you will have to go to the writeup. Should be around $3000 to build/boost your motor if you shop around and take your time.

A 420a is only 140hp @crank, the 1st gen neon is actually 150hp @crank

Don't listen to the goons who tell you to get a different car.

BTW, I have a HAHN 420a turbo manifold and HAHN s20g turbo for sale. Check my classifieds ad.

 

[Archer Fabrications]

This might be good advice or bad advice depending on how you take it and the outlook you have on your car but if you are serious about making serious power then think about a motor swap so you can have a turbo'd vehicle. It is very easy to make that off bottle on a 4g63 especially with the turbo's we have today. I know it can be costly but a mild build and twin scroll FP turbo will make tons of power.

you can not put a 4g63 into a 420 A engine bay without SERIOUS fabrication... the motor mounts dont match up AT ALL...

 

[caseyrock]

you can not put a 4g63 into a 420 A engine bay without SERIOUS fabrication... the motor mounts dont match up AT ALL...

He could do one from an EVO III or EVO XIII. I think those are the ones that are flipped around like the 420a. Or maybe it was EVO XI....idk. I'm not doing it. 2.4l

 

[bryanwheat]

He could do one from an EVO III or EVO XIII. I think those are the ones that are flipped around like the 420a. Or maybe it was EVO XI....idk. I'm not doing it. 2.4l

That still requires a ton of fabrication to the subframe, steering rack mounts, sway bar mounts, lower firewall and much more. Plus for the price of a Evo engine and transmission you can literally buy a running 2g awd. By the way the evo 4 and up have the engine on the passenger side like the 420a.

 

[Archer Fabrications]

That still requires a ton of fabrication to the subframe, steering rack mounts, sway bar mounts, lower firewall and much more. Plus for the price of a Evo engine and transmission you can literally buy a running 2g awd. By the way the evo 4 and up have the engine on the passenger side like the 420a.

if you are looking at getting an evo engine, just get a damn evo...... for all the money you would end up spending..... honestly, listen to the other people, throw a turbo in your 420A and run it like that OR just get a TSI/GSX at least then you will have a good TURBO 4g63, AND AWD (if you try an AWD conversion on a GS your lookin at like another 5k man...

 

[jcmotorsports]

How did you guys get stuck on engine swaps?

 

[caseyrock]

I was talking about building a Chrysler 2.4 motor since he will need to build his motor anyways to get to 300-400hp. It's been successfully done many times before, done cheaply, and plenty of info on it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[jrohner]

Awesome, you're gonna have 10 grand in your car and still get spanked by a $1500 1G.

 

[Brian O Conner]

hey everybody i have a 96 talon n/a.. right now i have a cheap cold air intake on it with a 75 shot of nitrous.. with that im pushing about give or take 215 horse on the bottle off its probably close to stock and idk what the torque would be.. the motors in really good running condition and nothen wrong with it at all.. im wanting to be at the 3 to 400 mark for power and maybe 2 somthen for torque.. anything that i could do to pull it to that mark?? what parts would get me the best power gains..

Man I am not going to be a prick because people were like that to me when I first got into the dsms but man you shouldnt even be running nitrous on a stock engine like that. On top of that you have got to be more organized you are probably going to use your dsm as a daily driver right? If that is the case I would not even put nitrous on it and on top of that nitrous on stock engine internals is very highly not recommended for gods sake I have all the aftermarket/forged parts that I am putting together on my 420a and I am maybe going to use a small shot of nitrous. Seriously dude I reccomend you go over the fact that if your wanting to make a track car or a daily driver. Then go over the fact that your going to have to spend a good upwards 8 thousand to 15 thousand dollars to do a track car that can withstand nitrous. On top of that I would turbo the car before I would spray the thing. Your going to grenade your car if you dont rebuild man. If your as crazy as me and the other guys that spend more than 10,000 thousand dollars into the engine than your fine but if your a quitter or you really dont want to spend money than get away while you can because this is a rich mans game.

Awesome, you're gonna have 10 grand in your car and still get spanked by a $1500 1G.

I doubt that.

The 420a is a good car. Its not as slow and bad as some of these guys make it. But if you see a gsx running I would buy it but what these guys arent going to mention is the fact the gsx is pretty rare. I bought my 420a turbo charged with 4500 dollars worth of mods not running for only 700 dollars and all of the parts checked out ok at the machine shop so I upgraded and bought the parts the original owner did not even upgrade or get into like the head and external engine parts and spent another 8 grand. Thats why I bought the 420a.

Just my 2 cents, but ive seen a few crazy HP 420a engines around. Search youtube for "DSM ZERO" Granted his car has tons and tons of money dumped into it. You can make power on the 420a, you just need to spend cash. Im doing my second 420a turbo build now. My first made some very good power and i didnt really spend THAT much money.

I would suggest doing a nice set of internals. Low compression pistons. Get a nice set of head internals. The head build is everything!! A decent size turbo, maybe a 20g. I would highly recommend MegaSquirt. As stated above, you cant tune a 420a ECU. Obviously your going to need to upgrade yor fuel and spark, so just do some research on the best setup.

Dont let anyone discourage you man, we all have our hobbies. But i will say, its more impressive to build a 420a, then put DSMlink on your already turbo GST or GSX and call it fast =]

Good luck on your build. Send me a PM if your running into obsticles

Portfueler is just as good. Megasquirt with great tuning is the best. Hahn Portfueler is simpler and easier to tune

 

[Archer Fabrications]

very true... GSX's are very rare.. i had been looking for one since i was 15, im 22 now, and i finally picked one up for 3900 bone stock. now im $9400 into it on top of the 3900 in the engine and turbo and supporting mods alone. they may be rare, but always be on the look out, i had to go through an 03 mazda protege, a 95 200SX, a 04 yamahaR6, a 2006 350z, a 08 Suzuki GSX-R600, and a 95 subaru impreza wagon before i found my GSX, which happened to be an old friend of mines who was infact local! it can be done. look around and you shall find! i agree with brian, that you shouldent be onto the nitrous at all with a stock engine let alone a 420A, also he is right that you should re think how much money your dumping into this Daily driver/track car. before you are able to make good numbers. im not saying its impossible, but like i said im in it $9400 in after market parts alone and im hoping for 600AWHP and 10s with 130's trap, and its my DD also .... i dont think you could achieve that kind of power on a 420A without spending close to double the cash. not to mention labor if you cant do it yourself.... and machining....

 

[jrohner]

I doubt that.

The 420a is a good car. Its not as slow and bad as some of these guys make it. But if you see a gsx running I would buy it but what these guys arent going to mention is the fact the gsx is pretty rare. I bought my 420a turbo charged with 4500 dollars worth of mods not running for only 700 dollars and all of the parts checked out ok at the machine shop so I upgraded and bought the parts the original owner did not even upgrade or get into like the head and external engine parts and spent another 8 grand. Thats why I bought the 420a.

Exactly, you spent a bunch of money that wouldn't need to be spent on a 4g63 powered car.