1G Sufficient or restrictive? Ic, wg, etc (long post).. 600ish hp guys HELP

[boostdawd]

My boy has a walbro 255 to an aem 380 or w.e he runs aem ems and has it set to the second pump turns on after like 7 or 8 psi or something... Does link have something similar? I have it but I don't mess with it at all.. Learning all that comes after its built my brain can only take so much at once

Good read here.
https://www.ecmtuning.com/wiki/nitrouscontrolwiring

I'm using 2 relays and using ecmlink to complete the circuit by grounding the 2nd relay to activate the 2nd pump. There is parameters u could set on link to activate based on load, rpm, etc.

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[Kapok6]

This is the highest dyno I've seen with a 450.
750hp, the poster said pressure was falling off. Either way, 600 is well within reach for a single hot wired 450.

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Is that on E85?

 

[7"exhaust_tip]

Rewired with 8-10 gauge wire and 30-75 amp relay will be enough for that power level on race gas or ethanol, you just need to have the right injectors for the fuel you are running and the power level you are trying to reach, a boost a pump will work fine if you reach the limitations of the stock 450 but at that point it would be easier to throw another 450 in the tank. 1600cc fuel injectors would work at that power level and keep injector duty cycles in check on ethanol.

Ok, so it will support the power but will it support 40lbs of boost? I have fic 2150s and the walbro 450 is rewired, but Ive heard that the 450 doesnt do well over 35psi. The reason why I asked about the boost a pump is because I already have one, and I think installing that would probably be much easier than trying to rig up a second pump in a 2g awd. I guess what Im asking does the higher voltage equate to higher pressure support or is that just some inherent flaw in the pump design? Also how much life does the higher voltage take off of the pump?

 

[Kapok6]

Ok, so it will support the power but will it support 40lbs of boost? I have fic 2150s and the walbro 450 is rewired, but Ive heard that the 450 doesnt do well over 35psi. The reason why I asked about the boost a pump is because I already have one, and I think installing that would probably be much easier than trying to rig up a second pump in a 2g awd. I guess what Im asking does the higher voltage equate to higher pressure support or is that just some inherent flaw in the pump design? Also how much life does the higher voltage take off of the pump?

Interested in the answer to this as well as i'll be needing more fuel soon and I had eyeballed a boost a pump, or an inline 044...

 

[Vegas Smith]

Higher voltage should mean more flow at a higher boost....theoretically.

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[7"exhaust_tip]

Well going by that chart and that raceworks calculator, @13.5v it will be enough for 600hp, but I'm more worried about whp. It also starts dropping off dramatically after what would be 36psi for me (43.5 base fuel pressure).

 

[donniekak]

Is that on E85?

Yes.

 

[donniekak]

Ok, so it will support the power but will it support 40lbs of boost? I have fic 2150s and the walbro 450 is rewired, but Ive heard that the 450 doesnt do well over 35psi. The reason why I asked about the boost a pump is because I already have one, and I think installing that would probably be much easier than trying to rig up a second pump in a 2g awd. I guess what Im asking does the higher voltage equate to higher pressure support or is that just some inherent flaw in the pump design? Also how much life does the higher voltage take off of the pump?

It depends if you have the relief punched, or the higher pressure version. I ran 42psi of boost on mine and was just starting to run out of pump.

I have a second pump waiting to get installed when I run out this time with a larger turbo. Although I think that if I feed a good inline pump with the 450 I'll have enough fuel to max out my current turbo.

 

[Kapok6]

It depends if you have the relief punched, or the higher pressure version. I ran 42psi of boost on mine and was just starting to run out of pump.

I have a second pump waiting to get installed when I run out this time with a larger turbo. Although I think that if I feed a good inline pump with the 450 I'll have enough fuel to max out my current turbo.

What inline are you thinking of? 044? If I do that i'm going to have to upgrade from stock feed lines to -08.

 

[1990TSIAWDTALON]

I am running an Aeromotive 340 Stealth on stock lines with a HX40 at 39.1 (40) lbs of boost flowing 60lbs/min at 8300. I don't see that I am running out of fuel (E85). I did have to upgrade to larger injectors from my 1120's to get back down to 80% or less of IDC's. I'm really surprised and happy at the same time. JMTC

 

[donniekak]

What inline are you thinking of? 044? If I do that i'm going to have to upgrade from stock feed lines to -08.

That's what I was thinking. With the 450 feeding it, pressure across the inline pump would be less than 40 psi hopefully. Low enough to flow a ton of fuel. I'll look at the numbers, and if it's not going to work, I'll just toss another 450 in the tank wired to an Ecu triggered relay.

Another option is to ditch e85. My current setup can make around 600whp on a pumpgas tune. That's enough for daily use. I could always map out the high boost cells for race gas for the track.

 

[Kapok6]

That's what I was thinking. With the 450 feeding it, pressure across the inline pump would be less than 40 psi hopefully. Low enough to flow a ton of fuel. I'll look at the numbers, and if it's not going to work, I'll just toss another 450 in the tank wired to an Ecu triggered relay.

Another option is to ditch e85. My current setup can make around 600whp on a pumpgas tune. That's enough for daily use. I could always map out the high boost cells for race gas for the track.

Let me(us) know either way which route you decide to go as i'm going to need to figure something out...soon.

 

[Operate]

Ok, so it will support the power but will it support 40lbs of boost? I have fic 2150s and the walbro 450 is rewired, but Ive heard that the 450 doesnt do well over 35psi. The reason why I asked about the boost a pump is because I already have one, and I think installing that would probably be much easier than trying to rig up a second pump in a 2g awd. I guess what Im asking does the higher voltage equate to higher pressure support or is that just some inherent flaw in the pump design? Also how much life does the higher voltage take off of the pump?

Yes Walbro and most other fuel pumps eat up voltage and it makes them happy to operate at higher/cleaner voltage levels, for your setup it appears that you would need 380-400lph of fuel flow. @Vegas smith Thanks for posting the chart! Assuming you set your base fuel pressure to 43.5psi at 40psi you would have an operating fuel pressure of 83.5 psi +-, assuming you have no fuel restrictions or charging issues/ voltage drops, at 14.5 volts WOT you would probably be right at 380lph, it does appear that for our engines bsfc at these power levels that over 40psi is where these pumps flow drops off.

Becuase it is so close to your needs and you already have a boost a pump of course I would hook it up anyways and ball park math says it would help meet your goals with that setup but the worse thing to hear on the dyno is "You're out of fuel, need more pump" I hate this sentence so bad! In that case you can either upgrade to an Aeromotive/Weldon/Magnafuel etc.. OR.... another Walbro 450lph in the tank which is a much more inexpensive option, I would avoid putting another pump inline and opt for another pump intank personally.

So in my opinion it appears that you have the exact fuel setup that you would need for what you want to do, the extra voltage will not harm the pump and will increase the fuel pump flow, and I think it is pulse width modulated so it progressively ramps up voltage, atleast the new ones do so no harm in running a boost a pump, but in the event you need more pump another in tank 450 would be an inexpensive option to a weldon/aeromotive/magnafuel.

 

[Geeb]

I apologize if this is thread jacking

Don't worry about it. I hope this thread can help more than just me.

 

[Geeb]

Anyways what is your response to the input you have recieved from other members about making 600whp, any changes in your direction?

I really really, like most people, want to get my car on the road. I've changed paths 3 times already and I haven't even cranked the car yet and owned it for about 9 months hah.. My original plan was a stock(rebuilt fresh) block stock (rebuilt fresh) head, garrett 60 trim, 255w, 750cc setup...

I quickly got bored with that in my mind. And decided I'd get some internals..

Then decided that wasn't enough and I bought this turbo on impulse without asking more about it...

But I think for now I'm just going to get the wally450 and rewire it and throw some 8an and 6 an feed n return, still keep my 2150s that I haven't ran yet as overkill as they may be, I'll have a lot of room to grow with them. After that I'll get the sd bundle, and then get the flex fuel kit with the ethanol sensor and everything.. And I think I'm probably going to grab an ETS core

What size should I get guys? (Pls specify either core only size or full ic size)

But before all that, Im probably going to get bronze guides.

(After removing the previous bent valves out of my head I noticed a cracked guide, so guides are actually first on the list now)

I'm sure I can look it up and there's probably a bunch of threads on this topic so I'm not gonna ask what the bennefits of bronze guides are. But if someone feels like throwing some info anyway be my guest..

I noticed the crack in one stock guide during a diy port and polish job I'm working on (the amount of wetsanding and everything is insane. Takes a lot of patience. But I'll get it done and post pics)

Once I'm done that and install new guides and seals i will be done the built motor and head.

By the way, Can anyone tell me if I port the .63 hot side and open it up some, will that gain me any? My main thing now like I said is trying to get the car on the road now with the parts I got and the parts I need I'm going to buy with less haste and more research to be sure they'll eventually get me to my goal of 600.

After the car is together, I'll slowly build off it (tube manifold bigger t3 or twinscroll t4 with the hot side to match, etc) if I can see 500 with the turbo as it sits, I'll be satisfied for now.

But everyone knows, satisfaction only lasts so long

 

[Geeb]

Also guys I found this awesome diy mod on youtube to modify your stock hangar into a double pumper.

For us 1g awd guys.

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[henrysan]

Here is a Higher pressure walbro 450 with a 110 psi pressure relief, compared to what I believe is 85-90 psi for the normal walbro 450

https://www.extremepsi.com/store/product.php?productid=30208&cat=0&page=1

 

[7"exhaust_tip]

Here is a Higher pressure walbro 450 with a 110 psi pressure relief, compared to what I believe is 85-90 psi for the normal walbro 450

https://www.extremepsi.com/store/product.php?productid=30208&cat=0&page=1

Well since these pumps are so cheap, I went ahead and ordered one. So now I have a few options. Will prob swap the high pressure one in, and keep the boost a pump handy. Eventually will prob do a dual pumper setup with both 450s.

 

[Kapok6]

How will you fit 2 450's into the tank inlet?

 

[donniekak]

On

How will you fit 2 450's into the tank inlet?

One at a time, then strap them together in the tank.

 

[Geeb]

Well since these pumps are so cheap, I went ahead and ordered one

Yeah I saw they had 2 options with 2 different numbers on them the HP one looks good with their quoted numbers, let me know how that performs if you end up going that route

 

[Geeb]

from stock feed lines to -08.

Yeah. If you're going to upgrade lines def go with the 08an since the 06 is only slightly larger than stock (so my future tuner told me)

Can anyone confirm this?

Ps.. Make sure for e85 guys you get Teflon core lines. Unless you enjoy replacing hemmoraging lines

 

[Geeb]

Also guys I found this awesome diy mod on youtube to modify your stock hangar into a double pumper.

For us 1g awd guys.

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If anyone else has done this, let me know how it went. And how difficult it was. The speed of the video makes it look easier then it probably is, hah..

 

[7"exhaust_tip]

Yeah I saw they had 2 options with 2 different numbers on them the HP one looks good with their quoted numbers, let me know how that performs if you end up going that route

Will do.

Still tidying up my setup(e85 sensor and bigger cams) and still trying to get dyno time someplace...

 

[boostdawd]

If anyone else has done this, let me know how it went. And how difficult it was. The speed of the video makes it look easier then it probably is, hah..

I did this but a little different. That is a great video and great way to do it but it will be pricey. The method I used is more cost effective and similar to what was used by buschur racing.

Instead of drilling 2 holes on the pump cover I drilled only one. Only one 6an fuel cell fitting was used. Then used a y fitting in the tank secured by clamps.

This is not my setup but can be seen for reference.

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