Starting issues - No / Doesn't / Won't Start - MERGED

[prodsm]

All "my car won't start" discussion threads are merged HERE. We've basically made it easier for those who insist upon not searching by grouping together all threads from those with similar issues so you can just scroll through and see some possible solutions. To search for info within this thread, use the "Search This Thread" feature in the black bar about 3" above what you're reading right now.

Could be anything from a loose battery terminal to internal engine damage, and literally everything in between which may involve the electrical, fuel, and ignition system...possibly even something that you screwed up while working on the car yourself. While it's unlikely we're going to diagnose and solve your problem over the internet, feel free to discuss any possible solutions.



I live in Canada and right now its not very warm out, about -30c
my car does not have a block heater too keep it warm.

I tryed to start my car this morning and it wouldent start, ive had this problem before but this time, the car doesnt crank at all it just makes a sound that sounds like an electric drill.

Whats wrong.

Thanks

 

[DM7X]

alright just recently my car wont start unless i jump it. i havent done anything to the car. absolutely nothing happens when i try to start it, every once in awhile i can hear a clicking noise but thats it. ive even put the key in the ignition and it works fine, lights turn on and the radio works but once it hits the last turn the car just shuts down, everything goes dead. i changed the battery to an opitma but still nothing, i also checked the voltage and its fine. only way to start it is to jump it. any ideas?

 

[1slow97]

Bad battery

 

[ProjectTalon92]

well there are a few things that it could be. either a bad battery, alternator, fuse, relay.
you have already checked the battery, but have you checked the alternator? if the alternator checks out, there is a relay on the front of the alternator that coes bad that can't be detected by 95% of parts stores. also, (i believe it is the black 80 amp fuse) in the fuse cluster under the hood. that little thing goes bad, and you search and search and search but it could be something as simple as that. it's hard to see if that fuse is "blown" cause it doesn't always "blow" it just cracks. and the only thing i can think of, is it could be the battery cables, but i'm preaty sure it isn't those. so that would be the last thing i would look at.

 

[assault187]

If it were a BLOWN fuse, It would not fire up while being jumped. Check voltage on the battery, or load test it. Check the connections on the battery especially the ground terminal. Also check the grounding lug thats on the firewall coming off the battery. I know it seems dumb but I see this SAME problem atleast once a week (no lie). Check them out, CLEAN them up and make sure they have tight connections.

 

[ProjectTalon92]

i've had that experience with that particular fuse a couple times. and it wasn't just my car that did it. if it wasn't grounded, you wouldn't even be able to start the car. but it might lead down to that. not trying to argue with you or anything, but just from my experience was similar, and it wasn't that ground wire.

 

[krazywhitboy]

Does the car stay running if you jump it? How long have you let it run after jumping it?

Any alarm system or turbo timer on the car?

I JUST had an issue very similar. The car would run fine when jumped, indicating that the alternator was still good, but once I turned the car off, it wouldn't start back up.

I had the battery tested and it I was told it was fine, voltage was good 12.6v and it was holding a charge. Problem is, a battery can show up as good if it has a bad cell.

I replaced the battery and all was good again.

Make sure your alternator is recharging the battery. Take a multimeter to the battery, with the car off you should be around 12.6v. With the car running, it should jump up to around 13.5v (IIRC). If the voltage at the battery stays the same or goes down, your alt is shot.

Also, like everyone else said, check to make sure your connections at the battery are good, no corrosion, check all fuses and make sure grounds are connected as they should be.

If those all check out good, you might have to start searching for wiring issues.....

 

[hsk8te2006]

I just worked through a simialr problem my car was having. It ran fine if it was jumped, and all the accessories seemed to work fine in the "on" key position, but everytime I tried to start it by itself, it seemed to go dead as soon as I turned the key the last notch to "start".

For me it turned out to be nothing more than a loose battery cable at the positive terminal... Our cars' red battery cables have a design that can lead folks to miss a loose nut. In particular, our car's have nuts on both sides of the smaller cables coming off the main cable's threaded bolt. As a result, it is possible to tighten the outer one fully, yet the inner one may still be loose, leaving the actual battery terminal fitting loose on the terminal.

This is what happened in my car, and when ti was barely loose it had enough contact withj the battey terminal for low power draws (like accessories), but it wouldn't support a full power draw (like the starter).

Before you spend too much money or drive the car to a shop to have other things checked, just make sure that the nuts are tight on both sides of the smaller positive cables' connectors.

 

[VETTE_50_TH]

I just worked through a simialr problem my car was having. It ran fine if it was jumped, and all the accessories seemed to work fine in the "on" key position, but everytime I tried to start it by itself, it seemed to go dead as soon as I turned the key the last notch to "start".

For me it turned out to be nothing more than a loose battery cable at the positive terminal... Our cars' red battery cables have a design that can lead folks to miss a loose nut. In particular, our car's have nuts on both sides of the smaller cables coming off the main cable's threaded bolt. As a result, it is possible to tighten the outer one fully, yet the inner one may still be loose, leaving the actual battery terminal fitting loose on the terminal.

This is what happened in my car, and when ti was barely loose it had enough contact withj the battey terminal for low power draws (like accessories), but it wouldn't support a full power draw (like the starter).

Before you spend too much money or drive the car to a shop to have other things checked, just make sure that the nuts are tight on both sides of the smaller positive cables' connectors.

Ding Ding Ding. If your car shows no battery when you try to start, or a weak one, and after you jump it it stays strong, your battery connections are bad 9/10. Try replacing your cables, i just went through this.

James

 

[Boomer420s]

If the engins starts with being jumped, connections on the battey are fine. How else does the power feed to the starter and back again if the connections were bad? If the car stays running, (espcially for a long period of time) the alternator must be good. If you start the car and run it for a half an hour, does it start without a jump? If so, I assume the car cannot sit over night or long periods of time without needing a jump. If all this is true, you have a parasitic draw. Invest in a multimeter and a nice afternoon, and go testing. Something is causing a drain on the battery while it is sitting for an extended period of time.

 

[hsk8te2006]

Boomer ... you're forgetting that clamping on a jumper cable will improve a loose battery terminal connection...

It is possible for the battery connections to be just barely loose enough to prevent enough current from travelling to power the starter. In such a case, clipping a jumper cable onto the positive terminal also clamps the positive battery cable's fitting onto the battery terminal tiself. So, it is possible to jump (thanks to the connection afforded by the alligator clamp of the jumper cable) and have enough current flow to run the ecu and keep the car running, but not enough of a connection to power the starter and start the car.

 

[Jetrosr]

If the engins starts with being jumped, connections on the battey are fine. How else does the power feed to the starter and back again if the connections were bad?

On the contrary, the only thing jump starting eliminates is the battery and the connections; the reason why you are jump starting in the first place. When you jump start, if your negative connection is to the engine, I would suspect the negative battery cable/connections. Check both your battery cables at the battery end. If the infamous green goblins (green dust) are growing in there, start with those.

 

[hsk8te2006]

Again.... don't forget that clamping on a jumper cable will improve the connection between the positive cable and the battery's positive terminal. All it takes is a loose connection, and it is possible the battery and alternator are both fine, but with a loose connection the car still won't start.

When a car won't start on it's own, but will when it's jumped, a loose cable could be just as much the culprit as a bad battery.

Bottom line: Before doing anything else, check your car's battery cable connections first to ensure they are tight!

 

[skeeter4200]

I concur with the teminal Idea and if there is corosion dont pour coke on it like some like to do , get some hot water and baking soda to pour on them coke just makes stuff sticky

 

[Icarus]

This happened to me on a different car. The starter was kaput. You can pull it, yeah it's a pain in the ass, and have it tested for free.

 

[nfernotalon]

Battery or cables most likely battery, it stays running because the Alt will keep it charged while running but when you turn it off it wont hold the charge and cant start the car.. check your cables too

 

[schroder]

Well, as the title says, the car continues to try to start, even after I pull the key out of the ignition, or turn it to accessories or off. A few other problems have plagued me since I got the motor back in, and Im going to test for spark and fuel later, but I felt this might be one of the problems in everything.

The car does not like to accellerate...1/4 throttle or more or less. It jumps and bucks (but not everytime), like a misfire, but I have new plugs and wires (NGK cheapos gaped at .028). When at WOT, the car does not like to go higher than 3500-4K. It takes it a while to start, if it starts at all...2 to 3 times usually. I also have a CEL for a code 21, CTS error. The motor seems to spin fine, with no akward noises. If anyone has any ideas, I'd love to hear them because I am dumbfounded. Thanks!

I also just replaced the fuel filter as it looked like it was either original or ancient (The car had almost 200K on the motor before the rebuild.) Thanks again!

Also, Yesterday when i finally had an opportunity to start it up, I went to drive it, and it drove PERFECT. Started up with no problems. However, when I made it to the end of the driveway, one of the sparkplug wires came away from the coilpack. I put it on, and went to leave the driveway again, and it did it AGAIN. This time, I fiddled with it too much, and it popped off, with the car running. I shut the car down, reset the ecu, and replaced the wire and have been struggling since. Also, I had a code 44 show up for ignition coil/power transistor unit, but when i put the wire back on, that CEL was gone. Now, I have a code 21, Engine Coolant Temperature Sensor code as my only code reading. Thanks again!

Also noticed that I have a small Fuel leak coming from the top seal on my #4 fuel injector, but there isn't much gas underneath it, so I dont think its leaking a Ton...just leaking.

Ok...Well, i went and checked my plugs (which are 2 days old) and they are white tipped so I knew they were running lean....VERY lean. I called a friend to see if he had any ideas besides a fuel pump, and he asked about my CAS. I told him the bolt on the CAS that is clearly visible was almost at the top of the sensor. He told me to adjust it back, around the middle, because I was probably too far advanced. **So everyone knows, this is where the CAS was on the car when I bought it. Its my first time ever becoming so involved with a car, and I didn't know/think to adjust it** I adjusted it back, and it pulled great til about 5500 to 6K...I know I still have a leaky injector seal, so Im not going to make any more pulls because I dont know if it needs to be retarded further, or if its from the seal losing too much fuel at that RPM. The one thing that still baffles me is that it still tries to start on its own when I pull the key from the ignition or leave it in the on position...Any help here would be greatly appreciated!

Didn't get a change to check out the starter wires while I was in the garage (kinda forgot about it), but I'll update if that is the problem. I know there has to be a problem, probably a short somewhere, because when I had to jump the battery today and the ignition kept trying to turn, I fried my jumper cables (smoke and sparks and no workie no more). Any ideas on anything would be great. Thanks!

Going to try to finish up the car today...Any suggestions for my continuous start?

Fixed the continuous start...I didn't have the ground hooked up right on the starter...I Guess I was rushing...But I have another starting problem. I know the starter is turning the motor, and I've tested for spark and fuel and got both. The problem is the same as the other day too. The car will not start, no matter what. THe other day, when I finally got it to start, it started everytime thereafter...It just took about 15-20 seconds. Today, when I went to start it up after I fixeda few more problems, she wouldnt start at all. Engine turns, fuel and spark are there, and the timing was dead on...electronically and mechanically. And the only code I am getting from the ECU is a code 21..for the Engine coolant temp sensor...Would this cause the car to not start when cold? Any help is appreciated!

 

[steve]

Fixed the continuous start. I didn't have the ground hooked up right on the starter. I Guess I was rushing.

...

And the only code I am getting from the ECU is a code 21, for the Engine coolant temp sensor.

Would this cause the car to not start when cold? Any help is appreciated!

What ground on the starter?
The only ground is mechanical via bolting it to the bell housing. There is the large power feed direct from the battery and the lead to the starter solenoid that connects the starter to the starter feed when you put 12v on it.

Yes, a bad ECT sensor can cause a no start by drowning the engine in fuel because the ECU things it's -40F outside.

Have you checked to make sure you didn't knock the wire off the sensor as you have been working.

 

[schroder]

I had it bolted to the bolt on the bellhousing...It was just on the one connected to the starter...I dont know if that should have effected it, or me adjusting the timing when I had it running the other day, but it stops when I pull the key now. As for the ECT, all my connections are plugged up to the thermostat housing, and If memory serves me, the ECT plug is the one with 2 perpendicular male connectors...and Ive fooled with it - pulled it off, put it on, tried to wiggle it - and still no start. When the motor had started the other day, it idled fine, and drove fine, but took FOREVER for it to start. And today, its a no go on the start. The only difference, is today its 45 or 50 and the other day it was 70-75. But when it had been started, it had no problems starting back up...it just took it a min after I had been away from the car for a while.

Ok...Now that I solved that problem (CAS Plug had a wire break and I had to repair it)...I ran into another. THe car runs strong, pulls hard, and drives great...Unless I am stopped. From a stop, its very difficult to put into first or reverse...And it was never this difficult before. When I had to replace my trans, I also replaced my slave, my clutch and flywheel (Stage 3 Clutch, Lightweight Flywheel...Just in case I start modding soon). The trans is good, and the slave doesn't leak. It shifts perfect, even at higher RPMs...it just doesn't like to start moving. I also find that if it will not engage first, I can start to release the clutch pedal out and give it gas, as if I would normally accellerate, and it will slide into gear and be perfect. I also have gone to adjust the clutch pedal, but found it to be adjusted FULLY out, with no more threads left to safely extend the rod imo. THe clutch engages about halfway off the floor. I think its probably my master, but its full of fluid, and I haven't noticed any depreciation of fluid in the master cylinder. Any ideas or thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

 

[schroder]

Ok...I'm going to work on the car today, and hopefully finish up. However, any help on the last problem would be greatly appreciated. Im going to try to bleed the clutch more and see if i can get anywhere with that, but Im not sure that I will because I was very particular when I did it last time. Also, I know the book calls for 75-90w gear oil in the tranny, however, I took off the end casing on the transmission to see if I needed to do the VFAQ or not on the shifter fix (I didn't think I did, but I had other work too, and I dont feel like having to do it again...) and the VFAQ has the gear oil needed as 80-90w. Im going to switch over to synchromesh, but I wanted to use the crappier stuff first to try to clean off some of the existing goop since it was a Japanese tranny originally. Before I went 80-90w, it shifted into gear fine...it was a little difficult sometimes, but not always. Any input would again be appreciated. Thanks!

 

[steve]

I'm sorry I can't help with the clutch problem and your not going to attract many people that can with the current thread title. I'd suggest opening a new thread specific to that problem.

 

[steve]

I'm starting to wonder how many people are hearing the ISC home on power up and thinking it's the fuel pump running? I'm not referring to what Locke was reporting. We know that on some cars the CAS glitches on power up and that will cause the pump to turn on but it just occurred to me that there is another sound that could be confused with the pump.

 

[Mikej]

I been reading a few of the other similar posts and i guess its one of three things, considering the plugs/wires are all good, fuel filter, coolant sensor, or fuel pump, but i guess my question would be how would i narrow it down to the problem? I'm a noob thats why im posting this in the newbies forum even if its just pointing me to articles where i can read on it would be fine. I took it to a mechanic and they told me it was because the hose that recirculates the bov was a bit loose, after i told them i had a talon and another eclipse that didnt use them and never had any start probs (gm mod) he insisted it was because the tube was "loose". I laughed paid him 130 for looking at it and towed it home. So im going to try to do it myself and save some money since im out of work right now, any help?

 

[banishedmunk]

the coolant sensor on our cars tell the ecu to run either open loop or closed loop if the car is cold and the sensor tells it to run in open loop it will flood the car with fuel and not start i had a problem with this myself

the sensor can be ordered from any parts store
While we find your parts, please enter your ZIP Code at PartsAmerica.com
here is a picture of where the sensor is at on a 2g
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/att...oolant-temp-sensor-plug-picture-temp_sens.gif

 

[eeeewidner]

Dude you got ripped from a mechanic that obviously doesn't know anything about DSMs. I wouldn't of paid the 130 unless he had a solid diag on it. Unless he asked for more time, but informed you that it is only a possibility that it may be the cause and a starting point only, with no guaranty that it is going to fix your problem.

Anyways, No a bov hose will not cause a no start when cold. Check your coolant temp sensor. If everything else checks out ok. By the way, are your plugs black.....

 

[DSMboostin15]

I have a similar problem with a cold start problem. This morning I left for class and the car started fine - it idled rough and almost wanted to die when the car was stopped, so I kept my foot on the gas to keep the RPM at ~1000. But when I went back to leave campus, the car would not start. It cranks and sounds like it want to start, but it won't catch. I've recently changed the timing belt, tensioner and tensioner pulley because they failed. All the timing marks are lined up and timing was at 5* BDTC like it's supposed to be. I've also replaced the spark plugs with NGK's gapped at 0.028 like they are supposed to be. After I did all this and the engine's running, I can occasionally hear a misfire in the exhaust. I've also noticed that the infamous belt squeal is intermitting - only when I'm accelerating and goes away at ~3000 rpm. The alt. belt is new, so it is either too tight or too loose. I adjusted the tension so there is ~ 0.25in deflection like the FSM says, maybe a little tighter.

I've done some research and have come up with the engine coolant temp sensor might be bad. Now I did notice that when I was working on the engine, a vacuum line that goes to what appears to be a sensor on the underside of the thermostat housing was ripped and disconnected. I haven't had time to fix that, so could that be a potential problem? I tried jump-starting the car, but that didn't work - the battery is 5 yr. old and was going to be replaced when I was going to leave today. I've checked the MPI fuse and it looks ok. I'm also leaning toward the alternator being shot. I'm running out of things to check, so if anyone has some insight, it would be greatly appreciated.