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ECMlink Should I stay put on this E85 tune? Advice on where to go from here?

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CountryDSM

Proven Member
177
22
Dec 13, 2012
Chandler, Arizona
Tried finishing up/dialing in the tune for the most part. Looking to see what advice experienced guys have on where to go from here. Back to back logs are attached. 3 knock, one clean. No AWD dyno near me, so it makes it difficult to have any sort of benchmark and I completely understand if you can't give advice because of that. I know my timing is ridiculously low compared to setups like Gofer on E85. In the logs you will see this new recently occurring slight knock I have had so I don't want to increase it.

So I guess my question is, thoughts on these logs and current setup? I don't have a dyno, but I would assume I have power to gain from timing that should still be safe. I could pull boost levels and go for more timing? I know every car is different, but it's crazy how Gofer and other guys have these wild timing tables compared to mine with the same boost level as we have the remotely the same setup.

Current confusions I have:
- Wideband on WOT is going from 11.4-11.9 - It should be less erratic, right? Will calibrate the sensor.
- Slight knocking - Boost levels may be slightly too high? Timing is so low. I was not running these boost levels before I had the head cleaned/decked/cometic HG/etc. Possible something isn't perfect with the knock sensor on my end from install or it's going wacky.

Also I know the boost levels peak and drop hard up top. Internal wastegate is the direct cause of that so a consistent boost level will not happen.

2g MAF. Ported JusMX style HTA68 w/ 20g billet wheel. Holset internal gate, external dump O2. 3in Exhaust. FP manifold. Hallman MBC. PR FMIC. Stock block. Head has been cleaned/decked like stated with ARP studs, Cometic HG, and Delta 272's. 1000 ID Injectors. E85 450lph. Fuel Lab 818 + -6an lines. Edelbrock/SX performance AFPR. Ask for whatever else.

1). Any boost, vac, or exhaust leaks?

Throttle body seals may be slightly leaking, but nothing otherwise at 30psi tested.
2). Verified mechanical timing? X 3). Verified base timing? X
4). Ignition system
COP or Stock Coil: Stock
Wire brand and Age: Brand new NGK ME64 (9634)
Spark Plug brand, type and Gap: Just switched from BR6ES at 0.20 to BR8ES at .20 (The colder plug is for many reasons, but mostly to prevent pre-igniting with the ethanol.)

5). Motor health (Compression Test)
Cylinder 1: 155
Cylinder 2: 155
Cylinder 3: 155
Cylinder 4: 155

6). Performed basic throttle body adjustments?
Idle Switch: X
Throttle Cable: X
TPS: X
BISS: X

7). Compression ratio
Stock
8). Any known bad sensors or brittle wiring?

No
9). Any DTC/CEL codes?
No
10). Electrical system
No issues. In log - Running at 14.0-14.5

11). Base fuel pressure and injector values
Base Fuel Pressure: 50psi to keep injectors under 100% IDC
Injector Size (cc/min): 1000ID's (900cc flow)

12). Properly calibrated and configured wideband sensor
Sensor Brand: MTX-L Innovate
Calibration Date: 6 months ago

13). Type of fuel
Type: E85
Percent of Ethanol: Summer blend in Nebraska, not tested

14). Watched ECMlink how-to videos? X


 

Attachments

  • E85 30psi June 30th 2016.elg
    180.1 KB · Views: 88
  • E85 30psi June 30th 2016 knock3.elg
    103.1 KB · Views: 48
  • E85 30psi June 30th 2016 knock2.elg
    120.7 KB · Views: 66
  • E85 30psi June 30th 2016 knock.elg
    251.2 KB · Views: 70
Your TPS needs a manual adjustment.

You need bigger injectors.

Your MAF comp in the low range is stupid high, so I suspect a problem there. I assume the bump in FP you're using to band-aid your undersized injectors is trashing your idle...But I'd expect you to need to pull fuel, not add it. Again, I suspect a problem there.

Your log looks decent overall. Your WB lines up pretty well with your AFRatioEst. There is some fluctuation, so I'd see if you can calibrate it and improve the reading.

I have a suspicion your Nebraska E85 is shit. How much boost was the 251.2 KB log on (that's the only one I looked at)? Unless you're at 30psi or above, you should be able to run a lot more timing than you currently are without knocking. For reference, I'm at 18 degrees peak.

My suggestions would be:
-Calibrate your wideband.
-Fix your boost problem so you can get to a steady boost pressure throughout the RPM range
-Adjust your TPS
-Look for bigger injectors
-Get sample of your E85 tested for ethanol content. I use one of these: https://www.summitracing.com/parts/qft-36-e85

LMK if you have any questions by tagging me @GST with PSI
 
@GST with PSI - Thank you for the quick reply

Yes I do need to bump up the injectors. For the time being I saw Gofer bumped up the FP to 55 when they tuned and it looks like he used that until he went bigger. What drawbacks are attached with this exactly? Trashing idle in what way?

Could you elaborate on what problems you suspect? That's how the car has always wanted it with a hacked 2g MAF and close to the mafcomp template it supplies for low range hacked 2g maf. You think I should have to pull fuel from what part of the tune?

In regards to the TPS, what is it currently affecting negatively with it being a smaller amount off of 100% and 0 ? Honest question.

I am at 31-2 lbs of boost peak and it drops down to 25lbs at the shift. External wastegate would steady that, but it's not something I'm going to change for now. I will just make less boost up top, but it will save the turbo from working as hard.

Looking at that online chart of all E85 percentages, we get the good blend during this summer season from July to August.
 
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Verify the torque (17ft.lbs) and condition of your KS, that's not detonation and if anything you're running too low of timing on E85 which can do more harm than good. E85 isn't like 91 where you advance timing until it knocks, then retard it a few degrees where you're picking it up in the log.
Kick boost down to 20psi, load up a E85 DA timing table, and do a 3rd gear pull from 2.5k to 7k on a flat road in Mexico and get AFR's lined up. Wash, rinse, and repeat after you kick boost up to 25psi, then to 30'ish like you're running now.
Crawl-->Walk-->Run.

9-10* is the most retarded you want to see timing in a E85 table, right at peak torque (full boost) advancing it back to 16-17* by redline. It's possible you can melt spark plugs and valves because you're not running ENOUGH timing advance on E85.
 
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