Removed Emissions Vaccuum Lines Now Problems

[tight_tsi]

So I removed all of the emissions vaccuum lines tonight after work per following the directions from the Taboo diagrams. I capped all 4 ports on the throttle body. Completely removed the charcoal canister and left the line to the fuel tank vented/open. Removed all the vaccuum lines associated with emissions. My wastegate is getting supplied from the J pipe, I have no mbc as of yet. The car is otherwise stock except for a 16g turbo. I also installed a new battery and new fuel filter while I had things apart. The egr is also blocked off.

I drove the car to work today, drove it around on my lunch break, and drove it home with no issues. After the above work was completed and all put back together, I went to drive it and I'm now getting a bunch of white smoke out the exhaust even while just idling. It might have a slight blue tint to it but it is mostly all white. Revving up the engine in neutral makes it a lot worse. I've double checked everything - even pulled off the intake pipe to check the turbo for shaft play, etc. It has a slight amount but the fins don't touch the sides or anything. I have the feeling it has something to do with the modifications I performed as it drove perfectly fine right before I did them.

Any suggestions/advice?? Thanks in advance -

 

[98DiamondStar]

Hey there, from what I understand about the emissions system, you cannot remove the evap lines all together without re-programming your ECU, otherwise it will purge the system, and your Air/Fuel ration will be dangerously lean, and if you run a car like that too long or too hard, you could loose your engine. Judging by the White smoke with a shade of blue in it, that could be your case. However; if there is any anti-freeze being burnt it will also smoke white, but not blue. If you still have the lines that deal with the evap

 

[RT-AWD]

Why did you remove your emissions on a stock car?
I removed all of mine including the fiav but my car is far from stock.
I would recommend putting the emissions stuff back in asap.
If you want to mod your car with "free mods" there is a section for that here is a link to this forums upgrade paths. Tech Guide: 1G 4G63t Upgrades - DSMtuners

 

[tight_tsi]

Why did you remove your emissions on a stock car?
I removed all of mine including the fiav but my car is far from stock.
I would recommend putting the emissions stuff back in asap.
If you want to mod your car with "free mods" there is a section for that here is a link to this forums upgrade paths. Tech Guide: 1G 4G63t Upgrades - DSMtuners

Well, exactly - the emissions removal is the very first step in that upgrade path link!

 

[98DiamondStar]

Yes, it is under the "Stage 0" mod list if i'm not mistaken. But as he said before, i would get the emissions stuff back on. Something along the line is beginning to, or has already blown your engine.

 

[Dsmj89]

There is nothing bad with removing the emissions system.
By any chance, did you forget to block off the 2 small ports on the thermostat housing ? There are 2 nipples there that used to have vacuum lines coming off of it, re-check to make sure you capped those off.

 

[LiquidX]

As long as you keep the solenoids hooked up you are fine. If you remove the solenoids you will get a CEL until you have a device do turn them off.

Did you perform a boost leak test after messing with the system because not part of the problem but you may have a leak somewhere until you make sure there are none.

White as you may know means coolant. Did you fiddle with anything else while you did all of this? Mess with the throttle body at all?

 

[brian9397gsx]

It also could be an unrelated problem that is just coincidentally happening now, if you check it all over and find nothing time to check other systems.

 

[tight_tsi]

There is nothing bad with removing the emissions system.
By any chance, did you forget to block off the 2 small ports on the thermostat housing ? There are 2 nipples there that used to have vacuum lines coming off of it, re-check to make sure you capped those off.

No - I did not block those ports off of the t-stat housing thermal valve. I did not see that in the instructions or maybe I missed it???
What would this cause by leaving them open?

As long as you keep the solenoids hooked up you are fine. If you remove the solenoids you will get a CEL until you have a device do turn them off.

Did you perform a boost leak test after messing with the system because not part of the problem but you may have a leak somewhere until you make sure there are none.

White as you may know means coolant. Did you fiddle with anything else while you did all of this? Mess with the throttle body at all?

I did leave the solenoids connected yes. Have not done a boost leak test because the only thing I took off was the turbo inlet pipe, and haevn't drove it anywhere since because of the large amounts of smoke. I didn't mess with the throttle body at all except for capping off the 4 vaccuum ports with rubber caps.

And replaced the fuel filter and battery.

 

[LiquidX]

It's always good to boost leak test after messing with any part of the pressurized air system, just food-for-thought

Time to start narrowing down symptoms.

How does your oil and coolant look? Any bubbles form in the coolant with the car on?

 

[kthackst]

There is nothing bad with removing the emissions system.
By any chance, did you forget to block off the 2 small ports on the thermostat housing ? There are 2 nipples there that used to have vacuum lines coming off of it, re-check to make sure you capped those off.

Throttle body not thermostat. On 91-97 there should be three vacuum ports an 98-99 there are only two.

 

[tight_tsi]

It's always good to boost leak test after messing with any part of the pressurized air system, just food-for-thought

Time to start narrowing down symptoms.

How does your oil and coolant look? Any bubbles form in the coolant with the car on?

Will do a boost leak test this afternoon after work.
Oil looks good and coolant looks good. Coolant is brand new as of 2 weeks ago. I took the cap off when it was cold and let it run - no bubbles nice and green - no oil residue.
I work as a service advisor in a ford dealership, I have some general knowledge of cars and basic mechanical skills. But this has me boggled....wish I wasn't stuck at work. Want to be at home trying to figure this out!!

Thanks for all the replies - it at least gives me some ideas as to what to try tonight.

Throttle body not thermostat. On 91-97 there should be three vacuum ports an 98-99 there are only two.

Yes - mine is a 1990. There are 2 ports on the top of the TB and 2 ports on the front-facing side of the TB. I capped all 4 ports.

Been searching all over the forums here today so far.

Kind've learning towards a blown turbo?? What things could I easily look for to determine if this is the case? Since it's white smoke - how could I tell if the coolant is getting through the turbo and into the exhaust system??

 

[LKWTSI]

I removed ALL my emissions entirely and never had a CEL or a bad idle or any problems at all!! I had the EGR blocked off, canister removed and Fuel Pressure Solenoid and Purge Control Solenoid and never had a days issue.

As for the T/stat valve, you don't need it, if your going to go emission-less, just get a NPT plug for it. There's no coolant moving thru' it and the valv e is temp controlled and just opens or closes a vac' circuit (but like I said, easier to remove it).

Do a boost leak test, make sure the T/Body vac' ports are sealed good and check all your connections.

As for the smoke, hard to say, but coincidence on the turbo shaft bearing failing...possible. My old 14b gave up the ghost very quick one day and did exactly like you said yours is doing. But from just doing emission mods, I doubt it was something you did from that.

 

[tazndrew04]

I removed all the emissions from my car and never had a problem with it,never smoked at all but im running ecmlink although it sounds like maybe a cracked headgasket? smell your dipstick and see if it smells like just oil or also a hint of coolant. I thought that with a blown turbo there would be black smoke?

 

[RT-AWD]

Well, exactly - the emissions removal is the very first step in that upgrade path link!

yes but obviously something you did isn't right so, check the faqs on exactly what you need to do in order to find and fix the problem. Anytime thick smoke is coming out of your car there is an issue that needs to be addressed before you drive the car.
If the car is your only means of transportation and you need it available, undo the mods you did and hopefully the smoking will stop.

i ran 13.4 with a boost controller (16 psi), 255lb fuel pump, s-afc, plugs/wires, catback exhaust, and race gas. That is awesome performance for about 1k. Yeah i also still had my emissions.

Tazndrew04: it would be blue or white or a mix.

A blown turbo will look something like this :http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-7hiRkb-ZNM

 

[tight_tsi]

I have a truck so this car is not my only mode of transportation.

However I'd much rather be driving this than my truck!


I don't recall seeing smoke coming from under the hood - which general area under the hood would it be originating from? It was also dark last night in my garage so that will be something I look for when I get home in another 2.5 hrs.

That video of the blown turbo sure does look like exactly what my car is doing. I have a feeling the turbo is going to be my culprit.
What can I look for to confirm this?

 

[wkmitsu]

Hey there, from what I understand about the emissions system, you cannot remove the evap lines all together without re-programming your ECU, otherwise it will purge the system, and your Air/Fuel ration will be dangerously lean, and if you run a car like that too long or too hard, you could loose your engine. Judging by the White smoke with a shade of blue in it, that could be your case. However; if there is any anti-freeze being burnt it will also smoke white, but not blue. If you still have the lines that deal with the evap

False. There's no problem with removing the emissions system as long as it's done right.

Check for boost leaks, check for signs of a bad head gasket, and take another look at the turbo. It sounds like your problem is coming from somewhere else and coincidentally is happening after you did this work. As mentioned before just leave your solenoids plugged in to keep from throwing a CEL. Did you bypass the fuel pressure solenoid? If not, then you can do that too. Just keep it plugged in.

 

[tight_tsi]

^^^^I didn't bypass the FPS - thought about it but didn't. Might end up doing that this afternoon as well. Did leave them plugged in though so not to get a CEL.


So if it's oil burning in the exhaust to make the white smoke - if I pull the turbo intake hose off I'm assuming I'll see a bunch of oil pooling??? Or what would I do to verify the turbo is the culprit without removing it completely?

 

[wkmitsu]

^^^^I didn't bypass the FPS - thought about it but didn't. Might end up doing that this afternoon as well. Did leave them plugged in though so not to get a CEL.


So if it's oil burning in the exhaust to make the white smoke - if I pull the turbo intake hose off I'm assuming I'll see a bunch of oil pooling??? Or what would I do to verify the turbo is the culprit without removing it completely?

It's burning coolant in the exhaust to make the white smoke. If the turbo doesn't have a ton of shaft play then I'm not sure if that is the problem. Other than checking shaft play, I don't really know of any other way to diagnose one for problems. It seems odd that it wouldn't have a ton of play and still be causing problems, but I'm not sure. If there's white smoke, you're burning coolant somewhere though, so check everywhere that could be happening.

 

[RT-AWD]

the smoke would be coming from the turbo itself.

i think you may have obstructed or unplugged and capped off a coolant line to the turbo by accident. Either that or you have some odd luck and you completely destroyed a oil seal in your turbo just after removing the emissions. take off your intake pipe and look for oil like you said but also check the shaft play (up, down side to side, in and out) in a perfect world its not supposed to move AT ALL. Also if you removed the pcv valve or blocked it off you could be having a lot of oil building up in your intake manifold. This is why people get catch cans to catch this access oil. i think your turbo is the culprit.

 

[nek]

As said before, emissions removal wont cause smoking. He stated that it might be white-blue which would be oil. If you think its oil coming for the turbo, you can check your turbo intake pipe and you should also check your ic piping. If you dont see any then those are probably not it.
If its white smoke, as mentioned, that's coolant. Neither oil or coolant have anything to do with your emissions block off so I really think something else is the problem. Only other thing I can think of is maybe your emissions block off caused you to run hotter maybe causing you to see smoke that wasn't noticeable before. I also cant see a boost leak being a problem but you dont want any of those anyways.

 

[tight_tsi]

It's the turbo!! I will attach a picture to this reply at the bottom of the housing where the fins spin you can see the evidence that they have been hitting the housing of the turbo slightly. There was a little bit of oil too as you can see. This was a used turbo that I installed when I got the car a month ago. Guess it wasn't as good as the guy told me. There was a tiny bit of shaft play but I didn't expect it to go out this soon!

So do I rebuild this one or find another replacement??

So bottom line is that the emissions removal didn't have anything to do with it. I didn't touch the pcv line at all - it is still 100% stock except for actually replacing the pcv valve itself about 2 weeks ago with a new one. I have 2 catch cans that I ordered 3 days ago that should show up any day now to run a 2 catch can setup on the pcv line with a us plastics check valve and one for the valve cover vent-to-intake.

So I'm going to call this off to a total, weird, coincidence?!?!?!

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[98DiamondStar]

False. There's no problem with removing the emissions system as long as it's done right.

Check for boost leaks, check for signs of a bad head gasket, and take another look at the turbo. It sounds like your problem is coming from somewhere else and coincidentally is happening after you did this work. As mentioned before just leave your solenoids plugged in to keep from throwing a CEL. Did you bypass the fuel pressure solenoid? If not, then you can do that too. Just keep it plugged in.

NOT false. You can not just disconnect evap lines, The ecu purges the evap system and if it is disconnected it will not allow that vapor to get to your engine. Meaning your car's A/F will be LEAN.I don't know what happens to your engine when you run it lean, but on any other engine it can be catostrophic. With that being said, Seeing as he was showing signs of blue smoke as well as white, that COULD have been the issue. But in his case, thank goodness, it was only the turbo.

 

[wkmitsu]

NOT false. You can not just disconnect evap lines, The ecu purges the evap system and if it is disconnected it will not allow that vapor to get to your engine. Meaning your car's A/F will be LEAN.I don't know what happens to your engine when you run it lean, but on any other engine it can be catostrophic. With that being said, Seeing as he was showing signs of blue smoke as well as white, that COULD have been the issue. But in his case, thank goodness, it was only the turbo.

I'm sorry but you're wrong. I've had everything emissions removed from my car for almost a year with no negative effects. I've also done this to two other DSMs, which also have seen no negative effects from it. I also have a friend who has owned 15+ DSMs, all of which had the emissions equipment removed with no negative effects. Not to mention the countless members on this site that have done it with no problems whatsoever. I have a hard time believing that we've all just been lucky.

 

[SonySlave]

Simply put, on a 1G, you CAN remove all of the emissions vacuum lines AND the solenoids with little consequence. The only issue that could occur is harder warm start-ups due to the fuel pressure solenoid being gone. The EGR is the only CEL that could potentially pop up due to it "not working correctly" according to the ECU. DSMLink or a DSMChip, etc., could help resolve the EGR CEL by disabling that CEL altogether.

2Gs, on the other hand, WILL throw CELs if you remove the solenoids, but the emissions can be removed with no other issues. Same EGR CEL as well. DSMLink, etc., will help with ALL of the CELs in question on 2Gs.

In the 10 years I've been working on these cars, not once have I ever had an issue removing the emissions from any of my cars, stock or highly modified, including removing the EGR and FPS. I feel that this situation was just an unlucky coincidence having the turbo blow.