1. Join the Community!

    DSMtuners is a massive archive of DSM information - but more importantly, it's a COMMUNITY! Join in and participate with other DSMers, and invite all of your DSM friends to make this place their home. Chat with others, create a build thread, post questions and answers. Get involved! Logging in will also remove many of the advertisements, along with this notice. ;)

Resolved Finding previous owner Killswitch?

Posted by Mahreeoh17, Aug 13, 2020

Please Support Feal Suspension
Please Support Feal Suspension
  1. Mahreeoh17

    Mahreeoh17 Probationary Member

    26
    11
    Joined Jul 12, 2020
    Bakersfield, California
    Hey all,

    My first electrical post on the forums so bare with me. I have a 1996 GSX 5spd that I recently purchased, and to avoid any theft the previous owner installed a Killswitch on the car where the headlights need to be turned on to start it. I'd like to remove this but can't find any hint of wiring to start at. Is anyone familiar with these types of modifications?

    I did disconnect the nuetral safety switch today so now I'm able to start it without the clutch in, but still have to turn the lights on.
     

    Street Build 136  1

    1996 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    awd · manual · 2G DSM
    Loading...
  2. Vegas Smith

    Vegas Smith Proven Member

    3,962
    1,767
    Joined Dec 2, 2002
    Houston, Texas
    That’s interesting, I’m guessing the car doesn’t crank? Or does it crank but not start?
     

    Street Build 4K  3

    1993 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · manual · 1G DSM
    Loading...
  3. Mahreeoh17

    Mahreeoh17 Probationary Member

    26
    11
    Joined Jul 12, 2020
    Bakersfield, California
    No crank at all. It will click like the battery is dead, and as soon as the lights are on it fires right up.
     

    Street Build 136  1

    1996 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    awd · manual · 2G DSM
    Loading...
  4. motomattx

    motomattx Proven Member

    3,028
    1,067
    Joined Dec 9, 2010
    wampum, Pennsylvania
    That setup is usually a black box with a flip switch on it to turn it on or off, dealerships used to offer them to customers, they are usually under the hood somewhere, but if not I would guess it would be under the steering column.
     

    Drag Race Build 4K  24

    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    fwd · manual · 2G DSM
    Loading...
    Mahreeoh17 likes this.
  5. ec17pse

    ec17pse Freelancer

    4,819
    1,978
    Joined Nov 1, 2008
    London, UK, Europe
    Have you asked the previous owner as if they did this they are most likely the best person to tell you this and what was done. If not then this is going to be a bit tricky as who knows whats been tapped into what to make this work.

    My guess is and its just a guess, the stock alarm unit / box immobilizer is powered through the headlights and once switched then it allows it to start but i would imagine once turned off the lights it would kill it? Heck i dont know LOL headlight killswitch is a weird thing to do
     

    Road Race Build 11K  10  57

    1997 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    175 whp · 180.1 lb/ft · 2G DSM
    Loading...
    Mahreeoh17 likes this.
  6. Mahreeoh17

    Mahreeoh17 Probationary Member

    26
    11
    Joined Jul 12, 2020
    Bakersfield, California
    Thanks, I don't remember seeing a black box under the hood, I just don't want to have to pull the steering wheel off to get to the steering column.


    No contact with the previous owner as I bought it from the guy who purchased it from him to fix. Not sure if I should trave wires from the headlight stalk and see what sticks out.
     

    Street Build 136  1

    1996 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    awd · manual · 2G DSM
    Loading...
  7. motomattx

    motomattx Proven Member

    3,028
    1,067
    Joined Dec 9, 2010
    wampum, Pennsylvania
    You dont need to pull the steering wheel, just drop the panel under the column which is above the pedals, it might be up in that area.
     

    Drag Race Build 4K  24

    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    fwd · manual · 2G DSM
    Loading...
    Mahreeoh17 likes this.
  8. Mahreeoh17

    Mahreeoh17 Probationary Member

    26
    11
    Joined Jul 12, 2020
    Bakersfield, California
    Okay cool! Thank you. Ill check it in the morning when there's more light and see what I can dig out. I'll post pictures if I find anything unusual.
     

    Street Build 136  1

    1996 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    awd · manual · 2G DSM
    Loading...
  9. luv2rallye

    luv2rallye DSM Wiseman

    7,773
    685
    Joined Jun 7, 2003
    Minneapolis, Minnesota
    There probably is a wire someone added to the stock wiring harness coming out of the steering column (since the light switch is in there). Just follow where it goes.
     

    3K  0

    1999 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    14.200 @ 95.000 · 2G DSM
    Loading...
    Mahreeoh17 likes this.
  10. shinzon

    shinzon Proven Member

    333
    61
    Joined Sep 11, 2006
    St. Petersburg, Florida
    Are you sure this thing has a kill switch? Most kill switches/immobilizers will interrupt signal coming from the key to the starter, which doesn't seem to be the case here as it will attempt to crank, but acts like its not getting enough power. It's a very strange setup where the lights would need to be on before it cranks.

    So if the previous owner hooked it to the headlights, that likely means he added a relay somewhere that is getting its control voltage from the light circuit, and the load side of the relay goes to the starter. If you can't find anything under the dash as others suggested, I would start my search at the headlight relay in the main fuse box and see if someone spliced in another relay in that area. I'd also check the marker light circuits. I'd also have a look at the starter itself with an inspection mirror and see if anything strange is going on with the wiring--aftermarket wiring on the starter instead of the factory harness.
     
    Last edited: Aug 14, 2020

    1K  2

    1996 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · automatic · 2G DSM

    587  1

    1997 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · automatic · 2G DSM
    Loading...
  11. TK's9d2TSi

    TK's9d2TSi Supporting Member

    3,833
    1,421
    Joined Sep 11, 2017
    Cincinnati, Ohio
    They could have used any source that's triggered by the light switch, dimmer, cigarette lighter, radio, ashtray. Look under the center console and fuse box area too if you don't find anything under on the steering column. I'd bet it's in the panel under the steering wheel.
     

    466  3

    2000 Jeep Cherokee Sport - Classic
    awd · automatic · Misc Vehicles

    513  4

    93 Civic 4 Door -sold-
    fwd · manual · Misc Vehicles

    Street Build 3K  6

    1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    12.2 @ 120 · 1G DSM
    Loading...
    Mahreeoh17 likes this.
  12. shinzon

    shinzon Proven Member

    333
    61
    Joined Sep 11, 2006
    St. Petersburg, Florida
    I had my 97 Talon wiring manual handy. Here's the headlight diagram if you need it:
    IMG_20200814_083455.jpg
     

    1K  2

    1996 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · automatic · 2G DSM

    587  1

    1997 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · automatic · 2G DSM
    Loading...
    Mahreeoh17 likes this.
  13. 1990TSIAWDTALON

    1990TSIAWDTALON Moderator

    6,703
    2,933
    Joined Nov 14, 2013
    Independence, Kansas
    I am leaning towards the same thing @shinzon says. I bet the headlights energize a relay that then allows the starter wire to engage. It is probably a simple break in the starter wire so follow the single terminal wire off of the starter backwards and I bet you find a relay that it is hooked to. Take out the relay and hook the starter wire back to itself and all should be fine. Lets see if any of these suggestions are the culprit...... then report back please.
     

    Street Build 5K  29

    1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    14.74 @ 117.04 · 1G DSM

    1K  14

    1990 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    awd · manual · 1G DSM

    838  18

    1967 Chevrolet Camaro RS
    rwd · automatic · Misc Vehicles

    Street Build 1K  7

    1998 Eagle Talon TSi
    fwd · manual · 2G DSM

    Street Build 6K  14  25

    1990 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    13.620 @ 108.460 · 1G DSM
    Loading...
    Mahreeoh17 likes this.
  14. Mahreeoh17

    Mahreeoh17 Probationary Member

    26
    11
    Joined Jul 12, 2020
    Bakersfield, California
    Okay so I believe I have located something that is not from factory. Two wires are running to the under hood fuse box and two more are running down near the starter I believe. But I can't trace them for sure. I can't find another stock photo of a 4g63 that hasn't been modified so does this look familiar to anybody else?
     

    Attached Files:

    Street Build 136  1

    1996 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    awd · manual · 2G DSM
    Loading...
  15. 1990TSIAWDTALON

    1990TSIAWDTALON Moderator

    6,703
    2,933
    Joined Nov 14, 2013
    Independence, Kansas

    Street Build 5K  29

    1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    14.74 @ 117.04 · 1G DSM

    1K  14

    1990 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    awd · manual · 1G DSM

    838  18

    1967 Chevrolet Camaro RS
    rwd · automatic · Misc Vehicles

    Street Build 1K  7

    1998 Eagle Talon TSi
    fwd · manual · 2G DSM

    Street Build 6K  14  25

    1990 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    13.620 @ 108.460 · 1G DSM
    Loading...
    Mahreeoh17 likes this.
  16. Mahreeoh17

    Mahreeoh17 Probationary Member

    26
    11
    Joined Jul 12, 2020
    Bakersfield, California
    Thank you all for the help! I removed the black box and traced the wires and it seems that they are cut into the BY starter motor for the car. I'm going to disconnect the relay and rewire the factory wires now, fingers crossed.

    not sure how old is relay is. But just curious if anyone else has heard of these. I can see how it would be installed from the factory.
     

    Attached Files:

    Street Build 136  1

    1996 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    awd · manual · 2G DSM
    Loading...
  17. Mahreeoh17

    Mahreeoh17 Probationary Member

    26
    11
    Joined Jul 12, 2020
    Bakersfield, California
    Problem was fixed. Thanks again everyone for the input and direction. Much Appreciated!!
     

    Street Build 136  1

    1996 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    awd · manual · 2G DSM
    Loading...
    1990TSIAWDTALON and shinzon like this.
  18. motomattx

    motomattx Proven Member

    3,028
    1,067
    Joined Dec 9, 2010
    wampum, Pennsylvania
    As I said earlier, these were VERY common for dealerships to upsell these on new vehicles on the lot, some you had to hit the horn to start it, some you had to turn on the lights or a turn signal to start it, these were not factory installed, they were a dealer upsell just like undercoating or paint sealer.
     

    Drag Race Build 4K  24

    1995 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    fwd · manual · 2G DSM
    Loading...
    Mahreeoh17 likes this.
  19. luv2rallye

    luv2rallye DSM Wiseman

    7,773
    685
    Joined Jun 7, 2003
    Minneapolis, Minnesota
    Perhaps instead of a kill switch anti-theft thing, this was a previous owners version of forcing a Daytime Running Lights (maybe a law where he was like Canada).
     

    3K  0

    1999 Mitsubishi Eclipse GST
    14.200 @ 95.000 · 2G DSM
    Loading...
  20. Mahreeoh17

    Mahreeoh17 Probationary Member

    26
    11
    Joined Jul 12, 2020
    Bakersfield, California
    It was a California car so I doubt that. It specifically said anti theft on the relay box.
     

    Street Build 136  1

    1996 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    awd · manual · 2G DSM
    Loading...
  21. techboj

    techboj Probationary Member

    3
    0
    Joined Jun 28, 2007
    surrey, BC, Canada
    If you do not see any third party box, the previous owner may have done a simple cut-off using a single relay. Basing on your description, the behaviour of the starting circuit will just make the relay "click" but not engage the starter when the headlights are not powered. In the first illustration below, substitute the 12V from the headlight instead of the brake light positive and you get the same effect.



    Clipboard01.jpg

    Another way that this can be accomplished would be to use two relays (like below). For this diagram, the cigarette lighter was used. The lighter needs to be pushed in and the headlights need to be turned on in order to start the car. Simply omit the lighter and you basically get the same effect as the single relay design above. This second one is a much safer implementation.

    Look for a third party bosch style relay. This can either be a 4 pin or a 5 pin. It will look very much the same (and is actually identical) to the 2-3 relays on the firewall near the brake master/clutch fluid. I would guess that the previous owner installed this in the engine bay (as opposed to inside the cockpit) esp if he did it himself.

    Clipboard03.jpg
     

Share This Page

Support Vendors who Support the DSM Community
Boosted Fabrication ECM Tuning ExtremePSI Feal Suspension Fuel Injector Clinic Jacks Transmissions JNZ Tuning Kiggly Racing Morrison Fabrications OHM Racing Raven Fabrication RixRacing RockAuto RTM Racing SouthBay Fuel Injectors STM Tuned Track Decals Track Sculptures VR Speed Factory