dyno numbers

[Eagle 5]

Originally posted by BakerGSX


Ok I can see 350-400, but you are going to need a MONSTER turbo. The true efficiency range of most larger turbos is over 20psi. Hahn didn't even see close to 400hp until they crossed over 25psi. Good luck and I hope you see your goal.

well its a 57 trim t3/t4 with a .63 a/r exhaust housing and .60 a/r compressor housing (or maybe other way around i forget at moment but i wrote it down) so its big. with a tial 38mm external gate. probably goign to get a tuff spring to help spool the turbo quicker. but yeah 350-400 whp or around 400-450 crank hp is my goal for the street i should say rather than 20 psi. im just assuming 20 psi should be close tro that point.. with the other mods i have at least

 

[Turbo 420a]

Originally posted by BakerGSX


Ok I can see 350-400, but you are going to need a MONSTER turbo. The true efficiency range of most larger turbos is over 20psi. Hahn didn't even see close to 400hp until they crossed over 25psi. Good luck and I hope you see your goal.

I'm just curious BakerGSX if you knew if Hahn was using the standard Super 16g when they crossed over 25psi to get 400hp+? If so then remember the t3/t4 flows quite a bit more than a Super 16g. However, if Hahn was using a 20g horsepower estimates would be a lot more similar when compared to a t3/t4. Was this on their 11 second 420a?

Ahhh, 11 seconds... I can't wait

 

[BakerGSX]

It was the 20G. It's wierd because on one part of the site it says that he ran 500hp with the 20G but on other part of the site it says that the 500hp was achieved with 100 shot of nitrous. That he actually hits about 405 to the wheels in the DSM with a 20G. Who knows though, honestly unless you bolt on a big turbo like an FP3055 (built bottom end of course) getting getting over 350 @ under 20 psi is hard. Most the guys that I see running 20Gs or smaller T3/T4s are running them close to 30psi to get 400hp or better. It's hard work to get 350hp @ 20psi but I'm sure it can be done. As far as 11s go just remember that Bill Hahn did that with slicks and SERIOUS weight reduction. The term "Daily Driver" has been used rather loosly. That is like saying that John Shephard has a street car.

 

[siueclipse]

hey baker, why don't you go #### yourself and get off my coat tails eh?

car hasn't been tuned, the dyno i went to doesn't have a wideband, but i get free dyno time so i go there, so right now all i have is my digital a/f and my egt to go by. they are getting a wideband in the future.

what the #### is up your ass about me? maybe its the fact that youre just a shithead for no reason. go get laid or something...

 

[BakerGSX]

Originally posted by siueclipse
hey baker, why don't you go #### yourself and get off my coat tails eh?

car hasn't been tuned, the dyno i went to doesn't have a wideband, but i get free dyno time so i go there, so right now all i have is my digital a/f and my egt to go by. they are getting a wideband in the future.

what the #### is up your ass about me? maybe its the fact that youre just a shithead for no reason. go get laid or something...

Actually we were not talking about you, but rather I was talking with Eagle 5. You have had almost a year to tune your car and fighting with you about it has become old news. Remember, the world does not revolve around you. BTW thank you for the cheap shots siueclipse, you never let me down with your tantrums. I could set my watch to them

Eagle 5 You should also think about a BB setup if you really want to try and get the most out of low psi. It might cost more but FP pulled 365 at 14psi. I don't know if that was just a built motor or a stroked built motor but it's still amazing.

 

[Eagle 5]

yeah BB would definitely help. my car will be able tor ev past 7000 rpms easily though so even if the turbo is not fooly (fooly?) fully spooled until a little later I can still take advantage of it. the head is being built up so it can handle it. i know cams would be awesome but not sure if i have the oeny for it at the moment and cams can be put in later easier than some other things.

my goal is to hit 400whp, mainly on pump gas, ill be runnign aorund 18-20 psi so hopefully i can get it tuned good enough to handle it and work well. thats my goal though is 400 whp. i may though just stick with the smaller 30# injectors for now and ru aorund 12 pr 13 psi and jus ttune it there. then save up some money to get the cams, then get bigger injectors and tune for more psi rather than goign for 20 now and then retuning after cams go in, although not sure if u would need to but im sure you do. i should know by the end of the month what all im getting iand what ill be using to tune it. still trying to figure out what I want to use to tune the car... and i still need to decide on comp ratio. thinking anywhere from 8.8:1 at minimum to 9.5:1 (doubt i will but man, lots of torque is fun) most likely though 8.8:1 or 9:1

 

[siueclipse]

a year to tune my car? damn your ignorant.. i just put in a fresh motor 2 months ago retard.

go take a long walk off a short bridge

 

[Turbo 420a]

Originally posted by BakerGSX
That is like saying that John Shephard has a street car.

John Shepherd car is a street car. Sure it isn't loaded up like a BMW on the inside or anything but he drives it on the roads on occasions.

 

[RSTsoon]

damn who ever reopened this thread, damn them to hell!

 

[BakerGSX]

Originally posted by siueclipse
a year to tune my car? damn your ignorant.. i just put in a fresh motor 2 months ago retard.

go take a long walk off a short bridge

OK, but you went from a stock bottom end with a 16G to a built bottom end with a 20G and the best you could do is add 46hp and dropped 2 tenths off your 1/8 mile? Also you tune your car based on your autometer A/F guage and EGT guage? Did I miss something here? I don't need to resort to name calling or insults to make you look foolish. Your dyno sheets and your posts do that for me

Like I said this debate over your tuning skills and your OLD dyno sheets is old news and nobody wants to argue with you any more about it.

 

[BakerGSX]

Originally posted by Turbo 420a


John Shepherd car is a street car. Sure it isn't loaded up like a BMW on the inside or anything but he drives it on the roads on occasions.

Right I'll agree with you about that but you have seen the pics of the car when he runs 9s with it right? Most of the interior is gone, even the glove box. Most of the anemitys that people enjoy with a street car are gone. Yes, for all intensive purposes the car IS a street car, but really it is pushing the limit as to what "street" is. I would have to say that Paul Efantis and Mark Mazurowski take it even farther than John does though. At least John uses the 4G63 tranny, Mark and Pual both have 2 speed powerglides if I'm not mistaken and still compete in the Street class.

 

[BakerGSX]

Originally posted by RSTsoon
damn who ever reopened this thread, damn them to hell!

Amen to that, I thought this was over with. I could not believe when I checked my email that this got re-opened. I think if Eagle 5 knew the can of worms he opened he would have steered clear of the thread.

 

[Turbo 420a]

Originally posted by BakerGSX


Right I'll agree with you about that but you have seen the pics of the car when he runs 9s with it right? Most of the interior is gone, even the glove box. Most of the anemitys that people enjoy with a street car are gone. Yes, for all intensive purposes the car IS a street car, but really it is pushing the limit as to what "street" is. I would have to say that Paul Efantis and Mark Mazurowski take it even farther than John does though. At least John uses the 4G63 tranny, Mark and Pual both have 2 speed powerglides if I'm not mistaken and still compete in the Street class.

I can agree with that one. John's Talon probably isn't the most ideal car to take on a road trip around the country with some friends in it. The trip would only take a day in that car

Officer: "Sir you were going over 200mph in the carpool lane"
Shep: "my bad"

 

[siueclipse]

Originally posted by BakerGSX


OK, but you went from a stock bottom end with a 16G to a built bottom end with a 20G and the best you could do is add 46hp and dropped 2 tenths off your 1/8 mile? Also you tune your car based on your autometer A/F guage and EGT guage? Did I miss something here? I don't need to resort to name calling or insults to make you look foolish. Your dyno sheets and your posts do that for me

Like I said this debate over your tuning skills and your OLD dyno sheets is old news and nobody wants to argue with you any more about it.

Well, yeah. i picked up 47hp by rebuilding the motor and throwing on a 20g turbo.. keep in mind i was still running 10lbs of boost. Well this entire point of yours is mute because im up to 314hp on 14-15lbs of boost.

 

[BakerGSX]

Originally posted by siueclipse


Well, yeah. i picked up 47hp by rebuilding the motor and throwing on a 20g turbo.. keep in mind i was still running 10lbs of boost. Well this entire point of yours is mute because im up to 314hp on 14-15lbs of boost.

Well gratz on the hp gain, but my point was not "mute" as you put it. My point was that noone was even talking to you when you decided to start fighting again. Even such for the setup you are running you are still way below par for what you have. You seem to be on the right track, but for someone who has access to a sponsor, free shop time, and free dyno time you should be around 400hp or 500hp if you go by what Bill Hahn says. So when are you going to post your dyno sheet?

BTW It's "moot" not "mute"
moot:

adj.
Subject to debate; arguable: a moot question.

Law. Without legal significance, through having been previously decided or settled.
Of no practical importance; irrelevant.

 

[BakerGSX]

PS this is what you told us at the beginning of this thread.

The highest horsepower was 264 at 13psi of boost. This power curve was a little rocky, i need larger injectors before going above 12psi of boost.

So which was it 10 psi or 13 psi? And how much did you run this time? 15psi, 14-15psi or 20 psi? Your story keeps changing. I know this is me being a jerk but I just want to get the story straight.

 

[Kirby]

Eagle, don't touch the head unless you are doing cams or porting and polishing. There is no nead to upgrade your lifters, etc. to handle the power. They will handle it just fine stock. Spend the money on cams oversize valves, and VERY LIGHT porting and polishing. DO NOT WASTE MONEY UPGRADING PARTS THAT YOU DON'T HAVE TO.

 

[siueclipse]

baker, im done talking to you...

 

[BakerGSX]

Originally posted by siueclipse
baker, im done talking to you...

Good because we were not talking to you in the first place I was talking to Eagle 5.

 

[Eagle 5]

Originally posted by Kirby
Eagle, don't touch the head unless you are doing cams or porting and polishing. There is no nead to upgrade your lifters, etc. to handle the power. They will handle it just fine stock. Spend the money on cams oversize valves, and VERY LIGHT porting and polishing. DO NOT WASTE MONEY UPGRADING PARTS THAT YOU DON'T HAVE TO.

SO should I get stainless 1mm oversized valves, crower stage 2 (3 maybe) cams, and some port work done instead? and not get crower titanium retainers/ springs and not get the PT cruise lifters/ rockers?


guess that would be better since rockers and lifter or what not would be easier to have installed once head is already on, rather than having to take head off and port it and such.

so go with cams, stainless oversized valves, and port work?

How high can the stock engine rev safely? like not worrying about floating valves and such? I have heard people saying that the stock valve train cna handle reving to 8200-8500 rpms. if they can handle that then I still would probably not go about 8000. i can always get the lfiters, rockers, crower springs retainers later.

 

[onelowtalon]

ive been following this thread for awhile now and it has become very clear to me that 4g63r's are assholes. would it be possible to close this forum to anyone that has one?????

 

[DSMNightmare]

Originally posted by onelowtalon
ive been following this thread for awhile now and it has become very clear to me that 4g63r's are assholes. would it be possible to close this forum to anyone that has one?????

Why would you say that? This is an open debate forum. I never once said that turbo 420a's are junk. Heck, one of my best friends had a turbo 420a. Why don't you jump in the middle of someone elses thread and try and be a hero.

 

[siueclipse]

Read the thread with an unbiased attitude Mike and you might see otherwise...

 

[BakerGSX]

Yeah, Mike you might want to think twice before jumpin on this boat . Juan still wants to know if you can get him that turbo or do you plan to keep it?

Read the thread with an unbiased attitude Mike and you might see otherwise...

Really if there was any debate here it was over the fact that your original dyno numbers with the 20G sucked for all the money you have dumped into your car, the fact that you have a sponsor, and you get free dyno time. It had nothing to do with the engine you had. If you would have laid those numbers with a 4G63 or even a Honda B18 they would have still sucked with the setup you have. Now you have laid some dyno numbers that are a lot better than your intial numbers but could still stand to be improved. That's part of the tuning process and noone said you were done tuning your car.

Now that your laying down a lot more horsepower you should consider running it in the quarter mile. All that power will do you no good if you can't put it to the ground.

I'm not an asshole but rather a skeptic. I would say that an asshole would be someone who watches a thread from afar and waits untill the right moment to take a cheap ass shot to start a fight. Isn't that right onelowtalon?

 

[siueclipse]

My car technically was not sponsored.. They only did work on my car during off business hours.. It was more because I was friends with everyone and not business associates. Furthermore, I helped do all of it while doing much of it myself.

You really need to stop thinking that you know everything without knowing all the facts.

You can dog my 300hp all you want.. point being is that there aren't many 420a's with 300hp to the ground. Im probably in the top 3 to 5 people on this board with this much hp on a 420a.

You need to sit back for a minute and realize the acomplishment rather than belittling it.