Cam test: I will be dyno test: delta hks 272, delta K272 and BC 272 cams!!!!

[Killa_dsm]

is the last test the delta hks 272 grinds?

The last test was the delta Kelford 272's. Not the delta hks 272 regrinds.

 

[firebirdvert305]

Great results. Really makes me want to try out a set of those kelford 280's vs my BC 288's.

 

[talondave]

Great results. Really makes me want to try out a set of those kelford 280's vs my BC 288's.

How do you like the 288s? I have a set but the motor isn't together yet, and wont find out how they are for another month or so. I'm wondering if I made a mistake getting them or not!

 

[firebirdvert305]

How do you like the 288s? I have a set but the motor isn't together yet, and wont find out how they are for another month or so. I'm wondering if I made a mistake getting them or not!

There good they have huge lift numbers but the duration @ .050 isnt really there, for a good meaty powerband. To take real good advantage of them you'd need a big enough turbo id say to flow upwards to 600+hp. They pull hard all the way to redline now, but ive always got that itch to try something new. Its like that girl next door...

 

[e85_4g63]

The last test was the delta Kelford 272's. Not the delta hks 272 regrinds.

What are the lift, dur @ .050, etc on these (the new billets, as I recall reading there are not regrinds)...

 

[keltalon]

Thanks for the fast reply on the test. I noticed you only reved the motor to 7k according to the dsm link graph. Not that it would have mattered. What kind of vacume are you seeing with the kelfords??

Well something is going on right at 7000rpm and I think we have figured it out We think that its not the stock manifold that is taking a hit around 6500 rpm but the walbro 255 can't push enough e85s to match the air that is required in the upper rpm range! We turned the boost up to 33psi and the Delta K272's was about to get insane with the horsepower numbers but the fuel pressure dropped and the car went way lean on two pulls! I think the cams would have put down somewhere near 560hp if she could have gotten the fuel she needed. So guys my fuel set up is maxed and is in need of a serious upgrade!

Take a look at these dyno sheets and you can see the potential of these cams!
Also take a look at the log at the bottom of the page!

 

[TSIMonsteR]

thats some awesome results on the kelfords. Any idea what the price is on them?

 

[99gst_racer]

keltalon - Could you answer a question for me about the Delta Kelford 272 copys? Is there a threaded hole on the end of the intake cam where the CAS goes? Or is it just a keyway?

I'm just wondering it they are designing these to fit both the 1G and 2G CAS' or if they are only being made for the 1G CAS like Kelford is doing.

 

[dsm-onster]

NOT BAD! you do see that the kelfords move the power band higher. Not a problem at all. But something I'd expect for typical 288 uration cams. VERY nice to see the delta grinds mimic what one would expect from real Kelford 272s. If I go with a SMIM, I certainly would be looking at these as an afforddable alternative.

THANX for the test! I know the community really appreciates this!

 

[Delta Cam]

Good morning all, Mr Kelton was nice enough to test these camshafts to do a "real" comparison vs. just specs.
There has been some speculation that the Delta K272 grind is a Kelford product, which it is not.
We are both camshaft companies but Delta is not affiliated with Kelford at this time.

please refer to Delta high lift 272 grinds as Delta K272's, NOT Kelford 272's

 

[99gst_racer]

Is your K272 a direct copy of Kelford's 272 grind, or is yours just similar?

 

[keltalon]

keltalon - Could you answer a question for me about the Delta Kelford 272 copys? Is there a threaded hole on the end of the intake cam where the CAS goes? Or is it just a keyway?

I'm just wondering it they are designing these to fit both the 1G and 2G CAS' or if they are only being made for the 1G CAS like Kelford is doing.

They are both threaded and there's a keyway.

 

[johnboy1065]

Well something is going on right at 7000rpm and I think we have figured it out We think that its not the stock manifold that is taking a hit around 6500 rpm but the walbro 255 can't push enough e85s to match the air that is required in the upper rpm range! We turned the boost up to 33psi and the delta kelford grind was about to get insane with the horsepower numbers but the fuel pressure dropped and the car went way lean on two pulls! I think the cams would have put down somewhere near 560hp if she could have gotten the fuel she needed. So guys my fuel set up is maxed and is in need of a serious upgrade!

Take a look at these dyno sheets and you can see the potential of these cams!
Also take a look at the log at the bottom of the page!

awesome results on the Delta K272's.

Might just buy a set of those

 

[99gst_racer]

They are both threaded and there's a keyway.

'Both threaded' as in the intake and exhaust cam?

Thanks for the info, btw.
I had to drill and tap my Kelford intake cam to run it in my 2G head.

 

[FLASH1970]

Any way to edit the first post and put all the info like dyno sheets, power numbers, the amount the cam gears are degreed? Put it all in one spot. Thanks for doing this comparison too!

 

[TSIMonsteR]

I emailed Delta for some prices.

The Delta K272s are made from a new billet core and run $350 per set.

DeltaKS Grinds are $125 per stick (+$30 core charge)

 

[keltalon]

Any way to edit the first post and put all the info like dyno sheets, power numbers, the amount the cam gears are degreed? Put it all in one spot. Thanks for doing this comparison too!

What exactly you would like to see? Let me know because I like to put whatever information so that all can benefit from the testing of these cams

Well something is going on right at 7000rpm and I think we have figured it out We think that its not the stock manifold that is taking a hit around 6500 rpm but the walbro 255 can't push enough e85s to match the air that is required in the upper rpm range! We turned the boost up to 33psi and the Delta K272's was about to get insane with the horsepower numbers but the fuel pressure dropped and the car went way lean on two pulls! I think the cams would have put down somewhere near 560hp if she could have gotten the fuel she needed. So guys my fuel set up is maxed and is in need of a serious upgrade!

Take a look at these dyno sheets and you can see the potential of these cams!
Also take a look at the log at the bottom of the page!

Hey fellas testing is going to be put on hold so that I can address the fuel issue at hand. Really don't won't hurt my car. I will be looking into some type of fuel upgrade perhaps the bigger bocsh or maybe a dual walbro set up I am very anxious to test the bc 280s to see just how they stack up to the delta k272s. Just have to wait and see. If you have any suggestions on fuel upgrade I am open! Also if you have any qeustions on what I have done so far please do ask and I will see if I can help.

 

[Killa_dsm]

What exactly you would like to see? Let me know because I like to put whatever information so that all can benefit from the testing of these cams



Hey fellas testing is going to be put on hold so that I can address the fuel issue at hand. Really don't won't hurt my car. I will be looking into some type of fuel upgrade perhaps the bigger bocsh or maybe a dual walbro set up If you have any questions on what I have done so far please do ask and I will see if I can help.

I will say it again, thank you for doing these tests. It might be easier for people to follow if you start a blog with all the graphs and results in it. Just a idea.

 

[FLASH1970]

I will say it again, thank you for doing these tests. It might be easier for people to follow if you start a blog with all the graphs and results in it. Just a idea.

Good idea. That would help get all the info in one place.

 

[keltalon]

I will say it again, thank you for doing these tests. It might be easier for people to follow if you start a blog with all the graphs and results in it. Just a idea.

No problem! Haven't thought about it but very good suggetion. When I get done with fixing the fuel issue and the cam testing I will summarize everything in one blog

Hey fellas spoke with JMF Fabrications to see if we can maybe throw a intake into the test, while I am upgrading my fuel system I thought maybe, what the heck upgrade the manifold while you are at it, and they may take me up on the offer. I told them that if the manifold yeild results that I am safisfied with then I will purchased it! Waiting on response to see if they will jump in for the benefit of members in their choice of upgrades! I would love to compare the magnus to the jmf and settle that issue as well. To let everbody know the time involve in swapping these part and money for 1hr dyno time is very costly but I don't mind because There's nothing like knowing the answer to what cam or intake manifold is the best

Also spoke to manus about the intake test and they too may jump in. Let see. They are a little cautious about it and I understand them with all the internet bias advertising! we shall see what happens. I think after all this testing is done I will would ever do this again but I must say for the time being its fun and It twill answer a lot of questions that we have all wondered Which is better for my setup!

 

[TSimage]

Great results. Really makes me want to try out a set of those kelford 280's vs my BC 288's.

Why would you do that when the Kelford 272s are just as big as your 288s but with better low range included. 280s are a whole new ball game.

 

[firebirdvert305]

Why would you do that when the Kelford 272s are just as big as your 288s but with better low range included. 280s are a whole new ball game.

The Kelford 272's are nowhere the "same". The lift the BC288's have over the kelfords 272 isnt even compareable. The duration however is.

BC 288/288 Lift specs - .468"/.478" 11.88mm/12.14mm

Kelford 272 lift specs - 11.00mm/11.00mm

Cant find the actual lift measurements for the kelfords but I know for a fact there not bigger then the BC288's.

BC 288/288 duration specs - 222°/220° @ .050 duration.

Kelford 272 duration specs - 226°/226° @ 1mm valve lift. (which I believe is equal too .050 duration).

 

[dsm-onster]

Kelford 272s also have more ramp rate. So all the bc 288s offer over the kelford 272s is more peak lift. There's way more to a cam than peak lift. And higher peak lift doesn't neccesarily net more flow. Look here how the flow begins to plain off at .4" lift and even the smaller exhauast already starts to dive in cfm: click. You need oversized valves to even take advantage of any lift over kelford lift specs.

Even kelford 280s have lower peak lift. Most opt for a cam upgrade to net a higher power band. And the kelford 272s would give you quite a bit more topend since they have 226/226 duration vs. 222/220. And the great ramp rate will save some of the low end. While the kelford 280s would be just nuts and yes in a whole different ball game than the bc288s. You want to go from 222/220 duration to 238/230 duration ? That's a bigger jump than going from stock to hks272s!

 

[firebirdvert305]

Kelford 272s also have more ramp rate. So all the bc 288s offer over the kelford 272s is more peak lift. There's way more to a cam than peak lift. And higher peak lift doesn't neccesarily net more flow. Look here how the flow begins to plain off at .4" lift and even the smaller exhauast already starts to dive in cfm: click. You need oversized valves to even take advantage of any lift over kelford lift specs.

Even kelford 280s have lower peak lift. Most opt for a cam upgrade to net a higher power band. And the kelford 272s would give you quite a bit more topend since they have 226/226 duration vs. 222/220. And the great ramp rate will save some of the low end. While the kelford 280s would be just nuts and yes in a whole different ball game than the bc288s. You want to go from 222/220 duration to 238/230 duration ? That's a bigger jump than going from stock to hks272s!

The car right now is lacking some low end grunt but the top-end power is there. Im really considering these kelford 280s now after doing some more research. Matt let me ask you something, actual "cam-thump" at idle is more directly related to what? More Duration, lift, centerline? Reason im asking is my older DKS272's actually "cam" alot harder then my BC288's, kind of odd but true.

 

[dsm-onster]

Matt let me ask you something, actual "cam-thump" at idle is more directly related to what? More Duration, lift, centerline? Reason im asking is my older DKS272's actually "cam" alot harder then my BC288's, kind of odd but true.

Acutal cam thump is more related to your own emotion in the mix... Bottem line is that a high duration cam may or may not have lots of lope and lope can't do but so much. Lope DOES net more HIT at idle if the timing is right. But cam timing of the components still only nets so much out of a certain duration. You need to match your duration to the rpm of choice given the stroke and then match the timing to net the best powerband for your setup given the intents and duration.