2G 2.0 Long rod, & +625 worth the $?

[Archer Fabrications]

I would be very careful chosing these manly I beam rods. The are very hard on the bearing which no amount/kind of oil can protect. Buschur did a tear down on one of their customer who had 16g on their short block. The motor only had 10k miles in it. I don't think he admit it but you can see some wear in cylinder 4 and 3 rod bearings. It probably will be fine with less horsepower and low rpm but if you are going to be shooting for 800hp, I'm not sure if it will be a great choice. Manly does, I believe, makes HD h-beam rods which weight less which can be a great alternative to use. If not there are other lighter I beam rods you can get from other manufacture. Another great thing about lighter rods is that you can rev much faster.

They actually recommend i beams for over 9k rpm and h for under 8k

 

[bastarddsm]

Hitting something with 30psi at 3000 and lots of timing can be way harder on bearings that 800hp at 9000.

 

[Archer Fabrications]

Hitting something with 30psi at 3000 and lots of timing can be way harder on bearings that 800hp at 9000.

Not to mention absolutely destroys transmissions. The good thing about a late spooling turbo is the engine already has a good amount of inirtia when the tq hits

 

[miliman13]

I think you've got a missing decimal place in the PTW clearance recommendation. I just put a motor together at .0055" PTW and that was fairly loose IMO...

Yes you are correct!! Good catch, in sure others just assumed the same.

Add a zero for ptw clearance on my statement.

 

[90laserRSfwd]

So... have you made the decision to pull the trigger on the pistons / rods you posted? Seems like a good combo! I assume you don't plan on much pump gas use with 9.5 - 10:1 compression..

 

[Archer Fabrications]

So... have you made the decision to pull the trigger on the pistons / rods you posted? Seems like a good combo! I assume you don't plan on much pump gas use with 9.5 - 10:1 compression..

I am going to pull the trigger soon, I'll be using the 7bolt wiseco 1400HD e85 pistons .020 10:1 on the 150mm turbo tuffs with 625+ with aluglide bearings used trimetals last time but heard BR did some testing and found some extreme wear after first pull on a new motor

 

[90laserRSfwd]

AMS also recommend alumaglide bearings to me. I will comment that no matter what your machinest says, make them show you the main cap measurements before taking the block home (if your assembling your own shortblock). Shabby machine work, I feel, is one of the reason many "built" motors fail.

 

[Archer Fabrications]

AMS also recommend alumaglide bearings to me. I will comment that no matter what your machinest says, make them show you the main cap measurements before taking the block home (if your assembling your own shortblock). Shabby machine work, I feel, is one of the reason many "built" motors fail.

I completely agree, i think I'll be taking the block to UMS tuning they have a crazy time attack evo and i did some work for them, they have someone they trust for their machine work and seem to be the go to 4g63 shop around phoenix


If anyone is curious, heres what the tri metals looked like after running dry for 10 minutes crusing down the highway looking for an exit. I guess they did their job cause my crank and old rods were still good. Had some bearing material in the oil that was flushed out before tear down. 1234 and the main thrust, all ACL trimetal race bearings, and their corisponding journals.

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Head was killed too, cap cap

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[90laserRSfwd]

All machine shops usually use AERA spec's. Which is the industry standard as far as machinists spec's are concerned. The issue I feel is making sure they ACTUALLY do the work correctly, and have the tools to measure down to 10 thousandths (that's .0001").

 

[bastarddsm]

Lol, I ran 10's on a stock block that looked way worse than your bearings.

 

[donniekak]

I would use race bearings. Regular king or acl bearings start to come apart at higher power levels. I've pulled apart a lot of engines, and the high powered ones on regular bearings usually have a spot on them corresponding to around 15-20* atdc where the overlay starts to fail.

 

[donniekak]

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[donniekak]

I've probably seen 15-20 sets of upper rod bearings that look like this.

I showed them to a guy who worked for a top fuel team and he said their bearings do the exact same thing.

None of the engines I've tore down with race bearings had rod bearings that looked like this.

 

[Archer Fabrications]

I've probably seen 15-20 sets of upper rod bearings that look like this.

I showed them to a guy who worked for a top fuel team and he said their bearings do the exact same thing.

None of the engines I've tore down with race bearings had rod bearings that looked like this.

Well i never had any problems with the race bearings. Maybe I'll stick with them, thanks for that

 

[Kapok6]

Hey it's been a while since ive posted in the engine tech fourm but I'm just getting around to buying parts for my new build and the first thing I'm buying is new rods, ive chosen to get the manley turbo tuff 156mm I beam rods with the 22mm wrist pin for the 6bolt and there is an option for the ARP 625+ rod bolt upgrade for $200.

My goal for this build is to bulletproof the motor for 1,000whp but I'm only shooting for 850whp on the 6466 woth E85. And a max rev of 9500-10,000 thus, the long rod. The car is a weekend warrior/drag car. I want it to be "safe" for the revs is it worth the extra 200$ for the bolts? Ive never had issues up to 40psi on my 6466 with arp 2000's on my scat rods. And 8500rpm

Also any recommendation on piston choice now days? Kinda been looking at the ross stroker 9:1 as my #1 choice, considering wiseco hd2 or 1400 as my second choice, and manley as my 3rd (cause how could manley piston on manley rod be bad) I'm open to input on Compression ratio, ive always been 9:1 for the tuning margin, buy considering 10 or 11:1. Lets hear it.

I just had Curt Brown build me a block and a head. I went 10.5:1 per his recommendation. He personally had made 650whp on an 11:1 motor he built on 93oct. No meth, and no knock. He told also told me that once the motor is broken in, it will be good to 10,000rpm. This is with 22mm Manley turbo tuff's, and wiseco HD pistons/pins. Standard length, not long rod. ARP 2000 bolts.

You will hear different things on comp ratios. Kiggly didn't see any advantages over 9:1. Curt likes 10-11:1.

With that being said, I only have 250ish miles on this break in at 13psi on a DSM76HTA, and the throttle response is better than it was on my lower compression motor, and I see positive pressure about 500rpm sooner than I did on my lower comp motor. Timing even with e85 seems to be the limiting factor thus far. It doesn't like anywhere near the same timing that my lower comp motors have.

 

[Tiki2777]

If anyone is curious, heres what the tri metals looked like after running dry for 10 minutes crusing down the highway looking for an exit. I guess they did their job cause my crank and old rods were still good. Had some bearing material in the oil that was flushed out before tear down. 1234 and the main thrust, all ACL trimetal race bearings, and their corisponding journals.

Dude That's awesome! Makes me sleep better that I chose ACL tri metal race bearings for my 6 bolt also. I'd stick with something similar for sure

 

[Archer Fabrications]

Dude That's awesome! Makes me sleep better that I chose ACL tri metal race bearings for my 6 bolt also. I'd stick with something similar for sure

Well technically the bearing material is the reason for the rebuild cause it needed cleaning which sucks, but it saved the parts themselves

 

[Archer Fabrications]

Alright pulled the trigger on these. guess I'm stayin 150mm rod! Got a good deal from @OstarMotorsport

[ATTACH=full]308127[/ATTACH]

 

[OstarMotorsport]

Kyle,

Thank you for the business! Best of luck on the engine build. Hopefully we'll get to see you at the shootout.

 

[awdmonster1904]

Any update on this engine build how did it go?

 

[Archer Fabrications]

Still havnt assembled it but went with standard 150mm rods and did end up goingnwith the 625+ bolts on the turbo tuff's

 

[Zay Gomez]

Still havnt assembled it but went with standard 150mm rods and did end up goingnwith the 625+ bolts on the turbo tuff's

How did the engine go for you ? Looking to build my engine and I wanted to know how the tt rods held up

 

[Archer Fabrications]

How did the engine go for you ? Looking to build my engine and I wanted to know how the tt rods held up

They are great rods I think for higher RPM and piece of mind the 625+ bolts are worth it, but unfortunately I never got the motor finished, I parted out the car and sold the shell. I will however be usinf these same rods (7bolt this time) for my evo 9 in the future

 

[Zay Gomez]

They are great rods I think for higher RPM and piece of mind the 625+ bolts are worth it, but unfortunately I never got the motor finished, I parted out the car and sold the shell. I will however be usinf these same rods (7bolt this time) for my evo 9 in the future

Awesome thank you! I spun my 4th pistons bearing so I’m looking at either rebuilding it using a 10:1 compression or buying a built engine so let’s see how it goes