2G Wilwood Clutch Master Cylinder?

[Blurred Talon]

Anyone look into swapping the OEM clutch master for a Wilwood unit?
http://www.wilwood.com/MasterCylind...up=Integral Reservoir Compact Master Cylinder
It's 1.4" stroke so it should work perfect for the clutch, the only question is what bore size.

 

[jamarh85]

I believe bastarddsm runs one. If not the exact a unit similar to it.

 

[bastarddsm]

Who Me?

 

[smills1840]

I'm interested in this as well.

 

[jamarh85]

Who Me?

Yeah, mistaken? Thought I stumbled across something similar in your post in the freelancer section.

 

[bastarddsm]

haha yes I do. It's not a bolt in. I basically machine the flange off the wilwood, and cnc a new one that mounts to the dsm bolt pattern. I haven't done one for a 2g nor do I have a 2g to prototype this for. I can make one for you, but no guarantees on its performance.

It works awesome in my car. Flatshifting an act2900 with a street disc at 9000+ rpm. The pedal is stiff, but it has a much better feel than it ever did with stock parts.

PM me if you are interested.

 

[94awdcoupe]

cant imagine why you would do this unless you just needed less pedal travel and used the .70 one. All the mitsu masters are 5/8. I would need a technical reason why the wilwood 5/8 master would work better than the mitsu made one. clutch master cylinder are incredibly simple devices.

now if you REALLY want to improve clutch performance from an ACT 2600 you can get rid of the silly factory throw out arm and use a hydro throw out bearing acting directly on the clutch. I did this last year after four years research and the results are stupid good.
eliminating friction points and arm flexing allows the PP to open and close faster. there is also about 20-25% reduction in pedal effort.

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[2gmitsueclipse]

cant imagine why you would do this unless you just needed less pedal travel and used the .70 one. All the mitsu masters are 5/8. I would need a technical reason why the wilwood 5/8 master would work better than the mitsu made one. clutch master cylinder are incredibly simple devices.

now if you REALLY want to improve clutch performance from an ACT 2600 you can get rid of the silly factory throw out arm and use a hydro throw out bearing acting directly on the clutch. I did this last year after four years research and the results are stupid good.
eliminating friction points and arm flexing allows the PP to open and close faster. there is also about 20-25% reduction in pedal effort.

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I would be interested in learning more about this......

 

[bastarddsm]

Most clutches require a lot more TOB travel than stock to fully release the clutch, which is why I went down the road I went. I also modified my pedal for much longer pedal travel.

The wilwood master has 1.4" of travel, the stock mitsu one for a 1g is right at 1". You can couple this with larger 2g or isuzu slave and drastically reduce the pedal pressure, and open up the engagement window to make it easier to drive on an agressive clutch.

In my case the 2900 I was running would not disengage if I went over 8500. It wouldn't even come out of gear when I went to shift. It needed at least 2 times the tob travel as stock. With my modifications I was able to achieve this, and keep the pedal pressure close to what it was on stock hydraulics.

Plus with what I did you can run several different size of slaves, and master cylinders. You can optimize the release system to any clutch.

Your pretty well at the mercy of the hyd tob you found. I'd like to know how you got a 25% reduction in pedal effort, or even measured that.

 

[94awdcoupe]

I cant comment on changes you made because you left out the two most important details. what size slave you are on and what size master you used. and whether this is 1g or 2g. but I assure you what I did is worlds apart and far better. the TOB is a factory part from a saab. its stupid robust by design.

as far as peddle pressure is concerned if you put a scale on the pedal and read the scale as you pushed on the scale you would have pedal pressure.

stock is around 16lbs.
act 2600 in a 1g would be as high as 36lbs .1g has to use 7/8 slave because of flexing of torque arm on pedal assembly. any flexing in the system causes higher pedal pressure.
act 2600 in a 2g/evo1 would be around 25-30lbs depending on slave (13/16 or 7/8)
my setup is around 20lbs. but can be adjusted higher or low depending on what kind shift speed you are after. with no adjustments to pedal ratio the pedal travel is reduced from 5.5 inches stock travel to 4 inches. this makes the pedal pressure about like a stock 2600 at 25lbs. is really nice to drive car fast as pedal travel is so short. fabulous for a drag car. the draw back is its more difficult to daily drive. the clutch action is very quick. pretty similar to driving a 6 puck or smooth twin which I never enjoyed. reducing leverage ratio at the pedal on the first try I got 6" of pedal travel. it was butter smooth to drive and pedal pressure was around 17lbs. on the second attempt I got around 5.25 inch travel at the current 20lbs. this gives the best blend of fast shifting and easy to drive . this mod is likely the coolest mod I have ever done to the car.

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[EVO6]

I cant comment on changes you made because you left out the two most important details. what size slave you are on and what size master you used. and whether this is 1g or 2g. but I assure you what I did is worlds apart and far better. the TOB is a factory part from a saab. its stupid robust by design.

as far as peddle pressure is concerned if you put a scale on the pedal and read the scale as you pushed on the scale you would have pedal pressure.

stock is around 16lbs.
act 2600 in a 1g would be as high as 36lbs .1g has to use 7/8 slave because of flexing of torque arm on pedal assembly. any flexing in the system causes higher pedal pressure.
act 2600 in a 2g/evo1 would be around 25-30lbs depending on slave (13/16 or 7/8)
my setup is around 20lbs. but can be adjusted higher or low depending on what kind shift speed you are after. with no adjustments to pedal ratio the pedal travel is reduced from 5.5 inches stock travel to 4 inches. this makes the pedal pressure about like a stock 2600 at 25lbs. is really nice to drive car fast as pedal travel is so short. fabulous for a drag car. the draw back is its more difficult to daily drive. the clutch action is very quick. pretty similar to driving a 6 puck or smooth twin which I never enjoyed. reducing leverage ratio at the pedal on the first try I got 6" of pedal travel. it was butter smooth to drive and pedal pressure was around 17lbs. on the second attempt I got around 5.25 inch travel at the current 20lbs. this gives the best blend of fast shifting and easy to drive . this mod is likely the coolest mod I have ever done to the car.

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Hey! I am "resurrecting" this thread... I recently had the gearbox rebuilt on my JDM 1999 EVO6. Also upgraded to a later generation pressure plate, street track flywheel and ACT Monoloc etc. The pedal pressure has increased significantly and the car is no longer enjoyable to drive. The clutch is pretty hard to depress. Someone told me about replacing the master and slave cylinders to soften this up. Came across this forum while researching and thought I would go straight to the guys that walked this path already. Which upgraded cylinders would I need to order and, are there any additional mods that would be needed to get this to work? I am in Central FL. Thanks in advance for the guidance.

 

[94awdcoupe]

Hey! I am "resurrecting" this thread... I recently had the gearbox rebuilt on my JDM 1999 EVO6. Also upgraded to a later generation pressure plate, street track flywheel and ACT Monoloc etc. The pedal pressure has increased significantly and the car is no longer enjoyable to drive. The clutch is pretty hard to depress. Someone told me about replacing the master and slave cylinders to soften this up. Came across this forum while researching and thought I would go straight to the guys that walked this path already. Which upgraded cylinders would I need to order and, are there any additional mods that would be needed to get this to work? I am in Central FL. Thanks in advance for the guidance.

Evo 4-9 use a pull style pressure plate. The DSM cars and Evo 1-3 use a push style pressure plate. They are too different beasts. The data I posted was for DSM early Evo cars. Does not apply to Evo 4-9. I used the ACT high clamp Plate in my Evo4 and didnt like the increased pedal force myself. To reduce pedal pressure in your case you would need to change the pressure plate to one with less clamp pressure.

 

[EVO6]

Greatly appreciate the feedback. That was my fear, but good to know for sure.

 

[jt_gsx]

I recently did something similar to what 94awdcoupe did on my 91 Galant VR4.

I was tired of the heavy clutch pedal feel and the inconsistent release point.

After I rebuilt my clutch pedal assembly I went with a new one piece lightweight flywheel, a Clutch Masters FX300 clutch, CM's HRB unit and a CM's .700" bore master cylinder for a BRZ and a steel braided line from the MC to the HRB unit. It wasn't a quick bolt on but it wasn't too bad at all to get everything working together and adjusted properly.

My clutch pedal release point is spot on every throw and the clutch pedal is so much lighter. It almost feels like a stock clutch. Night and day difference!

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