1. Join the Community!

    DSMtuners is a massive archive of DSM information - but more importantly, it's a COMMUNITY! Join in and participate with other DSMers, and invite all of your DSM friends to make this place their home. Chat with others, create a build thread, post questions and answers. Get involved! Logging in will also remove many of the advertisements, along with this notice. ;)

1G Turbo gaskets keep failing

Posted by Steve92talon, Nov 6, 2019

Please Support Rix Racing
Please Support ExtremePSI
  1. Steve92talon

    Steve92talon Proven Member

    134
    20
    Joined Jul 3, 2019
    Fernie, BC, Canada
    I have blown out 3 gaskets now. What about just putting a piece of aluminum for a gasket surface? Anytime I'm cruising at 90mph for 30 40 minutes straight the turbo gets so hot the gaskets fry and blow out. Or my bolts loosen up from heat maybe letting it blow out. It's like the impossible task keeping my turbo sealed to the manifold. Anyone try a srt4 manifold that has a built in turbo that's 100% leak free guaranteed?
     
  2. OH91awd

    OH91awd Proven Member

    689
    314
    Joined Sep 22, 2011
    chillicothe, Ohio
    best thing that worked for me on the turbo to manifold gaskets where coating them with the copper gasket spray and doing a good torque on the bolts. srt manifold will not work on a 4g63
     

    Drag Race Build 2K  17

    1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    10.89 @ 125.67 · 1G DSM
    Loading...
  3. 1990TSIAWDTALON

    1990TSIAWDTALON Moderator

    4,754
    2,144
    Joined Nov 14, 2013
    Independence, Kansas
    Stock turbo setup? If so, are you using the conical washers to keep the bolts tight?
    I have also used Copper spray on a 6 ply MLS gasket, but keeping the bolts tightened after heat cycles might be beneficial in your situation until they finally quit loosening up. Just a thought.
     

    Street Build 4K  27

    1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · automatic · 1G DSM

    662  14

    1990 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    awd · manual · 1G DSM

    497  18

    1967 Chevrolet Camaro RS
    rwd · automatic · Misc Vehicles

    Street Build 701  7

    1998 Eagle Talon TSi
    fwd · manual · 2G DSM

    Street Build 5K  11  25

    1990 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    13.620 @ 108.460 · 1G DSM
    Loading...
    OH91awd likes this.
  4. Dhan

    Dhan Supporting Member

    899
    131
    Joined Apr 29, 2010
    Denver, Colorado
    Curious what your setup is also. What kind of power are you making, what turbo, and what manifold? Just going to assume it's all stock (14b or 13b at ~10psi).

    • Like Marty said, you've got to use those conical washers. They have the two divets in them and "lock" the bolts in place. Get new ones from extremePSI or JNZ or wherever.
    • Also, torque the three bolts and the stud to spec in a "square-star" pattern (40-47 ft/lb). Get new hardware if you're on the old stuff.
    • You mentioned the metal gasket but there's no mention of the ring that goes inside the manifold to turbo piping. Do you have that?
    Definitely try the Permatex copper spray too. Be liberal with the spray but you don't need to drench things with it. At least I never have.
    You said things are getting so hot that it's blowing out. Are you running insanely lean? Do you know your EGTs? Are you certain the turbo and/or manifold aren't warped by putting a straight edge on them?
     

    2K  4

    1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · manual · 1G DSM
    Loading...
    OH91awd likes this.
  5. Steve92talon

    Steve92talon Proven Member

    134
    20
    Joined Jul 3, 2019
    Fernie, BC, Canada
    It's a tdo5 maybe a mistubishi one still factory bolt on and internal waste gate. Cast manifold and I'm running 16lbs no problem. Cone washers eh I have some cone washer things at work at the Chrysler dealer I work for maybe that's loosening them. Honestly my car has a copper manifold to head gasket and the turbo was a copper gasket but it was cracked and missing a chunk so I tossed it. I tried just header flange gasket material and that started smoldering after one pass on boost during up. So since I'm in canada and no gaskets exist in any parts database I went to using just a round pipe gasket. Like the down pipe has. I had it all sealed up perfect and torque down. One run on the highway you know in "Mexico" at 90ish mph for pretty close to a hr off and on and major leak at the rear when I got to my destination. Radar detection wide open road why not. I tightened the bolts up when it was hot and they honestly felt like plasticky u know. Tight but still a little spring when u pulled. There gr 8 good bolts. So I was brain storming maybe a aluminum flat plate that will expand faster and keep a tight seal. What are high boost guys running to keep it sealed. Maybe I'm in a unusual situation where I generally drove my car 2 sometimes 3hrs straight each way and can go flat out most of the time. I noticed around 95mph my afr just goes rich and I'm only at 3 or 4 lbs of boost. Stock ecu still.

    I have a aem afr I'm 14.5 just light highway speeds all normal. When I'm really cruising it at 90+ the aft will go pig rich even at just a 4psi the car starts dumping fuel in at its speed vs maf vs tpms reading I guess I try to keep just under that magic speed so I'm not pumping fuel in at just 20% throttle.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 21, 2019
  6. 1990TSIAWDTALON

    1990TSIAWDTALON Moderator

    4,754
    2,144
    Joined Nov 14, 2013
    Independence, Kansas
    You need a tuning solutuon for the pig richness and really for data logging the problem. If you had any kind of datalogger, it would help diagnose the richness.
    Are all sensors adjusted per the FSM? TPS, Base timing, etc?
     

    Street Build 4K  27

    1992 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · automatic · 1G DSM

    662  14

    1990 Mitsubishi Eclipse GSX
    awd · manual · 1G DSM

    497  18

    1967 Chevrolet Camaro RS
    rwd · automatic · Misc Vehicles

    Street Build 701  7

    1998 Eagle Talon TSi
    fwd · manual · 2G DSM

    Street Build 5K  11  25

    1990 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    13.620 @ 108.460 · 1G DSM
    Loading...
  7. delta448

    delta448 DSM Wiseman

    2,870
    127
    Joined Jan 13, 2006
    Clarksburg, West Virginia
    Exhaust leaks usually make O2 sensors read lean.
     

    2K  5

    1998 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · manual · 2G DSM

    1K  11

    1997 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · manual · 2G DSM
    Loading...
  8. Steve92talon

    Steve92talon Proven Member

    134
    20
    Joined Jul 3, 2019
    Fernie, BC, Canada
    Timing is a little advanced maybe. The pig rich is a speed thing under 90mph it's just fine 14.5 afr cruising. I filed my manifold flat same with the turbo and the head mounting side of the manifold. See how it holds up over the long weekend coming up.
     
  9. syndr0me

    syndr0me Proven Member

    108
    5
    Joined Oct 19, 2011
    Pincourt, QC, Canada
    Same.

    I mated an FP manifold with an FP red with, both with very low miles, with RTMs thickest gasket.

    I've torque them down cold, retorque them when hot.

    And it leaks on the compressor side. Bummed out :/

    I havnt even been able to take it for a spin yet because I'm still missing the transfer case!
     
  10. Steve92talon

    Steve92talon Proven Member

    134
    20
    Joined Jul 3, 2019
    Fernie, BC, Canada
    I burned out the exhaust pipe gasket even with the metal sealing ring it's just too much heat. So I was digging around at work and I found a Cummins exhaust gasket that multi layer steel but it's just a bit smaller then the hole. So far its holding up with no leaks but its definitely choking off the exhaust flow a bit limiting boost. Oh well its sealed for now and I'm getting great mpg at 10lbs of boost. I'm very tempted to make just a aluminum plate for a gasket that may leak a little cold but seal when the exhaust heats the aluminum to tighten up.

    Funny enough when my rear diff was burned up I tried my car out with no transfer case and it drove like normal still. No slipping or nothing just normal take offs like it dident care about the rear diff. Maybe give it a quick spin around the block.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 21, 2019
  11. syndr0me

    syndr0me Proven Member

    108
    5
    Joined Oct 19, 2011
    Pincourt, QC, Canada

    I thought we had open center differentials. No transfer case and everything is sent out to the rear with no power at the front.

    Perhaps I'm mistaken or my logic is flawed. Either way, its in no driving condition right now. Need to bleed the clutch, brakes, muffler is unhooked etc etc. I'm just not there yet.

    Next week hopefully
     
    buddahboost likes this.
  12. Steve92talon

    Steve92talon Proven Member

    134
    20
    Joined Jul 3, 2019
    Fernie, BC, Canada
    That's what I was told too so unless I have a welded front diff there must be some other explanation? My car litteraly drove around my shop twice and dident care the transfer case was missing and the drive shaft was wired up under the car. Drove the same as it did with everything hooked up.
     
  13. delta448

    delta448 DSM Wiseman

    2,870
    127
    Joined Jan 13, 2006
    Clarksburg, West Virginia

    2K  5

    1998 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · manual · 2G DSM

    1K  11

    1997 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · manual · 2G DSM
    Loading...
  14. donniekak

    donniekak DSM Wiseman

    4,692
    913
    Joined Mar 23, 2008
    Surprise, Arizona
    I stopped using gaskets with stock frame turbos. Fresh flat surfaces with copper spray works amazing for me.
     

    Street Build 4K  0

    1991 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    manual · 1G DSM
    Loading...
  15. Steve92talon

    Steve92talon Proven Member

    134
    20
    Joined Jul 3, 2019
    Fernie, BC, Canada
    Ok sure but why is there no slip without a transfer case. The car pulled away from a stop exactly like it was awd still

    Sounds interesting I have everything filed perfect flat.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 21, 2019
  16. donniekak

    donniekak DSM Wiseman

    4,692
    913
    Joined Mar 23, 2008
    Surprise, Arizona
    If you used a file, they aren’t flat.
     

    Street Build 4K  0

    1991 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    manual · 1G DSM
    Loading...
  17. delta448

    delta448 DSM Wiseman

    2,870
    127
    Joined Jan 13, 2006
    Clarksburg, West Virginia
    Are you absolutely sure that the center differential is not already welded in your transmission?

    Because if not, it should slip just a very little bit, -like less than 5 seconds and then start to grab similar to feathering the clutch. The factory rear LSD is similar in it's activation.
     

    2K  5

    1998 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · manual · 2G DSM

    1K  11

    1997 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    awd · manual · 2G DSM
    Loading...
  18. Steve92talon

    Steve92talon Proven Member

    134
    20
    Joined Jul 3, 2019
    Fernie, BC, Canada
    I dont know anything about my trans but it steers just fine not the hopping u usually get with a welded diff and no hesitate its instant go when I let the clutch out. So its a mystery why it drove great with no transfercase.
     
  19. Steve92talon

    Steve92talon Proven Member

    134
    20
    Joined Jul 3, 2019
    Fernie, BC, Canada
    Did the best I could with it in a vice working crossways in several direction till it was smooth and even for the file cutting all the way across. It was pretty bad for warping.
     
  20. donniekak

    donniekak DSM Wiseman

    4,692
    913
    Joined Mar 23, 2008
    Surprise, Arizona
    I’ve seen parts measured with a height gauge come out .005” out of flat that actually measured flat with a straight edge.
     

    Street Build 4K  0

    1991 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    manual · 1G DSM
    Loading...
  21. Steve92talon

    Steve92talon Proven Member

    134
    20
    Joined Jul 3, 2019
    Fernie, BC, Canada
    Well anything more accurate is not possible living in a town of 8000 no walmart or nothing within a hr
     
  22. donniekak

    donniekak DSM Wiseman

    4,692
    913
    Joined Mar 23, 2008
    Surprise, Arizona
    A belt sander would work better than a file.
     

    Street Build 4K  0

    1991 Eagle Talon TSi AWD
    manual · 1G DSM
    Loading...
  23. BLACK'98DSM

    BLACK'98DSM Proven Member

    1,278
    427
    Joined Feb 9, 2019
    Hoover, Alabama
    I'm not sure why this thread has gone so long about a single little topic LOL. It's simple.
    - Get a flat surface
    - Get a quality gasket
    - Use some quality copper spray.
    - Use the proper torque specs, or more if needed once warm.

    I don't claim to be an expert on turbo gaskets or anything, I guess I'm just good at gathering stated information.

    Good day. :)
     

    Road Race Build 2K  23

    1998 Mitsubishi Eclipse N/T
    fwd · manual · 2G DSM

    481  5

    2012 Murray Explorer Dune
    rwd · automatic · Misc Vehicles

    378  4

    2009 Troy Bilt Bronco
    rwd · automatic · Misc Vehicles
    Loading...
    Steve92talon likes this.
  24. Steve92talon

    Steve92talon Proven Member

    134
    20
    Joined Jul 3, 2019
    Fernie, BC, Canada
    My first dsm so still in the learning curve and quality gaskets are very difficult to obtain in canada unfortunately. online ordering only
     
    BLACK'98DSM likes this.
  25. buddahboost

    buddahboost Proven Member

    342
    53
    Joined Aug 15, 2007
    CHICAGO HEIGHTS, Illinois
    I've heard people using a long piece of sand paper on top of a granite to eliminate high spots
     

Share This Page

Support Vendors who Support the DSM Community
Archer Fabrication ECM Tuning ExtremePSI Feal Suspension Fuel Injector Clinic Jacks Transmissions JNZ Tuning Kiggly Racing Morrison Fabrications OHM Racing RixRacing RockAuto SouthBay Fuel Injectors STM Tuned Track Decals Track Sculptures VR Speed Factory WheelWell.com