Tig question

[Gstclipse69]

Hey guys, I am currently taking a basic welding class at a local college. My instructor said that it was possible to take a dc stick welder and turn it into a tig welder. Check this link: Engloid's TIG welder upgrade for stick welders

What do you guys think about this? I have been browsing for welding machines for awhile and I know tig machines are very pricey. This seems like a very economical way to get my feet wet with the tig without spending 2k. I know this would not allow me to do thin aluminum but I would still get to tig it instead of using a mig machine. Just seeing what you guys' thoughts, opinions were on this.

 

[viperlp01]

I bought the tig welder in my shop off craigslist for 600 bucks. Does everything I want and works great. I would look around for a used one first

 

[bryanwheat]

You can do a kit like that, but you won't have the ability to change power levels while welding and you won't have the hf start. I would reccomend the miller inverter tig setup. It uses an existing arc welder as a power souce, but allows you to change power level with a foot switch, frequency and has hf start.

 

[Gstclipse69]

Well if I could find a deal like that I would be on it like white on rice. I have been stalking craigslist since december looking for a welder, but I have only come across one that I would have considered buying. Anyone got a link for this inverter setup?

 

[turboglenn]

That's the old and pretty ghetto way of doing it but if you don't need amperage control (in most cases) and don't care that you're going to be limited to scratch start DCwelding only (means no aluminum and scratch starting isn't "bad" but high freqis much nicer)

YOu'll probably not be too impressed with something like that after learnign on an econoTIG unit, I would suggest looking for a used TIG setup on the MIller WElding forums or in your local craigslist adds, You can find welders cheap almost year rund from either pipe fitting guys upgrading (can get a nice econotig orsome of the other smaller miller units that are inverter based) which is nice for some one without a shop as the older transformer based units weigh in at 250-400lbs and are often the size of a washer/dryer which makes them require their own dedicated space in the shop as well as most of the ol;der units MUST have either 220 or 440 3 phase, where the new inverter units can function on 150 110Volt service up to around 150amps of welding power. PLus they generally weigh under 60lbs for the main unit which makes owning one when you livein an apartment or even a regular house withouit a huge garage a much nicer thing to deal with

I have a dynasty 200DX which is expensive but there's several models that aren't that bad and can be found used for a grand or less with torch and all which will all work on 110volt, and do DC as well as AC welding and include high Frequency starting

 

[Calan]

... but there's several models that aren't that bad and can be found used for a grand or less with torch and all which will all work on 110volt, and do DC as well as AC welding and include high Frequency starting

Toss us some model numbers Glen..

 

[Gamble97]

Best tig under $900 thread
Best TIG under $900 - Everlast, Eastwood, or Thermal Arc? - WeldingWeb™ - Welding forum for pros and enthusiasts

Or this one but it's 230v
Invertig 131 DC/HF TIG Welder, Metal Welding, Welder Supplies, Accessories for Welding | USAWeld.com

 

[turboglenn]

There's the Diversion 165 and Diversion 180 as well as the Maxstar series (which the maxstar is HUGELY popular with guys welding pipe in the field and they are often replacing and or upgrading to the latest model or going for more amps) I've seen Maxstars and Diversions both going complete for anywhere from right at a grand to 1500 bucks but that's including everythging you need to start welding and usually a few extras.

There's also some Non-miller units (i'm die hard for the blue though )

here;s some links to maxstar and diversion units
Maxstar® 150 STH - TIG - Miller
These units are widely available for under a grand being that the base STLmodel is only 1300 new

THis is a link to the diversion series, while costing a bit more up front they still include the torch, ground cabnle and other parts you don't get in the "base kit" when buying a unit like my Dynasty 200DX
Diversion? 180 - TIG - Miller

These are really nice units and although they lack some of the features like "plug in" style torch and utilize a thumb amp-troll instead of a pedal they are still great piecesand you can get replacement (or different sized) torches aswell as being able to fit a pedal style amp troll to them if you want/.. these really are "begginer units" that will allow you to grow as well as keeping up with the increased skill level as you go, their only limitations being the total output but that's where the money is really spent is when you want to weld something thicker than 3/16th';s

BUt a note on that, 3/16ths penetration doens't mean you can't safely weld pieces thicker than that on your car, it's just penetration, and you can "V" out your material on thicker stuff and penetrate 3/16ths' to each side of the bead and easily do 1/4and up to 1/2"material safely if you know what you're doing (which comes with learning the trade and isn't something to base your purchase off of since most begginers don't know what they're doing)

Iwill also vouch for the quality of the "thermal-arc" units asi've used them at other peoples shops and houses many timesand became rather impressed with what they offered. I have used ONE of the inver-tig unitsand it was nice as well, I didn't get a lot of time on it i was just doing some 1/16th sheet work but it wasstill a solid piece of equipment fromwhat i could tell

 

[99gst_racer]

Gstclipse69, what's your budget?

 

[Gstclipse69]

Well my budget right now is definitely under a grand. I just bought a used miller 140 mig the other day so I got that taken care of. As far as the tig, if I cant get something that will suite my needs right now then it will just have to wait. I've got a project coming up soon that I think I could utilize it well with, thats why I have been curious as to see if I could pick one up.

As far as 120 or 230 that does not make a difference at all. I just built a nice garage this past summer with enough power for whatever I want to do. Actually the last couple days I have been eyeing this thing: THERMAL ARC 95S TIG-STICK WELDER W1003203 (822635006352) | eBay

I know that is not a top notch sucker but what is it capable of doing? At school, I forget exactly what machine it is, its a lincoln inverter something, but we have to scratch start the tig and there isnt a foot pedal either. So its not like Im used to working with those things anyhow.

I thought the tig would be useful especially for welding dissimilar metals together like ss to mild steel (although I read I can mig it ok with 309 ss wire) and for a couple bungs I need to weld in. Plus I really like tig better anyway. I feel like I have a lot more control over whats going on.

Glenn, thanks for the info. Im going to keep looking for a used one and check out the miller forums.

 

[Gamble97]

I almost bought that thermal arc. Seems decent for the price, but since you can afford better I would. Honestly if 230 is what you have available and you don't need to do aluminum I would buy the HTP welder in a heart beat!

If you want cheap and good reviews from what I have read online get the eastwood.
If you want to save up and get a name brand, get the diversion 180. Anything with a foot pedal is what I recommend. The diversion 165 doesn't come with a foot pedal and some people didn't care for it as much as the 180. Lots of people said the 180 was wayyyyy better than the 165.

Jody from weldingtipsandtricks.com did a comparison on the diversion and the everlast and said both machines have good and bad but he would be happy owning either one. Not sure what the price point is on the everlast but it might be in your budget.

 

[99gst_racer]

That ThermalArc is tiny! Rule of thumb is one amp per .001" material thickness. So, it would be good to about .095".

If I were going to spring for a generic welder for less than a grand, I'd get this one: Everlast PowerTig 185 185A 185AMP ACDC TIG WELDER 180 | eBay

 

[99gst_racer]

And before I consider buying a generic box, I'd consider an old used name brand box like one of these:

HOBART TIG WELDER | eBay

You can also sometimes find old Miller DC boxes and Lincoln Squarewaves in the $500-$900 range on eBay and Craigslist.

Another one: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Miller-Sync...003?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3a71a89dbb

 

[Gamble97]

That ThermalArc is tiny! Rule of thumb is one amp per .001" material thickness. So, it would be good to about .095".

If I were going to spring for a generic welder for less than a grand, I'd get this one: Everlast PowerTig 185 185A 185AMP ACDC TIG WELDER 180 | eBay

Yep these are nice, just price out the foot pedal too. The only downside I would see with going used is you have no warranty.
I paid 1800 or less out the door for my diversion 180 and I love it. Best investment ever, kind of wish it had more controls like balance though.

 

[Gstclipse69]

I like that Everlast. Definitely going to look into it.

 

[Lofty]

Any 110 TIGs worth a damn?

 

[99gst_racer]

Any 110 TIGs worth a damn?

Ohh yeah. Mine is dual voltage, which is excellent because I haven't got around to wiring the garage with a 230 plug yet. It's just a handy option to have because it has less limitations on where you can take it and use it.

Here's mine: Invertec® V160-T TIG Welder

It's DC only though. I'd eventually like to upgrade to Lincoln's AC/DC Invertec, which is also dual voltage: Invertec® V205-T AC/DC TIG Welder

And Miller's Diversion 185 and Dynasty 200 will both run on 120V.

Though keep in mind that any welder that is 120V-only will be limited in power. Usually around 100 amps (at a low duty cycle), which isn't even enough juice for sch-10 pipe. So, if you want something that can run on 120V, then get a decent dual voltage inverter box.

 

[Gamble97]

Any 110 TIGs worth a damn?

People that have been welding for years will tell you know. I'm still new, but I say yes. I haven't needed to go over 110amps on mine and I only have 115v, mine is the diversion 180 and it will do 125 on 115v.
If you need more and only have 115v you can always add a little helium to the mix of argon. Granted I haven't done any manifolds or anything like that. I guess it all depends on what you want to do.
You can always preheat the metal also.

 

[Calan]

That Diversion 180 looks pretty nice for the money. What are it's drawbacks?

How does it compare to the V160-T that you have Paul, since they are both dual-voltage?

 

[99gst_racer]

That Diversion 180 looks pretty nice for the money. What are it's drawbacks?

How does it compare to the V160-T that you have Paul, since they are both dual-voltage?

The Diversion 180 is pretty nice. It's drawbacks are a lack of bells and whistles. There's no pulse feature (which isn't a deal breaker IMO), there's no post-flow adjustability, and there's also a lack of AC balance control. I assume its AC balance is around a 50/50 split between cleaning and penetration. And there will definitely be times when you'll want more or less of one than the other.

My Invertec is DC only, so I can't do aluminum like the Diversion 180 can. But I do have a sweet pulse option for doing thin wall stainless as well as adjustable post-flow. It's also about half the size and weight of the Diversion 180, so it's a bit more portable. If you're a guy like me that works with steel 99% of the time, then the V160-T is an excellent option. But if you need to be able to do aluminum, then you'll need an AC/DC box. And the Diversion 180 is probably the best bang for the buck for a name brand AC/DC box.


EDIT: Another difference that I just noticed is that you cannot stick weld with the Diversion, but you can with the Invertec.

 

[Gamble97]

Pauls is only DC, mine is AC/DC.
Drawbacks on the 180 is you can't set the pre/post flow and the balance. Pre flow is set and post flow changes depending on long you weld for. Balance is set to 80%. No pulse feature either.

Either way they are both GREAT machines. Just depends on if you want to do AC or not.

Ah you beat me to it.

 

[99gst_racer]

Balance is set to 80%.

That's good to know. I assume that's 80% penetration and 20% cleaning?

 

[Calan]

Well I would be welding aluminum most of the time.

 

[Gamble97]

That's good to know. I assume that's 80% penetration and 20% cleaning?

I believe so.

 

[Gstclipse69]

I see Everlast has the Power I-Tig 200 for 649, but its dc only, which means no aluminum. The other is the 185 which is ac/dc which will do aluminum. The weldingtipsandtricks video is impressive, especially considering they are putting it head to head with a miller. Im really considering the 185. Anyone have one, comments, opinions?