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The 14b Drag Race Discussion Thread

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Caution- 14b drag racing discussion aheadOMG
This was my first time back at the track since November or so. Over the winter some changes i did were, Manual Steering, Intrax 2" drop springs, rear AGXs, front eccentric bolts, Ingals rear upper adj. camber arms (I still haven't done my alignment yet though, which i think could be hurting my 60' times)DSMlink V2, finally put my rear engine polly mount in (only had the side ones in) and put a new headliner back in :).

Granted i hadn't been to the track n some time and i was testing out a new suspension and launching at the track for the first time with the 2step on dsmlink, but my 60' times were struggling. Shocks were set at 8 and then down to 6. Tires were around 22 and then down to 20psi. Started with the 2 step set at my normal 5500 rpm launch, but the tach would bounce above that and seemed to be reved really high.

At first i was spinning bad through first gear. So i lowered tire pressures and my 2 step to 5250, then 5000, then 4750, and i was trying to let the clutch out a little slower every time too. Not until i lowered it down to 4500 (which was a great 2step rpm to launch on the street) was i able to hook up and not spin like crazy. But still my best 60' of about 6-7 passes was a half decent 1.75

My first pass i spun bad but kept in it, but i couldn't get in to fourth on my fist try, got it in and then ran a 12.91 @ 109 with a 1.94 60'

The next couple passes i let off since i had trouble spinning and getting it in to gear.

I had a couple passes with 1.8* 60' times that got me 12.7 runs at 110 mph. I was still shifting like i was driving quickly on the street though, since my first few passes i couldn't get it in to second or fourth gear at times. I had one more pass at the end of the day i would have tried one more time to rape that gear box and hope it got in each gear. My slower shifting accounted for a loss of e/t but the 60' times speak for them selves.

My second to last pass of the day i had my best 60' of 1.75 i ran 12.67 @ 109. This was a new best for my laser beating my 12.69 by 0.02 LOL. With the suspension done, some weight out and now the tuning benefits i was hoping for a 12.3 on my first trip back. But my 60's need some work and possibly dialing in my alignment at the shop. As for the car, it was running great at about 19 psi on C-16 leaned out with no nock-up to 2 counts at times though, and timing around 24 but climbing up to 40 at times??? Timing in the mid rpm range was usually between 20-24*. Was pulling good once i got her going off the line. Next trip if i can't get the 60' down i'm going to try launching the old fashion way.
 
Caution- 14b drag racing discussion aheadOMG
This was my first time back at the track since November or so. Over the winter some changes i did were, Manual Steering, Intrax 2" drop springs, rear AGXs, front eccentric bolts, Ingals rear upper adj. camber arms (I still haven't done my alignment yet though, which i think could be hurting my 60' times)DSMlink V2, finally put my rear engine polly mount in (only had the side ones in) and put a new headliner back in :).

Granted i hadn't been to the track n some time and i was testing out a new suspension and launching at the track for the first time with the 2step on dsmlink, but my 60' times were struggling. Shocks were set at 8 and then down to 6. Tires were around 22 and then down to 20psi. Started with the 2 step set at my normal 5500 rpm launch, but the tach would bounce above that and seemed to be reved really high.

At first i was spinning bad through first gear. So i lowered tire pressures and my 2 step to 5250, then 5000, then 4750, and i was trying to let the clutch out a little slower every time too. Not until i lowered it down to 4500 (which was a great 2step rpm to launch on the street) was i able to hook up and not spin like crazy. But still my best 60' of about 6-7 passes was a half decent 1.75

My first pass i spun bad but kept in it, but i couldn't get in to fourth on my fist try, got it in and then ran a 12.91 @ 109 with a 1.94 60'

The next couple passes i let off since i had trouble spinning and getting it in to gear.

I had a couple passes with 1.8* 60' times that got me 12.7 runs at 110 mph. I was still shifting like i was driving quickly on the street though, since my first few passes i couldn't get it in to second or fourth gear at times. I had one more pass at the end of the day i would have tried one more time to rape that gear box and hope it got in each gear. My slower shifting accounted for a loss of e/t but the 60' times speak for them selves.

My second to last pass of the day i had my best 60' of 1.75 i ran 12.67 @ 109. This was a new best for my laser beating my 12.69 by 0.02 LOL. With the suspension done, some weight out and now the tuning benefits i was hoping for a 12.3 on my first trip back. But my 60's need some work and possibly dialing in my alignment at the shop. As for the car, it was running great at about 19 psi on C-16 leaned out with no nock-up to 2 counts at times though, and timing around 24 but climbing up to 40 at times??? Timing in the mid rpm range was usually between 20-24*. Was pulling good once i got her going off the line. Next trip if i can't get the 60' down i'm going to try launching the old fashion way.

Are you sure you're posting in the right threadLOL

Awesome Trav! That's a great EARLY start to the season...and to beat your personal best with that car is great! How was the track prep? Ambient air temp? All that stuff will help/hurt your launches and make it hard to dial in the launch. Either way, 1.75 is a good launch. But, of course you have a tenth or so left on the table there for sure. So, with a 12.67 start to the season, I'm confident that you will see 12.0-12.1 and match your best time on the 16G. Once you get there though.....the want to tip into the 11's may take you over and keep that HX turbo on the shelf. Of course, I don't know who in their RIGHT mind would ever spend so much time trying to hit 11's with the stock turbo in a DSM.:D

Bad-ass...110 traps! The car is running strong!

Get the launch dialed and the tranny in check, and you're there.

Congrats!
 
^ That was my first thought! Sounds like the track prep wasn't very good, go to a track with some good prep and you'll have those 60's down.

Congrats on besting your time though, even if it was a somewhat bad day you got that! Sounds like it's time to get the trans rebuilt though.
 
Yeah i had high hopes considering the upgrades i have done since my last trip to the track with a best of 12.69. I was hopping for a 12.40 or better, but the season just started and like you said I'm sure a decent track will help me hook. I mean it's AWD and I'm not even making that much power. But yeah i was happy to at least go a little quicker than before and thanks for the congrats!

As for the trans, it shifts great on the street but high rpm shifting seems to be hit or miss. It's a stock trans from a '91 awd that the guy said he rebuilt to stock a few years ago "i picked it up at his job at a trans shop". The only problem on the street i ever have is it grinds going in to first gear unless I'm completely stopped and then carefully ease it in. My clutch is a ACT 2100 which at this time is holding great. In my old talon with a similar set up my 2100 didn't start slipping untill i got in the very low 12's, which i hope to do soon with the Laser.
Next trip to the track i will focus better on launching, shift rpms and shifting quicker weather the trans likes it or not, although 4th gear the one time felt like a lock out not a mis shift but it went in just fine on the return road.
 
1992 Eagle Talon AWD

6 Bolt Eagle/Wiseco 8.3
FMIC
MBC
Exhaust
Bov
4 spider diff
Race Tranny
ACT 2600
Evo 9 Fuel Pump

Pump gas, stock head/cams, stock ecu, no tuning, 13-14psi

1.8 13.2 @ ??
1.8 13.3 @ 101
1.8 13.3 @ 96
1.8 13.3 @ 92

Scale at Raceway Park, NJ said 3,156 and i weigh 165. Full interior, power windows, manual locks, no ABS. Im going to check that against another scale soon.

The clutch wouldn't hold up the launches, also my trans wouldn't let me shift hard into 4th. I changed the clutch disk out for new and new trans fluid last night. Grabs MUCH better. I'll be back to the track on tuesday for that 12.9 timeslip. Ill post the timeslips tomorrow.

More info on the car:
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/welcome-forum-member-intros/362917-finished-my-talon-tsi-awd.html

Sounds like a nice set-up. Good luck hitting 12's!

Thanks Phil, and i was racing at Capitol which makes me ask "What's track prep" LOL

:D Hey, at least they open early for the season....
Are you running a street disc with that 2100? If so, just get the 6 puck disc and that will give you more clamping force than my 2600/street disc...
 
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:D Hey, at least they open early for the season....
Are you running a street disc with that 2100? If so, just get the 6 puck disc and that will give you more clamping force than my 2600/street disc...
Hmmm, i think i may have read that at one point, but didn't make sense to me. How would driving characteristics be with that combo, do you know?
 
Hmmm, i think i may have read that at one point, but didn't make sense to me. How would driving characteristics be with that combo, do you know?

They will be fine as long as you get the sprung 6 puck. I had the 2100 PP/6 puck unsprung/Streetlight flywheel on one of my Lasers. I liked it alot. It was great except for the noise that transmits with the unsprung disc. To me, unsprung is strictly race stuff....but, when I did this ACT hadn't released the sprung 6 puck yet. What I forgot is that you plan to go to a much larger turbo at some point, so with that in mind you may want to go with a 2600/6 puck.
 
Thanks for keeping that in mind. Hopefully my 2100pp with the street disc will hold up as long as i have the 14b on there.

It really should just as long as there's no excessive slipping of the clutch on your launches. I've been running this 2600/street for a long time, but, there hasn't been any street duty for about 2 years.....that obviously comes into play as well. I think I've been running this clutch for the past 9 years! I might have tossed a new disc in 4 years back when I finally put the Streetlight flywheel in.......I can't rememberLOL!
 
Wow this thread has suprised me, I didn't think my 1G/14b would even be capable of a mid-13 pass with the following mods:

- 190LPH Walbro Fuel pump w/rewire
- PR FMIC
- 2G MAS/2G hard intake
- WB02
- MBC
- ECMlink V3 lite
- DP-back 3" SS exhaust
- 18psi of boost

I also plan to remove the front & rear wipers/motors and all the spare tire stuff. From what I've read here it seems like a 13.5 is completely feasible...score.
 
Wow this thread has suprised me, I didn't think my 1G/14b would even be capable of a mid-13 pass with the following mods:

- 190LPH Walbro Fuel pump w/rewire
- PR FMIC
- 2G MAS/2G hard intake
- WB02
- MBC
- ECMlink V3 lite
- DP-back 3" SS exhaust
- 18psi of boost

I also plan to remove the front & rear wipers/motors and all the spare tire stuff. From what I've read here it seems like a 13.5 is completely feasible...score.

I think i ran a 13.7 on a 14b 1g with a cat back 2.5", K&N filter, fuel pump, manual boost controller and some race gas with some weight reduction.
 
I think i ran a 13.7 on a 14b 1g with a cat back 2.5", K&N filter, fuel pump, manual boost controller and some race gas with some weight reduction.

how much boost? I have to keep mine at <18 as the gas over here in Italy is horrible. Hopefully I'll source some race gas to play with once I have V3lite.
 
how much boost? I have to keep mine at <18 as the gas over here in Italy is horrible. Hopefully I'll source some race gas to play with once I have V3lite.

With fewer mods then you have I ran a 13.6 when I missed 4th gear at 14psi. That was with a little bit of 110 mixed with 93 octane in the tank. Stock ecu, no tuning devices. I do have a bit of weight taken out of the car but still full interior.

The most important thing to think about at the track is getting that launch down and hitting the shift points.

Phil1320 said:
Launch at 5400-5600 rpm

On street tires start at 28 psi front and 26 psi and go down from there if theres too much spin and keep the 2 pound difference between front and rear.

1-2 shift you just have to feel it, 2-3 6600, 3-4 6300-6600 again listening to what the engine is doing, 1-2 shift theres no time for that!

Best advice I've gotten so far right there. Your mods are plenty to get you where you want to be, I'd say high 12's aren't out of the question. But, make sure your car is running tip-top first, new BPR7es plugs gapped .30, no boost leaks, etc.
 
Hey guys, I'm headed to the track this weekend on 14b power for the second time since I owned the car, things have changed a bit since its stock setup. I only had a few good mods when I went, and I ran high 8's. (1/8th mile) Which I thought was pretty good on stock fuel pump, injectors, exhaust. Just bumped the boost a bit to 14psi. I still had the stock SMIC too then.

Now I've done more work its got
Wal.190
2g exh. man.
evo o2 dump
26x6x2.5"fmic short route hot side, stock 1g bov
LM-1 WB
MAFT gen2 (11.6:1 pump gas)(WB tracking is awesome) I just can't figure out the gain setting?...

Things I haven't installed yet
evo 3 560's
2g mas

I wanted to do runs like it is, and then install the 560's, and 2gmas

My problem installing the 2g is I don't have a intake tube for it. Can I cram it into the 1g tube? LOL

I hope doing this I can get down into low 8's We'll see tonight, and tomorrow!! LOL
 
Hey guys, I'm headed to the track this weekend on 14b power for the second time since I owned the car, things have changed a bit since its stock setup. I only had a few good mods when I went, and I ran high 8's. (1/8th mile) Which I thought was pretty good on stock fuel pump, injectors, exhaust. Just bumped the boost a bit to 14psi. I still had the stock SMIC too then.

Now I've done more work its got
Wal.190
2g exh. man.
evo o2 dump
26x6x2.5"fmic short route hot side, stock 1g bov
LM-1 WB
MAFT gen2 (11.6:1 pump gas)(WB tracking is awesome) I just can't figure out the gain setting?...

Things I haven't installed yet
evo 3 560's
2g mas

I wanted to do runs like it is, and then install the 560's, and 2gmas

My problem installing the 2g is I don't have a intake tube for it. Can I cram it into the 1g tube? LOL

I hope doing this I can get down into low 8's We'll see tonight, and tomorrow!! LOL

Actually, you can cram it into the 1G intake tube. It takes some time, a heat gun or hair dryer, and some dish soap. Gives you much better flow then a 1G MAS as well. The 2G MAS does not sit in the filter occupying all the space. The 1G MAS honeycombs also sit right behind the end of the filter, most filters have a plastic molding at the end of the them where filtration does not take place.

This does not mean you cannot go fast on a 1G MAS, they work very well up to a certain point. I just think that the 1G MAS sitting in the airfilter/airbox, is one of the biggest shortcomings of the 1G MAS system.

Good luck at the track!

Edit: I just noticed that your trying to switch over to the 2G MAS because you have a MAFT setup. I thought you had the original 1G setup. My Mistake.

I did the MAFT to 2G MAS swap a while back, when I bought Dsmlink. I sold the MAFT setup to help fund the 2G MAS and Dsmlink setup. That was back when the MAFT 2.02 had better resale value. I would definitely go with the 2G MAS if you have a way of tuning the car. But, if you find a way to dial in your MAFT setup, stick with it and push the envelope.
 
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Evo 3 injectors are 510cc.

510? These are 560's. For example.

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/tuning-engine-management/246501-evo-3-16g-gt-evo-injectors-560cc.html

Actually, you can cram it into the 1G intake tube. It takes some time, a heat gun or hair dryer, and some dish soap. Gives you much better flow then a 1G MAS as well. The 2G MAS does not sit in the filter occupying all the space. The 1G MAS honeycombs also sit right behind the end of the filter, most filters have a plastic molding at the end of the them where filtration does not take place.

This does not mean you cannot go fast on a 1G MAS, they work very well up to a certain point. I just think that the 1G MAS sitting in the airfilter/airbox, is one of the biggest shortcomings of the 1G MAS system.

Good luck at the track!

Edit: I just noticed that your trying to switch over to the 2G MAS because you have a MAFT setup. I thought you had the original 1G setup. My Mistake.

I did the MAFT to 2G MAS swap a while back, when I bought Dsmlink. I sold the MAFT setup to help fund the 2G MAS and Dsmlink setup. That was back when the MAFT 2.02 had better resale value. I would definitely go with the 2G MAS if you have a way of tuning the car. But, if you find a way to dial in your MAFT setup, stick with it and push the envelope.

I do ostill have the 1g mas, I been waiting to install the 2g, and injectors until I got familiar with the Gen2, then switch over. Only thing is I don't have a intake tube to match I'll try using the 1g tube first. I got an old 1g front can with no mas on it, I thought about cutting that part out, and welding the hole up, then cut it out the same as the 2g mas, and use my K&n filter. I seen a write up where someone did that.

BTW thanks, I hope I get to the track thisweekend for
TNT. BTW I think I need to richen up the WOT AFR, Its set to 11.6:1, I bet thats why I'm seeing the knock. I been using STP OCt. Boost, When I got to the track I'll probably get some of their 110oct.(purple) race fuel, that may let me run a higher AFR, like 12:1 I can't wait to see!
 
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Here is the actual injector, it says 560 on the side, I guess that may not be the 560's though. They are a pinkish color though. then they are evo 8, LOL I need to update my pro. Maybe the evoIII O2 dump is whats throwing me off.

The yellow top evo3 injectors are indeed 510cc's, that thread is referring to evo8 560cc injectors (pink top) when running an evo3 16g.

There is a lot of evo III confusion in my head LOL. So what does anyone think about lowering the AFR from 11.6:1? Is that set too lean?
 

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Here is the actual injector, it says 560 on the side, I guess that may not be the 560's though. They are a pinkish color though. then they are evo 8, LOL I need to update my pro. Maybe the evoIII O2 dump is whats throwing me off.



There is a lot of evo III confusion in my head LOL. So what does anyone think about lowering the AFR from 11.6:1? Is that set too lean?


You got some evo8 560's there my friend. There's been lots of discussion debating that they actually flow closer to 580-590cc's but from my research on the forums they should be enough for the 14b. I picked up a set myself along with a 2g maf. Once I work out my drivetrain issues I'd like start with some close to stock dyno numbers and plan out my mods from there.
 
I would go around 11.2 on pump but if your not getting any knock at 11.6 then no need to change it.
 
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