punishment vs vr speed. question before ordering

[spic21]

ok ive just order my ecmlink and sent off comp for conversion and socketed. so now im about to order fmic. so please give ## input. i was about to get PR. then i was recommend VR by someone thats gonna tune my car. so now these are the two kits im looking at:

Punishment Racing your parts source for the Mitsubishi Evo & Eclipse, Eagle Talon and Laser

VR Speed Factory - EVO, DSM & WRX Performance Parts - VRSF 1G Front Mount Intercooler Kit : 90 - 94 Eclipse & Talon Turbo

both are about same price so not worried about that. but i do have a few concerns. punishment is 2in bigger so guessing thats good but dont know how much it really matters. but does PR kit work with a gm maf because i will be putting mine on when ecmlink comes in. i notice that vr has a different pipe for this, or thats my guess since it cost more for that set up. also have done alot of reading and notice that both kits have a few corks. like PR kit looks like ill have to trim a bit off ac fan and maybe cut a pipe. while VR looks like i have to cut radiator support brackets. also i have a 90 talon tsi so will my oil cooler be a problem with either kit?

id love some info because i want to order it today. especially if u have first hand knowledge of both kits. most of the reading i did seem like they were older post from yr or better ago and i know these things change alot. thanks


p.s. my car and all mods are listed on my profile. thanks

 

[gofer]

I wish I could give a good shakedown of both kits but unfortunately I only have install experience with the VRS 2g FMIC kit.

"We designed this to be a hassle free complete bolt on with only some slight trimming to the vehicles radiator core support to allow clearance for the upper & lower intercooler pipe."​

This is somewhat of a false claim made by VR-Speed since there is more that needs to be done, I've talked to them about changing it but I guess they haven't gotten around to it.

-Since its a short route kit the piping will be in the way of your coolant overflow bottle which will need to be relocated.
-The bolts they included in the kit to mount the front mount were huge so I had to drill and tap new holes in the frame as well.​

Overall its a great kit but plan for the above, I wish I had known about this stuff because I was taking trips to the store getting a tap/die set and then trying to figure out how I was going to mount the overflow AFTER my car was in pieces in the driveway.

As far as the GM MAF goes that extra $30 only includes the couplers/clamps (3" or 3.5" depending on which GM MAF) but they won't modify the UICP for it. Meaning your still going to have to cut that pipe to fit the GM MAF in there, once its cut though you'll have the necessary couplers/clamps for it.

Good question about the oil cooler... My stock A/T cooler was in the way on the 2g kit, you might contact VRS directly about this. Mangina24

 

[spic21]

I wish I could give a good shakedown of both kits but unfortunately I only have install experience with the VRS 2g FMIC kit.

"We designed this to be a hassle free complete bolt on with only some slight trimming to the vehicles radiator core support to allow clearance for the upper & lower intercooler pipe."​

This is somewhat of a false claim made by VR-Speed since there is more that needs to be done, I've talked to them about changing it but I guess they haven't gotten around to it.

-Since its a short route kit the piping will be in the way of your coolant overflow bottle which will need to be relocated.
-The bolts they included in the kit to mount the front mount were huge so I had to drill and tap new holes in the frame as well.​

Overall its a great kit but plan for the above, I wish I had known about this stuff because I was taking trips to the store getting a tap/die set and then trying to figure out how I was going to mount the overflow AFTER my car was in pieces in the driveway.

As far as the GM MAF goes that extra $30 only includes the couplers/clamps (3" or 3.5" depending on which GM MAF) but they won't modify the UICP for it. Meaning your still going to have to cut that pipe to fit the GM MAF in there, once its cut though you'll have the necessary couplers/clamps for it.

Good question about the oil cooler... My stock A/T cooler was in the way on the 2g kit, you might contact VRS directly about this. Mangina24

i dont mind relocating the water over flow, thinking i can just put it where old ic was. i have a tap set so guess those bolt wont be a big problem. about the UICP, what do i have to cut? this will be first time for me and i dont have much time with these cars? when u say coupler and clamps what is that exactly. what will i be changing there? do i need something else i didnt think of? also ive been looking at some pics of other installs and it seem they dont have an a/c fan. will i have to lose this because i live in louisiana and want my a/c.

ok also after reading some more it looks like a/c fan has to go but i can get a slim fan to work. next question is about abs. hearing i cant have this for PR kit, have no info on VR kit. now to make myself look like an idiot. where is the abs stuff located. i had some guy work on this car for me many yrs ago when it was first bought and i think they took it all off say " it was junk and i didnt need it". they also remove a few other thing take i have no idea what they were. just know they said i didnt need them. i do know they capped a bunch of vacuum hose locations and removed some lines.

 

[gofer]

Clamps and couplers look like this...

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This is what your VRS front mount setup would look like without running a GM MAF...

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If you order the VRS kit WITH the GM MAF upgrade you'll ONLY get the extra clamps/couplers for it. You'll have to cut the the upper pipe where it connects to the throttle body to mount the GM MAF in there...

 

[spic21]

oh think i was confused. is not gm maf for air intake right?

guess there talking about using for blow off to vent atmosphere?

or am i just really really confused here?

 

[jjrock5]

I have has both FMICs on my 2gs and installed them myself.

To be quick about it,

If you want a bit more cooling capability (since it's short route and a larger core) then get the VR kit.

If you want easier bolt on installation, get the PR kit. The VR makes you cut your radiator support, and somewhat forces you to get rid of your fog lights.

Both will do a good job in cooling but I think the VR is a bit better in that dept.

Good luck.

 

[69_luv]

oh think i was confused. is not gm maf for air intake right?

guess there talking about using for blow off to vent atmosphere?

or am i just really really confused here?

If your asking these type questions you might want to stay away from the MAFT setup.

The air going through your intercooler is metered air, to be able to vent your BOV to the atmosphere, you have to account for that air that used to be recircd into your intake in front of the turbo.
With the GM MAF in the blowthrough setup, it is taking the reading just before the throttle body, so any air lost is not calculated (hense bov blowing off to amosphere). To fit the GM MAF into the intercooler pipe, you have to cut about 4" off of the intercooler pipe right before the bend to the throttle body. Once you cut it, I would HIGHLY Stress the importance of putting a bead on the intercooler pipe to prevent blowoffs, you then put the MAF, with the 3-2.5" reducer couplers on each side of the MAF, and put in that 4" spot that you cut out.

Another part of the GM MAF/MAFT, is with the MAFT it is a basic tuner that will allow you to tune for injectors and such. I used a MAFT for years instead of a SAFC, ect. You really need to do your homework and find out all the details about the GM MAF, the pigtail to V3, the MAFT, and if your going for blowthrough setup. For some the MAFT, wideband, and a logger is all they use to tune. Using the GM MAF with V3 is a very good option as well. I personally would not recommend you going with the GM MAF, and recirc the bov for right now, but that is just my opinion based on your questions.
If your buying the VR, pr PR FMIC I would go with the VR, that is what I am doing. I have heard nothing but good things, there are numerous threads for VR, and PR FMIC so do some searching. Good luck

This is how I had my GM MAF installed:

 

[MaNGiNa24]

Shoot me a PM with any questions you may have

 

[spic21]

If your asking these type questions you might want to stay away from the MAFT setup.
This is how you install the gm MAF for blowthrough:

The air going through your intercooler is metered air, to be able to vent your BOV to the atmosphere, you have to account for that air that used to be recircd into your intake in front of the turbo.
With the GM MAF in the blowthrough setup, it is taking the reading just before the throttle body, so any air lost is not calculated (hense bov blowing off to amosphere). To fit the GM MAF into the intercooler pipe, you have to cut about 4" off of the intercooler pipe right before the bend to the throttle body. Once you cut it, I would HIGHLY Stress the importance of putting a bead on the intercooler pipe to prevent blowoffs, you then put the MAF, with the 3-2.5" reducer couplers on each side of the MAF, and put in that 4" spot that you cut out.

Another part of the GM MAF/MAFT, is with the MAFT it is a basic tuner that will allow you to tune for injectors and such. I used a MAFT for years instead of a SAFC, ect. You really need to do your homework and find out all the details about the GM MAF, the pigtail to V3, the MAFT, and if your going for blowthrough setup. For some the MAFT, wideband, and a logger is all they use to tune. Using the GM MAF with V3 is a very good option as well. I personally would not recommend you going with the GM MAF, and recirc the bov for right now, but that is just my opinion based on your questions.
If your buying the VR, pr PR FMIC I would go with the VR, that is what I am doing. I have heard nothing but good things, there are numerous threads for VR, and PR FMIC so do some searching. Good luck

ok thanks. i didnt want to use this though blow off thats why i asked. i thought it was replacing my stock mas with gm maf and i did buy the plug with v3 setup. thats is what i understood anyway. i have been doing so much reading my eyes hurt from this screen. ive been on here non stop researching. just seem like i read one thing then it turns into something else. i am going to have my car remotely tunned once this is all done. when i saw the gm maf thing on vr speeds web site it just made me think that the gm maf wouldnt fit when i put in all the new piping for FMIC. i do have a maf translator but was just gonna sell it bacause i was under the impression that the new ecmlink was gonna take care of all this.

ok the guy whos gonna help me tune has explained it to me sorry. didnt know u could run after bov instead of in stock location. thanks for your patients. im extermely dyslexic and have to read thing 4-5 times to understand. after talking to him i went back to what u wrote and it all made since. tx