PUlling a head with the cams and cam gears attached, and will be changing tbelt toget

[Spoolin4Ever]

I have a burned valve in cylinder number whatever is closest to the driver's side.

I want to pull the head, leaving the cam gears and cams on there just because it's a pain to keep it all seperate for me as I have no room to work and am a newbie in this area.

I want to know the basic list of steps for pulling the head, and being able to change the timing belt, tensioner and water pump all at the same time. And I have a couple of questions.

1. Is there a way to keep it staying in time or will it try to turn on me? I mean when I pull the head off with the timing gears, I have no way of strpping with zip ties or a binder clip? Or is there something else I can clip on to besides the cam gear to keep it in time?

2. At what point should a zip tie or binder clip the belt?

3. At what point should I replace the tensioner? And water pump, timing belt?

So I am in need of a quick and dirty faq on a head removal and replacement with a new timing belt, tensioner, and water pump.

I printed the timing belt TSB, and a head removal FAQ with pics. BUt the TSB re-uses the tensionser, I am replacing it. So it's a little different.

 

[420a-t]

You should replace the timing belt every 60k miles, along with the tensioner and I usually do water pumps and all accy belts at the same time. You'll have to take your timing belt completely off if youre removing the head, There's nothing else you can do about it. Timing is really easy to get right if you slow down and take your time. Remove everything from the head, except the intake and exhaust manis ( you can, but I dont until the head is out of the car). You;ll have to take off your timing belt as well. Then undo the stock head bolts by taking the valve cover off and removing (I think) 8 bolts. Then pull it off! good luck!

 

[420a-t]

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/articles-engine-fuel/185236-head-removal-mini-engine-rebuild.html

 

[92AWDHX40]

Replace it all buy the kit, check a vendor, there is no quick thread. Gotto get in there and do it, it takes time. All the searches should be the same for timing belt replacement, no short cuts. To make it easier its a full timing belt job.

 

[BogusSVO]

as far as the cam tower caps go, they are numbered from cam gears back, also they have a letter to let you know what side they go on, I=intake and E=exhaust, if your head is super slimy they may be a bit hard to see.

also when you take the head to the machine shop to get the burnt valve fixed/ and valve job, take the valve stem seals from the head set with you, it will save you a few bucks, beacuse if you do not they will sell you another set.
Make sure you tell them what head gasket you plan on installing, a composite or a MLS, they take diffrent surface finishes.

read throug this , DSMT Wiseman Big Woo wrote, it gives a good understanding of a machine shop.

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/articles-engine-fuel/303225-engine-machine-work-explained.html

ASK what kind of surfacer they will use to surface your head, if they say a "master head surfacer" or any thing that looks like a big belt sander, Take your head to another shop.

your surface should look about like this ......
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/new...face-4g63t-cylinder-head-mls-head-gasket.html

You may want to read through this thread and decide if you want to try this mod out.

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/newbie-forum/341028-4g63t-head-oil-port-mod.html

 

[Spoolin4Ever]

Do you pull the exhaust manifold off and out of the car before pulling the head out?

Do you leave the intake attached or not? I'm asking for individual opinions too from those that have done it, not just the FAQ's and so forth, which I will read and study, too. But I want to know if anyone has any feedback on that?

 

[kams1gsx]

I pulled my exhaust mani and turbo as one and striped the rest of the head after it was out..Great info on here,Im glad I droped in cause me head is giong to the shop this week

 

[GSXSixteenG]

I left the exhaust manifold and intake manifold on when I did mine. It makes it way easier to get to those pesky bolts on the bottom.

 

[Spoolin4Ever]

Do you put the car up on the jack stands for this, or only just the jack under the engine for the engine mount?

I believe only the engine (support with jack w/piece of wood), no need to put the car up on jack stands for this, right?

 

[92AWDHX40]

Put a block under the pan then lift it up, i removed the exhaust at this time, as well, ive done this so many times it isnt funny.

 

[empie1]

Buy a manual.
Leave everything on (intake mani, exhast mani) and unbolt the rest.

 

[Spoolin4Ever]

Buy a manual.
Leave everything on (intake mani, exhast mani) and unbolt the rest.

Yes I have the Chilton, the CD, and a couple different guides. Funny how each one is different and none of them do it this way that I know of.

So it's a question of which guide do I follow, and what needs to come off and where.

As an example, should I disconnect the turbo feed and return lines on the turbo, or on the block/head? Thanks for all the help so far, much appreciated.

This is kind of scary but you really can't trust hardly anyone to work on your dsm without getting ripped off or it done wrong or both .

When I am finished I will certainly be much more able to do my own work, that's the good part.

 

[Spoolin4Ever]

Put a block under the pan then lift it up, i removed the exhaust at this time, as well, ive done this so many times it isnt funny.

You disconnected the down pipe from the exhaust manifold, or you removed the manifold from the head? Sounds like a dumb question, but I need to make sure.

 

[Slippi84]

Purchase a 36880 lisle tool to lock the cam gears together and lift the head straight off. Then when you go to put it back on the tool will make sure the gears are exactly the same as when you took it off. Of course you have to make sure not to rotate the crank but that's obvious.

 

[snowborder714]

If you're looking for a step by step process, you probably won't find one. Everyone has a different way of doing things.

Your timing belt will have to come off, with no way of "keeping it in time", so it'll have to be retimed after putting the head back on.

I would disconnect the oil return line from the pan. Leave the oil feed line on if you're leaving the turbo on to pull the head, since the other end bolts to the head so the whole line will come out. Then disconnect the water lines at the turbo.

Pull the head with the intake and exhaust/turbo/o2 housing and unbolt that stuff out of the car if you'd like. Or drop the turbo/o2 housing first and just pull it with the manifolds on.

Make sure to sit the head down on something softish so you don't ruin the flange area. Cardboard should be fine I believe.

 

[Slippi84]

The timing belt just conects parts that are in time a timing belt is not actually in or out of time. By keeping the cam gears together and the crank from moving it doesn't matter if you put the timing belt on exactly how it came off. The tool I showed makes it eas to keep the head still but to help keep the crank still I would use of of those timing belt tools that you use when installing a tbelt to take it off too.

 

[Spoolin4Ever]

Yeah ok I was just making sure there wasn't anything I could do to keep it in time.

So the 2 cam gears, when I put the head back on, I need to just line them up before putting it back on, and as long as the bottom end doesn't turn, then just drop it on.

If the bottome end turns, I have to time the bottom end seperatly before putting the belt back on, is that right? I'm just confirming that turning either the top end or bottom end, it won't effect either until the belt is on, that's the purpose of the belt. And if you had the timing off on the bottom end, or top, and put the belt on, you might never get it timed right, depending on where each one is relative to the other, is that correct?

THanks for the tips on the turbo.
Thanks for pointing out that tool.
Thanks for the replies.

 

[Slippi84]

Yeah ok I was just making sure there wasn't anything I could do to keep it in time.

So the 2 cam gears, when I put the head back on, I need to just line them up before putting it back on, and as long as the bottom end doesn't turn, then just drop it on.

If the bottome end turns, I have to time the bottom end seperatly before putting the belt back on, is that right? I'm just confirming that turning either the top end or bottom end, it won't effect either until the belt is on, that's the purpose of the belt. And if you had the timing off on the bottom end, or top, and put the belt on, you might never get it timed right, depending on where each one is relative to the other, is that correct?

THanks for the tips on the turbo.
Thanks for pointing out that tool.
Thanks for the replies.

The belt is to keep the car in time not make it in time. You have to look at the marks before you bolt the head down. That's the real time when it matters. If your not at TDC on both the bottom and top end or at BDC you COULD bend a valve. Not that you def will but that is the risk you take by not having it timed up before you bolt the head down. If the bottom end is in a position so that none of the pistons are at the top of their travel then you should be good to.

 

[Spoolin4Ever]

Alright.

Question: is this 10 MM Hex Bit good enough? Someone out there saidthatmakesureit's 10mm all the way or somthing,no tsure exactly what they meant. It seems a hard part to find when you're in a hurry at the last minute.

- Harbor Freight Tools - Quality Tools at the Lowest Prices

 

[Spoolin4Ever]

Alright; we pulled the head. THis one had been worked on before so it wan't super hard when it comes to the head bolts and the exhaust manifold nuts/studs.

We did have to use some PB Blaster on a couple of the studs but we didn't wait for it to soak long, just a couple minutes.

We left the turbo in the car with the exhuast supporting it . Pulled the head with the intake and exhaust manifold attached. Not a bad idea, actually.

The worst parts for me is getting the lower timing belt cover off because not much room. Besides that it's not too bad.

(Yes I bought the harbor freight metric hex set, worked great)

Questions:

1. I am replacing the hydraulic tensioner. How do you put it on correctly? I know it sounds dumb but the TBS just shows how to re-use it. The old tensioner is still on there.

2. Where can I get new exhaust manifold studs (or should I even care and just re-ues them?)

 

[Turbo Talon DL]

If you're replacing the tensioner then you might as well replace the pulleys, balance shaft, and timing belts. Do NOT reuse the manifold studs. Do NOT reuse the head bolts. DO get a manual, a torque wrench, new hardware, and new parts and consumables. You do have a manual handy correct? It shows you diagrams of how to install the tensioner. The Haynes is 'sufficient' for the job although its a 'good' idea to print off the factory service manual sections relavent to doing the timing belt/head R/R.

Please torque the head bolts in at least 5 stages. I used 15, 30, 45, 55, 65 lb/in2 for example.

Any of the supporting vendors can probably sell you some exhaust mani studs, a new head gasket, new exhaust manifold 4 layer copper gasket, and a new belt+tensioner. Just find one that you like, prefer, or is close by.

 

[Spoolin4Ever]

If you're replacing the tensioner then you might as well replace the pulleys, balance shaft, and timing belts. Do NOT reuse the manifold studs. Do NOT reuse the head bolts. DO get a manual, a torque wrench, new hardware, and new parts and consumables. You do have a manual handy correct? It shows you diagrams of how to install the tensioner. The Haynes is 'sufficient' for the job although its a 'good' idea to print off the factory service manual sections relavent to doing the timing belt/head R/R.

Please torque the head bolts in at least 5 stages. I used 15, 30, 45, 55, 65 lb/in2 for example.

Any of the supporting vendors can probably sell you some exhaust mani studs, a new head gasket, new exhaust manifold 4 layer copper gasket, and a new belt+tensioner. Just find one that you like, prefer, or is close by.

Oh I thought you can re-use the stock head bolts if not going high on the boost?

Balance shafts are removed so I'm good there.

 

[Calan]

...Do NOT reuse the manifold studs...

Ehhh... why not?

They are steel studs screwed into an aluminum head, and the nuts are only torqued to 20 ft lbs. It's not like they are going to stretch.

Now the nuts are a different story. They are locknuts that deform when tightened, and definitely should only be used once. Most vendors only sell the studs and nuts in a kit, but Forced Performance will sell you just the nuts if you ask them.

On the 1g head bolts...they are beefy. Some people reuse them; some don't. If you aren't running much over stock boost and they haven't yielded (you can check the length or diameter if you know the specs), you could probably get away with reusing them. The factory considers them reusable if they meet specs. But IMHO, some new ARP head studs are good insurance for when you do decide to up the boost.

 

[Spoolin4Ever]

Yeah ok sounds like ARP's it is, then. I'd be nice to have the option of running 30 lbs later if I want to.

 

[empie1]

Dude, its fine to reuse the manifold studs, dont listen t o him.I agree with not reusing head bolts though.Pretty ambitious going from barley knowing how to change a head gasket to thinking about pushing 30psi...