Proper intallation and function of strut tower bars [Merged 1-7]

[InjenTalon96]

i got a Ractive Strut bar for my car and i was wondering if i installed it right, would the crossmember have to be tight as hell or what.....

 

[Defiant]

I've seen some say it's supposed to be adjusted "outward" so that it's keeping the towers from getting any closer. Sounds odd to me, as it should be a tension member instead of compression. But, that's me.

 

[JohnnyC]

How much does a front upper strut bar improve handling?

And why can I pick one up on ebay for $15, and from an auto parts store for $200 when they're made of the same material.

 

[slow guy]

yeah man, i was just about to post the same thing. i see shit for our 1gs for the front for 9 bucks and rear like 15 bucks. i was interested in buying one. but i wanted to ask first. or shit.. i have alot of metal and tools. how hard would it be to make my own???

 

[MNGSX]

Some of the cheap ones do absolutely nothing.

They flex at the mount or bow in the middle.

Get a RRE bar for your 1g.

I have a neuspeed bar up front right now... It is good too...

I'm waiting on the rear because I'll just brace it when I do the cage.

 

[90DSMTurboFWD]

You WILL feel a difference. however a strut bar is a strut bar. I have one off e-bay and I have to say that I am proud to have only paid 15 bucks for it. well worth the money if you ask me.

You have found a rear bar for less then 60 bucks?! If you did buy it! I have been looking for months and I cant find anything for less then 60

 

[JohnnyC]

I haven't looked to hard for the strut towers in the rear. Where is the bar gonna run? Straight through my trunk?

 

[Ludachris]

If you haven't swapped out your rear swaybar, do it. It'll be a much bigger improvement over a front strut bar. Then go for your rear strut bar.... then maybe a front strut bar. With the understeer these cars have, a front strut bar will have minimal advantages compared to the rear bars. I'd even go with poly suspension bushings before I get a front strut bar.

 

[jtmcinder]

Originally posted by Ludachris
With the understeer these cars have, a front strut bar will have minimal advantages compared to the rear bars.

That doesn't make sense to me. The main purpose of a front STB is to reduce understeer, so the fact that 1Gs have a lot of understeer is an argument in favor of a front STB.

Front STBs reduce understeer by helping the car to maintain outside-wheel camber. They do this by preventing the top end of the strut tower from bowing outward during cornering.

With that said, I agree that the primary mod for reducing understeer is a bigger rear swaybar. But keep in mind that there are two ways to get our pigs to turn: reduce rear grip (by, e.g., overloading the outside rear using a large rear swaybar) and increase front grip (by, e.g., getting lots of front negative static camber and then keeping it, using a front STB and better bushings). And adding grip at one end seems a better approach, in general, than taking away grip at the other end.

- Jtoby

 

[PaulPDX]

Tire pressure is also an important factor in fine tuning understeer/oversteer.

 

[jtmcinder]

Agreed, but this usually takes the "reduce rear grip" approach by over-inflating the rears. On the positive side, it can be done very quickly.

- Jtoby

 

[Siberian]

Originally posted by jtmcinder
Agreed, but this usually takes the "reduce rear grip" approach by over-inflating the rears.

OVERinflating? I always thought the usual autox trick was to UNDERinflate the rears to get it to rotate? I mean, not to the point where they roll off the wheel (saw that once - real ugly), , but less than usual?

It worked that way on my CRX anyway...

 

[PaulPDX]

Overinflating the rear would reduce contact patch... thus reducing traction... thus inducing the tendancy for oversteer.

When you turn hard, weight transfers to the front, if there is inadequate traction at the rear as the rear unweighs, the rear will slide out. This effect is very noticeable on FWD cars. I experienmented with it on my VW GTI VR6 (front end heavy to being with, near 60/40 distribution). The changes in handling was noticeable with just 1 or 2 psi of pressure increase from stock specifications.

 

[90DSMTurboFWD]

Everyone is talking about different drive train layouts. i have found that running less pressure in the front and more in the rear can induce minimal OVERSTEER, which is desirable in small amounts, My car is FWD and this helps when I want to take a corner faster then normal.

I run 29/36 pressure

 

[90DSMTurboFWD]

Originally posted by jtmcinder


With that said, I agree that the primary mod for reducing understeer is a bigger rear swaybar. But keep in mind that there are two ways to get our pigs to turn: reduce rear grip (by, e.g., overloading the outside rear using a large rear swaybar) and increase front grip (by, e.g., getting lots of front negative static camber and then keeping it, using a front STB and better bushings). And adding grip at one end seems a better approach, in general, than taking away grip at the other end.

- Jtoby

What will a larger rear sway (If there even is one) do for a FWD?

 

[Siberian]

Originally posted by PaulPDX
Overinflating the rear would reduce contact patch... thus reducing traction... thus inducing the tendancy for oversteer.

Good point... and yet, underinflating a tire promotes rollover, which also decreases traction. The autox rule, for fronts at least, always seemed to be to add 10 psi or so (over street pressures) to avoid rolling over onto the tire edge. Maybe I was wrong to apply that logic to the rears since they don't have to deal with as much weight... hmmm....

 

[PaulPDX]

What will a larger rear sway (If there even is one) do for a FWD?

Reduce understeer/Augment oversteer.

and yet, underinflating a tire promotes rollover

As with anything subject to laws of physics and nature... there are boundaries within which one can push the limits. The trick is finding the right balance. How much is too much, how little is too little etc.

I personally don't think rear strut bars make that much difference. At least not significant enough to make a difference. In turning, most of the flexing is in the front because as weight transfers forward the front end is seeing more load. The rear has the structure of the chassis to keep it somewhat rigid (especially so in hatchbacks). Most garden variety rear strut bars don't make enough of a solid connection with a chassis to do what they're suppose to anyway. If you really want one that makes a difference, you're better off looking at cages with trigangulated crossmembers in the rear.

For that matter, most garden variety front STBs don't do what they are suppose to do. They still have the pivot points at either end of the bar thus allowing the strut towers a certain degree of movement indipendent of each other. The bars that really do the job are solid bars with no pivot points whatsoever. Manufacturers don't sell and make bars like that because it's hard to guarantee fit for all cars... so, some people weld their bars at the pivots once they have it installed on flat level ground (to avoid preloading). Solid bars are also more time consuming to remove if you need to get the battery out or need to work on the motor.

Another case of consumers screwing themselves with uninformed demand for convenience and styling over function and performance.

 

[ShyBoyRico]

I have the APR Upper front strut bar.I've taken off a few times to see if there was a difference in handling.The bar cost me $200 Shipped, and it was well worth it.The car has better steering and does not feel as flexible. The ends of the bar are huge 8mm allen studs, and the whole bar is billet aluminum.There is NO flex in this bar, which is why I bought it. A lot of bars out there flex way to much.Find a bar that is solid and you will feel a diff.

 

[Crazyd]

Hey Guys,

I just bought my GST It's so frinkin awesome

I tried searching the fourms on how to install the front and rear strut bars for my 2G GST, but wasn't lucky OR probably didn't know how to use it!

How do I install the front and rear strut bars? Do I need to install them professionally by a shop?

Thanks,
CraZy D!

 

[Defiant]

They pretty much just bolt-in. You'll have to chop the covers in the rear, don't make a hash of it. Oh, and the hatshelf may rattle on the rear one, if it does, get a couple of furniture bumpers to put on the underside of the shelf.

Some say to jack up the car so the suspension is hanging while the bars are installed, others say to keep it on the ground and install them in pressure outward instead of tension. So, it apparently doesn't matter.

In the front, the flat part goes over the battery, and the mounts go toward the front of the tower. Close the hood carefully to make sure everything is clear.

Uh... don't short against the battery terminal. Make sure you have your radio code if you need to disconnect it.

 

[Crazyd]

Thanks Defiant ... I appreciate it

 

[PaulPDX]

Originally posted by Defiant
Uh... don't short against the battery terminal.

Yup. You don't want to do that. You can end up welding your wrench to the bar. I've seen it done. Funny in hindsight but sure wasn't funny when it happened to my friend.

 

[sting0004]

I got a cheapo front strut tower bar on Ebay. While installing it I noticed that there is a bolt in the way that attatches to the battery tie-down bracket. Is there a way to remove this bolt? What would I do with the battery tie-down bracket after the bolt is gone? Sorry if this is a dumb question and there is a simple answer. Thanks for any help. -Matt

 

[Mike1992]

Most simply drill a hole through the strut bar bracket

 

[sting0004]

Alright, I'm gonna do that, thanks for the reply