Proper intallation and function of strut tower bars [Merged 1-7]

[dsm1kenobe]

Originally posted by Defiant
Or just jack up the end you're installing on. The question of tension or compression seems unanswered. From an engineering standpoint, you'd want tension: A strut bar isn't a compression component. Particularly the front one, with its nice bend.

I have both on my 2G, and a front on my 1G. I've felt no difference with them. However, the rear does interfere nicely with getting things in and out of the hatch.

You're right in that the front STB during a turning maneuver or launching is under tension, but to say that the STB isn't a compression component is false - the rear STB is in compression during a launch. In general, STBs aid in the prevention of deflection of the chassis in both compression and tension depending on what the car is doing.

I recommend compression for the install as over the years, especially for us 1g-ers, the chassis fatigues and the shock towers move closer together - a little bit of compression in the STBs aids in moving the chassis to its original state.

 

[Defiant]

Interesting ideas. I don't have anything to say you're wrong.

 

[44pirate]

I noticed, when I removed my front one to install some injectors, and took it for a test run the front end felt sloppy or loose. When I got back to the garage I saw I had forgotten to put it back in. To me I felt a difference.

 

[BD1]

Nice, I payed 10 bucks for my rear (same one you have) and 90 for my front (see gallery)

 

[jtmcinder]

Please do the following experiment: Take off the STB and connect a string between the two brackets. Launch as hard as you wish and watch the string. If you are correct that the STB is in compression during a launch, then the string will go slack. My guess is that it will not move at all.

- Jtoby <- uses STB as a harness bar

 

[Melio]

Just bought a front tower bar for 35$ off ebay, for my 92 talon .. hope it doesnt suck

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[nazthug]

what hapened to the real bars?

What happened to nuespeeds bar, it looked awesome?

Does anyone make a tri mount strut bar that actually does something?


I cant believe that after 10 years + of this car, we still dont have a decent option for a nice strut bar, both front and rear.

 

[ECLIPSE4x4]

Well from what car you have listed, it says "non dsm" so it is a little hard to give you any info on what to look for.

 

[Defiant]

The eBay bars don't have brands. That's why they cost $12 instead of $125. They do the same thing, just as well, and are covered by the hood. Which may be why the Neuspeed, Greddy and other fudgeminers aren't selling well enough to merit further development.

 

[nazthug]

that car is gone sorry

i have a 1999 gst 5 speed

im looking into having some custom front/rear bars made for the car, turbo models only, and having something done that doesnt just look bling like ebay crap

First off all, those bars are dumb, they swivel every which way, and i personaly believe in bars that mount somewhere else in addition to the top of the strut towers.

Im looking into having the rear go across and also down into the floor, 4 point.

The front im looking into tying the strut towers and also the control arm bolt, so also a 4 point, 4 bar setup, all welded without any bolts to put them together, i just dont believe in those

wanted to get some input on what was out there and what kind of feedback i would get if i had some prototypes made

(the place that is making these is absolutely top notch, i know the guys personally and they wont make something if it isnt 110% legit and actually works, because this car just seems like it would benefit from them

going from a focus to a 99 gst, man i really started appriciating the structural regidity of the focus, especially with a nice suspension setup, that car was very tight and solid.

the eclipse just seems to be all over the place, and the rear just doesnt seem to have anything at all holding it together, other then the hatch and window,

So thats why i was wondering why the nuespeed one droped out, it looked fairly decent, althought the ones im looking into having made are much beefier.

Who knows, im just in it to get some nice bars because i want them, but if there is a market for them, then i wouldnt mind that either.

 

[nazthug]

here are the ones my buddy made for a customers neon, it was a quick job just to get an idea, and a jig and a design, took about 4 hours to make it but it gives you an idea

also, those who appriciate welding, when you see this guys finished work, you will be super impressed, his welds are the best ive ever seeen.

This bar was a quick mig weld just to throw it together

what do you guys think

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[nazthug]

i am thinking of having a similar one done for the eclipse, but have it a 4 way bar, with 2 more bars coming down into the floor

_____
.\ /.

sort of like that

 

[igs]

Well, when you find a place that makes them let me know. I started a post just like yours a while back and gave up and bought some cheapo ones. The bars are hollow and I can bend it with my hand, .

 

[nazthug]

the place isnt the problem, its the interest

my buddy made this on the side while on break from his main projects, this guy builds some really impressive stuff, he just finished a fully custom truck frame that is gorgeous. He does it all, car parts, industrial parts, home parts(staircases, etc) and also production parts like special tools for mechanics and stands and stuff, awesome stuff, he's the best when it comes to welding and design.

im worried about people just thinking that those cheesy ebay brands are the same, damn those things are retarded. I dont know the DSM crowd that well yet thats why i just wanted to put this out there to see the response, if everyone is down for the ebay cheap bars because they have no where else to waste money, i'll simply make a few bars for myself and enjoy them for what they are.

I ordered a set of ebay ones for fun, cheap, sure, they got me on that, but man oh man oh man are they wack

Poor fitment, cheap, cheap, cheap materials, the endplates might as well be made of paper, they are NOT 1 piece which COMPLETELY defeats the purpose of a bar(HELLO??????????????)

and the bar itself flexes and bends, and twists, BY HAND

I absolutely despise bars with adjustable ends on them, they arent there for adjustment, they are there because the bars are made in CHINA by the thousands, in 2 different sizes, and then just bolted to different endplates to fit different cars

WHy do you guys think they all look the same, exactly the same, even on different cars and different people who sell them under different names?

Its not even worth the $15+20 shipping for each one, they are complete waste

I understand some people get them for looks, nice and shiny

Personally, to me looks means big, beefy, nice welds, multi bars, cool designs. What looks good about a paper thin chrome bar bolted to some black endplates???? To me, its borderline RICE.

I love the raw look of beatiful hand welds, awesome fit and finish and something that actually works.

He's gonna make me 1 for my car, 1999 gst, front or rear, i still have to decide which one first, and see how it works and fits and looks.

The rear i want to tie to 4 points.

The front help me out.

The bolt that comes through that holds the a arm, thats a solid mount right? We were thinking of making a straight bar across to all 3 strut bolts, then have a bar tee off from the main bar and go to that 1 a arm bolt that sticks through.

NOW i like firewall bars too, but on this car, its a joke, sure it looks badass and rigid, but the firewall is paper thin on this car, it will bend and twist long before it does anything positive to help the bar maintain the rest of the car from twisting. So i thought about it and thought against it. I also dont like the idea of drilling the car, i want it to bolt up.

We'll see what happens, if i decide to get one made, i'll let you guys know and see how you like it.

Sorry, im new on here and just recently got the car but immediately got on a mission to improve the handing/rigidity of the car because its alot worse then my old car, 2000 focus(heavily modified, turbo, stand alone, built engine, but it was very solid, UNLIKE the eclipse) This car twists, rattles, moves and just drifts all over the place

Im on a mission to change that

 

[Defiant]

Originally posted by nazthug
and the bar itself flexes and bends, and twists, BY HAND

Hmph. Did you try stretching and compressing it? It's a tension member, not a bending one.

We'll see what happens, if i decide to get one made, i'll let you guys know and see how you like it.

We'd be keen to see it.

Sorry, im new on here and just recently got the car but immediately got on a mission to improve the handing/rigidity of the car

Best of luck in that. Keep us posted.

 

[96'GSspyder]

did you check out REE? they have a nice bar that I'm looking into (first bar seen)

http://www.roadraceengineering.com/eclsuspension.htm

 

[mocfive]

If you really want a beefy front strut tower brace, check out the one they have here

www.machv.com

 

[nazthug]

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where do I begin?

Looks like you guys can use some help, I'll keep you updated

 

[nazthug]

Another thing i noticed

No one makes steel or stainless steel bars anymore, they are all aluminum

RRE makes a decent bar, the bar itself, but the brackets need improvement. Im not here to judge, but they connect at 1 and 1 small point only, and strut tower bars need surface area at the mounts to distribute the force and load, 1 small connection is almost like a swivel point. It just doesnt do too good of a job at keeping things from moving. I got a few surprises coming for you guys. Just trying to figure out which one is the bigger priority, FRONT or REAR????

Do you guys realize what that means?

have people forgot what strut tower braces are made to do?

Does anyone know what aluminum does when put to the test?

Does anyone know what thin aluminum does when put to the test?

This is one major thing i noticed, everyone makes aluminum bars now

And the funniest excuse is " well, its lighter so it makes your car goes faster"

Ouch, thats bad.

Anyway, we know what strut bars should be like, what they do, and which ones work.

I dont believe in aluminum strut bars. If the weight excuse is good enough for you, then aluminum bars are for you. I dont, for one second, believe that that extra 2-3lb is going to make your car any faster.

I'll keep you posted though. I dont settle.

 

[hoffman]

you guys really need to learn how to use google.

http://www.ptuning.com/html/Item-De...ips&ModelYear=1995-1999 All&ModelDesc=Eclipse

http://www.victoryperformance.com/product/Detail.cfm?ProductID=1299

 

[Defiant]

Originally posted by nazthug
Another thing i noticed

No one makes steel or stainless steel bars anymore, they are all aluminum

Here's an idea: mount a pencil on the bar, and on a stable platform below it, paper. Go for a rigorous drive. See how big a mark is made on the paper from the flex.

I don't think DSMs really need strut bars at all.

Still, I suppose it's a fairly harmless fixation.

 

[nazthug]

Originally posted by Defiant
Here's an idea: mount a pencil on the bar, and on a stable platform below it, paper. Go for a rigorous drive. See how big a mark is made on the paper from the flex.

I don't think DSMs really need strut bars at all.

Still, I suppose it's a fairly harmless fixation.

the bars dont just flex that way

when the strut towers "collapse" into each other, the pencil will only move up and down, not making much of a mark.

U guys thing the eclipse is a solid car? If strut bars work on any cars, i definetly think the eclipse will be one of them. Unfortunately, its NOT a very solid car, not even close. Its not anywhere near as tight handling as some other sport hatches, including my old focus. This isnt a complaint, just a department that can use some help.

The car definetly flexes more when i enter driveways then my focus, my friends GTI, my roomates srt4 and my buddies Evo8, mitsubishi definetly steped up with that car, being that they are known for making cars that are cool but kinda flimsy and not very rigid and "together"

I like that feeling of togetherness and i just want to improve that feeling in this car.

If they work, i will let you guys know. We'll see what happens, i just dont like any of the bars out for this car at all.

They are either crappy aluminum that does NOTHING to structural rigidity, or they have more pivot points then they need, which is 0, or their endplates are made of putty

Man this ebay bar i put on, the endplates literally conform to the strut caps on the car, they are so soft, , kinda defeats the purpose of preloading them as well, as you preload them, the end mounts just flex apart, kinda funny almost.

 

[jtmcinder]

The problem with 2G DSMs is torsional stiffness. STBs do jack for this.

- Jtoby

 

[96'GSspyder]

nazthug, you check out this page? http://www.prostreetonline.com/pso/...type=Suspension&producttypesub=Strut/Tie Bars

I like the comptech titanium strut tower brace...but i'm not sure they make that for DSM's? anyway, keep me posted with on your friends development. Perhaps he can make a similar bar like that comptech one for me?

 

[greenmachine97]

so far this is my favorite STB for 2g. i am going to get one when they have them in stock again. If the link doesnt work, just look up a 97 mitsubishi eclipse on the menu at the right side, and go to page 5, and click on the Stress Bars (Sprint Performance Suspension). it is my favorite! any one ever used this or seen it before?

http://www.ptuning.com/html/Item-De...=1995-1999 All Turbo Models&ModelDesc=Eclipse