2G No Start

[Blakedwight4]

Hey there, I have a ‘96 GST and I was driving it to work around 2 weeks ago now, and as I was coming to a stoplight, the tachometer started bouncing up and down, so I pulled over, and the car died on me. I could start it for like half a second and it would die again immediately. I remember a funny burning smell, but couldn’t point out what it was.

It since then will not start at all, and sounds different when trying to crank it. Makes slow whirring sound even when battery is fully charged. I don’t see any spark, but smell fuel. I have also replaced the crank sensor since then, and still no luck. I have read hundreds of forums trying to hunt down the issue, and have yet to find a solution. I need this car back on the road asap, so help would be much appreciated!!!

P.S. when I got the CEL to stay on long enough, I got P0115 and P0110

 

[CKOPOCT]

First thing I would check is the timing belt. Pull the top timing cover and see if the belt is loose, or crank the engine and see if the cams spin. If that doesn't reveal an answer, post a video of what it's doing.

 

[Blakedwight4]

First thing I would check is the timing belt. Pull the top timing cover and see if the belt is loose, or crank the engine and see if the cams spin. If that doesn't reveal an answer, post a video of what it's doing.

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[92AWDHX40]

Check for spark fuel and compression. You need all three the basics. Then get back with us.

 

[Blakedwight4]

Check for spark fuel and compression. You need all three the basics. Then get back with us.

No spark…

 

[92AWDHX40]

Could be several things with that your gonna have to dig in and see.

 

[Blakedwight4]

Could be several things with that your gonna have to dig in and see.

Any suggestions?

 

[92AWDHX40]

Coil ecu

 

[Blakedwight4]

Coil ecu

Did u watch the video I posted showing it attempting to start?

 

[Dericsh]

Did you check the timing belt?

 

[Blakedwight4]

Did you check the timing belt?

Timing belt is intact

 

[DSMPT]

Timing belt is intact

Do you see the cam gears rotating while you are cranking? If not, the timing belt teeth are gone at the crank sprocket and spinning freely... We can't be 100% sure yet, but you may have bent valves already. Upload pics of timing belt side at least let's us see the cam gears position when the engine is off.

 

[Blakedwight4]

Do you see the cam gears rotating while you are cranking? If not, the timing belt teeth are gone at the crank sprocket and spinning freely... We can't be 100% sure yet, but you may have bent valves already. Upload pics of timing belt side at least let's us see the cam gears position when the engine is off.

Cam gears rotate for sure. I’m trying to upload a video but it’s not letting me

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[DSMPT]

Cam gears rotate for sure.

Did you see it by eyes? After stop cranking by turning the key off, where do you see the cam dowel pin position? The position must be at around 1:30, 4:30, 7:30 or 10:30. If you see the dowel pins are at around 12, 3, 6 or 9 o'clock, probably the timing is wrong or you have bend valves. We are asking you to check the belt because we hear like no compression from the video you uploaded.

 

[Blakedwight4]

Did you see it by eyes? After stop cranking by turning the key off, where do you see the cam dowel pin position? The position must be at around 1:30, 4:30, 7:30 or 10:30. If you see the dowel pins are at around 12, 3, 6 or 9 o'clock, probably the timing is wrong or you have bend valves. We are asking you to check the belt because we hear like no compression from the video you uploaded.

1:30, 4:30, 7:30, and 10:30 seems about right

 

[chrysler kid]

ok lets start over


the car is cranking very slowly in the video, make sure the battery is fully charged and the serpentine belt is intact and the car didn't die because the alternator lost power

if the car has no spark the coil or ignition control module could be bad

you can find the testing procedure with a volt meter to test the coil on this website Www.charm.li the ignition control module could be bad and there is also a testing procedure with that. I believe the car gets tach signal from the ignition module so with the tach jumping before it died the module could be bad

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[CKOPOCT]

The lack of "check THIS" can be bothersome, but no-starts are a bear to diagnose from behind a keyboard because there are so damn many things that can be the culprit. Without a clear list of specific symptoms, things checked with results, and a lot of back and forth dialogue, it's often luck (or damn good intuition) that someone guesses correctly.

Agree that the crank speed seems slow - but that could be because you've cranked it many times trying to get it to start. The crank process also seems off - the sound shouldn't be as "smooth," which can point to a loss of compression. At this point it would be very easy to start chasing one good idea after another, getting frustrated as good ideas turn out to be ghosts. @chrysler kid is right on with the battery/alternator, as well as the spark checks as these are both potential culprits, and not unlikely ones. If they turn out to be dead ends, best thing is to take a step back and run through the diagnostics process.

Fuel, spark, compression, timing. Check for each in the order of symptoms and ease. You can add crank speed to that, but you'll likely have that one conquered by this point after following chrysler kid's steps. Strongly recommend not making assumptions as you go through diagnosing. For example, the t-belt may be in tact and you may see the cam gears spinning, but that doesn't mean that the timing tensioner didn't fail and allow the timing belt to slip a tooth or five - bent valves. A rare thing, but it has happened, and a compression test will verify if things are good or not.

Bear with us as we help you as best we can without being able to put our hands and ears on the car.

Have you checked/worked the "how to diagnose a no-start" tree here: https://www.dsmtuners.com/threads/how-to-diagnose-a-no-start.217951/

 

[luv2rallye]

Ok, looking at your posts you sound confident that there's no spark - is that right?
Have you actually tested this to verify?
For no spark testing you can either:
a) Remove 1 spark plug (leave others in and they must stay connected to complete high voltage circuit - 2 plugs fire at once), clamp its thread casing to the head, plug its spark cable on, turn over engine and watch for spark on it.

b) Or remove 1 spark plug (leave others in and they must stay connected to complete high voltage circuit - 2 plugs fire at once). Standing on an insulated rubber mat and wearing rubber gloves, insert long screw driver into spark cable end so it's touching inside wire, hold screwdriver shank within 1/4" of head. Turn over engine and watch for spark to jump there. Varying distance can tell you spark strength.

Then if no spark:
c) Try swapping coil with a known good one (even if coil resistance is good that doesn't guarantee it is good).

d) Try swapping PTU (power transistor unit) with a known good one.

e) Test PTU: https://www.dsmtuners.com/threads/how-to-test-the-power-transistors.229419/

 

[Blakedwight4]

Swapped Transitor and Coil Pack, still no spark
@luv2rallye

 

[luv2rallye]

Ok. Only things left are ECU, CAS, CPS, and wiring. Perhaps the smell you mentioned is a capacitor inside the ECU going bad (often rotten egg smell).

 

[Blakedwight4]

Ok. Only things left are ECU, CAS, CPS, and wiring. Perhaps the smell you mentioned is a capacitor inside the ECU going bad (often rotten egg smell).

So I can get it to start after cranking for a while and fluttering gas pedal a bunch. When it starts tho, it sounds unusual. It sounds like it’s at around 4k rpm’s, but it only shows it at 2k rpm’s. It also seems like accessory belts are moving twice as fast, and engine is shaking a little more than usual.

Initially, it will have throttle response up to 5k is the most I did, but after letting it idle for a little, I got back in and it would only jump up 200 rpm’s past idle. Also I can only get it to start like 2x in a 4-5hr window by doing this. New injectors, new fuel pump, new spark plugs, new MFI/fuel relays, fuel filter now.

Also when I’m trying to crank it, it kinda sounds like it’s bogging or sputtering, and wants to start really bad.

 

[chrysler kid]

post a current picture of your engine bay so we can verify there are no vacuum leaks

 

[Blakedwight4]

post a current picture of your engine bay so we can verify there are no vacuum leaks

Update, I got it to start. Ecu was bad, sent it in to get it fixed. Changed spark plugs again and fresh gas. Got car to start and idle was not too bad. New tps, iac, and alternator as well. Now the issue is intermittent ignition fuse popping. I drove the car like 5 blocks when I got it started. It still felt kinda low on power. It died on me when I threw it into 2nd. I kept replacing fuse and it would pop immediately when I cranked it. Today, however, I wiggled every wire I could find around and looked for bad wires as well, and got it to start. It was idling very poorly, and throttle response was very low too. I gave it some throttle and it struggled and then died and popped the fuse again. I am at a total loss rn…

 

[Blakedwight4]

Update, I got it to start. Ecu was bad, sent it in to get it fixed. Changed spark plugs again and fresh gas. Got car to start and idle was not too bad. New tps, iac, and alternator as well. Now the issue is intermittent ignition fuse popping. I drove the car like 5 blocks when I got it started. It still felt kinda low on power. It died on me when I threw it into 2nd. I kept replacing fuse and it would pop immediately when I cranked it. Today, however, I wiggled every wire I could find around and looked for bad wires as well, and got it to start. It was idling very poorly, and throttle response was very low too. I gave it some throttle and it struggled and then died and popped the fuse again. I am at a total loss rn…

Also the alternator belt has popped off 3x during the last three months, and I have ensured it is tensioned very well

 

[Blakedwight4]

Update, I got it to start. Ecu was bad, sent it in to get it fixed. Changed spark plugs again and fresh gas. Got car to start and idle was not too bad. New tps, iac, and alternator as well. Now the issue is intermittent ignition fuse popping. I drove the car like 5 blocks when I got it started. It still felt kinda low on power. It died on me when I threw it into 2nd. I kept replacing fuse and it would pop immediately when I cranked it. Today, however, I wiggled every wire I could find around and looked for bad wires as well, and got it to start. It was idling very poorly, and throttle response was very low too. I gave it some throttle and it struggled and then died and popped the fuse again. I am at a total loss rn…

@luv2rallye