Lower valve spring seat conflicting with ARP head stud nut

[Turbo Shogun]

Is this normal? WTF I'm guessing the only solution is to take a grinder to the outside rim of ARP nuts so they can clear ...

Here's a few pictures.

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As you can see here, the lower spring seat is in the way of the nut. There were a couple close calls, but I think this one is the only one that doesn't fit.

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The nut I tried to thread in (by hand using a 14mm thin-wall long socket). As you can see, the lower spring seat took a sliver of metal out of the outer rim of the nut. I had a nice little steel shaving I had to fish out of there with a magnet ...

Anyone else have this kind of problem?

 

[steve]

ARP sells smaller nuts to solve thie problem and clear the spring seat. I can't say what impact grinding your existing nut to cleal will have on strength and clamping.

Steve

 

[TSIfreek]

What springs are you using??

 

[Auto RS T]

I like steves advice but I thought I would add some more

It may be possible to lift the head on the studs to where the stud lines up with the ARP washer and some threads poke through. Start the nut and lower the head. That may clear the outer edge on the nut, you could try the more troublesome nuts this way too.

 

[TSIfreek]

Just a thought. Can you pry the spring out of the way alittle to clear the bottom of the nut when installing??

 

[Turbo Shogun]

What springs are you using??

I'm using the HKS Ti valve springs.

I wasn't aware ARP sold smaller nuts to clear. Do I just call them and ask for those, or can I do an exchange, or something?

I was thinking about lifting the head off again to maneuver the nut in there, then screw in a few threads before putting the head back on the block, but that presents an issue of removal, in that I probably won't be able to get the nut out (god forbid, this better be the last time I tear this goddamn motor apart ) of it's place should I need to.

Some of the other nuts are DAMN close to the valvespring, though. It kind of worries me a little, but they're not going anywhere, but it is a TIGHT fight in some instances. And I don't know if I can try prying the spring out of the way.

It's not the spring per-se, but the lower spring SEAT itself that's contacting the nut.

Thanks for the advice guys.

- edit -

What do you guys think about using some of my OEM head bolts in some of these trouble areas? You think I can get away with that or am I just begging for another engine rebuild?

- edit #2

Auto RS-T, I see what you're saying. I can probably get the nuts out the same way I got them in (durrrrrhhhhhh - I got my washers in there the same way). I will try that tomorrow, but I don't know if I'll have room for a socket ... Hopefully nothing'll bind when I get my cams to actuate those springs.

 

[95blackGsTurbo]

Never mix and match. Use all ARP

 

[steve]

I wasn't aware ARP sold smaller nuts to clear. Do I just call them and ask for those, or can I do an exchange, or something?

Best to call them. Everyone who has this problem should call them. I don't know if the problem is with the spring seats or the bolts but it happens enough that I remember it and I'be never heard of somebody having interference with the deats and the stock bolts. That may be due to nobody using stock head bolts

Steve

 

[Turbo Shogun]

Well, I got that one nut in.

The head tends to shift about a little on the studs, so all I did was shift the head over to the right (probably about 1mm). Cleared the spring seat.

I just lifted that end of the head a little higher than the other one and it went in. I threaded it just enough to clear the spring seat just in case I need to lift up on the head again. Man, I'm glad I'm doing this on a stand and not in the car.

Thanks for the help guys, I'll go see if this little trick works for all of them.

 

[wishihadatalon]

Well, I got that one nut in.

The head tends to shift about a little on the studs, so all I did was shift the head over to the right (probably about 1mm). Cleared the spring seat.

I just lifted that end of the head a little higher than the other one and it went in. I threaded it just enough to clear the spring seat just in case I need to lift up on the head again. Man, I'm glad I'm doing this on a stand and not in the car.

Thanks for the help guys, I'll go see if this little trick works for all of them.

Wait so your head shifted when it was on the dowels? That is not good. I had the nut problem thing with my car. I just lifted the head a little bit and put the nut in place.

 

[biglady112]

Um, just pry the spring out of the way. There are 3 springs on both 6 bolts and 7 bolts that give you trouble. Stock springs, crower's, HKS, FP duals and any spring will do this. It is the nut that is too big. Just use a big screwdriver or pry bad and move it over. Never had a problem doing this. Even on a GT42 powered car.

Steven

 

[wishihadatalon]

Um, just pry the spring out of the way. There are 3 springs on both 6 bolts and 7 bolts that give you trouble. Stock springs, crower's, HKS, FP duals and any spring will do this. It is the nut that is too big. Just use a big screwdriver or pry bad and move it over. Never had a problem doing this. Even on a GT42 powered car.

Steven

wtf does the turbo have to do with the valve train?

 

[GVR4592]

wtf does the turbo have to do with the valve train?

At least he didn't blame it on altitude this time.

 

[Spoolin98]

Hey guys, I hate to bring back a dead thread, but I just ran into this same problem myself. Here's a link to my thread I started about my dreadful experience.
http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=248667
When metal shavings started to come off the nut, I just kept tightening it little by little. Then I would back the nut off and clean out the shavings and tighten it on again little by little, and so on and so on. I did this till the nut was shaved down enough to fit by the spring/seat, it didn't seem to do any damage to the spring/seat and the nut shaved fairly easily. It took off minimal shavings, I doubt it will affect clamping force. Any thoughts on this?

 

[burntheblobs]

All you have to do is lift the cylinder head off the engine block untill the top of the head studs are flush with the cylinder head. Then you can drop the arp washers in place without destroying your valve springs.

 

[98TsiAWD]

My head had this same problem, crower springs and retainers. I did the probly the worst thing you could do, just put it on and a tiny bit of spring shaved off.

But on the other hand this head has been running strong for 12k miles since then, and seen 9k rpms a few times, 8500 ALOT.

As far as the washers, its best to lay them all in place, then put the head over the studs (but thats something you learn with prior experience). The first time, I actually grinded on the side of one of the washers to get it on there. And again, its still there and no issues. But I wouldnt recommend doing what I did by forcing the nut on and grinding the washer.

 

[Spoolin98]

Let me clarify something, the washers had nothing to do with my situation. I put them in the head before putting the head over the studs. It was just the nut that gave me a problem. I already installed the nut, and the spring/seat already shaved metal off the nut. No metal came off the spring or seat. Thanks for your help.