H1c-E85-27psi only 341hp

[rr06rs]

Well bad news today the turbo stopped making any boost it needs a rebuild. My guess the 2g return line not sure. Oil is at 75psi at redline and 15 at idle. I'm wondering if this was part of the problem too besides the tune. I think even with the bad tune at 27psi it should of been at 400hp.

Sorry to hear that. Although, I have to say to all those that had something to say about my statement about puttin on the turbo w/o a rebuild....TOLD YA SOOOO!!! jk That's not directed toward you, btw. Hit up Austin at Turbo Lab and if you can't find a decent tune locally, hit up tscomptuned.NET: We find your hidden power.. He's HUGE in the EVO community and does the best job at remote tuning that I know of. I've seen him find more power on even a custom Buschur tune and it was still safe as anything.

 

[Tiki2777]

Well bad news today the turbo stopped making any boost it needs a rebuild. My guess the 2g return line not sure. Oil is at 75psi at redline and 15 at idle. I'm wondering if this was part of the problem too besides the tune. I think even with the bad tune at 27psi it should of been at 400hp.

WOW, a 2g oil return with a HOLSET>? Really? I'm sorry but am I the only one who sees this as a horrible idea with the oiling needs that holsets require? God, you are either going to be really lucky that only the turbo died and not the motor after that tune.

Stuff like this with tune shops makes me sick. I hope you can sort this mess out. Just take your time with things and double check everything (also be conservative like others have mentioned) Good luck man, we're all here to help and support. > for you sir.

 

[bastarddsm]

WOW, a 2g oil return with a HOLSET>? Really?

Lol, its more than likely fine. I used to run a 1g oil drain on my HX35, and had no issues.




OP, what is your exhaust like? If it's restrictive, it could be causing problems.

 

[nfernotalon]

Lol, its more than likely fine. I used to run a 1g oil drain on my HX35, and had no issues.




OP, what is your exhaust like? If it's restrictive, it could be causing problems.

Yea I've seen a few people run the 2g line with no problems that why I went with it. All I have for exhaust is a 7in long and 3in wide o2 housing . Turbo was used maybe that was it. I might lower the pressure to 70 and probably send it off to Justin.

 

[bastarddsm]

Yea I've seen a few people run the 2g line with no problems that why I went with it. All I have for exhaust is a 7in long and 3in wide o2 housing . Turbo was used maybe that was it. I might lower the pressure to 70 and probably send it off to Justin.

Make sure you have it on the filtered side of the housing. The 1/8" pipe ports where the sending units go, are not filtered. I'd also not restrict the oil going to it at all. You will not kill the turbo with too much oil. It make smoke, but you will not hurt it.


Also you may need more exhaust on your car. It's possible you are sucking in exhuast gas.

 

[DSMsOwnYourV8]

Yea I've seen a few people run the 2g line with no problems that why I went with it. All I have for exhaust is a 7in long and 3in wide o2 housing . Turbo was used maybe that was it. I might lower the pressure to 70 and probably send it off to Justin.

You can't think that way though... there's a thread on here about oil drains being too small, and just because a couple of people have done it, doesn't mean it's the standard. The standard is -12 an lines per holset. If you go another way, you definitely need a way to monitor your oil pressure at ALL times to make sure it's in spec.

When you rebuild/replace the turbo, let me know if you want some help with your return lines setup. I still have pics of my setup and could refer you to the places where I got mine.

 

[livedsm4g63]

Id also not restrict the oil going to it at all. You will not kill the turbo with too much oil. It make smoke, but you will not hurt it.

I would love to see something to back that up.

 

[bastarddsm]

I would love to see something to back that up.

Show one example where high turbo oil pressure killed a turbo? It doesn't happen.

Extremely high oil pressure in a bearing can cause the oil to burn, but were talking 1000psi not 80. There is no way in hell running 100psi instead of 80 is going to kill the bearings. It just won't happen.

Secondly, there are no seals to "blow". They are solid metal rings that resemble a piston ring. They do not seal to anything. They just act as a mechanical barrier to keep the oil from coming right out the sides. The turbo relies on positive pressure in the compressor and exhaust housings and gravity to keep the oil inside the chra. So if you manage to "blow" a turbo seal, you've done the impossible, and you should buy a lottery ticket.

The only way oil can leak out of good turbo is if the oil drain backs up and the oil level reaches the bottom of the seals. You'd need a severely kinked drain line for that to happen, or something stupid small like a -8.

I used to run a 1g oil rain with my HY35, then one day the hose got soft, kinked and it started smoking. I replaced the hose, and miraculously it quit smoking. I also feed it un-restricted from the ofh with a 1/4" line.

 

[livedsm4g63]

Hmmm I'm going to do some more research on it. Thanks for the advice though. I could see the drain being an issue. I actually just went through that on my turbo. The stock line had a hairline crack in it, thus spraying oil everywhere under my car. I switched to a -10an drain and goodbye smoke.

But as for too much oil pressure. Tell me why some are rated for lower pressures. And when you put a higher pressure to them, we see cases of failure. Excluding the drain of corse. I could see back up causing issues.

Hm never mind I think I answered my own question. Bigger oil drain as you stated. Haha, what a few minutes of thinking does.

 

[bastarddsm]

Yeah, I have yet to see a failure from too much oil. On the pull truck I tune, we run over 100psi to a hx60 that makes 70psi boost. Last years turbine looked like new still after 50 passes!

Anyway were getting ot, and I'd really like to see this guy get his car rippin. I'm just figuring out what was keeping me from getting over the 500whp mark. Lots of stupid little shit.

 

[DSMsOwnYourV8]

There's an entire thread on this discussion:

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/tur...turbo-users-your-oil-drain-may-too-small.html

 

[nfernotalon]

Finally decided to take the turbo apart and I highly doubt its the return line theyre the exact same size 3/4 of an inch..

I might rebuild it or move on from holsets, everything was on spec according to holset not sure.

 

[JusMX141]

WOW, a 2g oil return with a HOLSET>? Really? I'm sorry but am I the only one who sees this as a horrible idea with the oiling needs that holsets require? God, you are either going to be really lucky that only the turbo died and not the motor after that tune.

Yes, really. It's 100% better than the 10AN aftermarket drains sold which are too small and can kink if you don't have the angle of the fittings absolutely perfect.

You will not kill the turbo with too much oil. It make smoke, but you will not hurt it.

If oil can enter into the exhaust, then exhaust can enter into the cartridge under boost. This burns and dries out the turbine-side journal bearing, and the lack of oil to protect from the extreme heat will cause the turbo to fail.

It's tough to comprehend, but I've seen more than one turbo come in with a completely toasted turbine-side journal bearing and not a scratch on the compressor-side bearing, so zero sign of lack of oil or oil contamination. These turbos will also have a major amount of oil coking behind the heat shield.

 

[DSMsOwnYourV8]

Finally decided to take the turbo apart and I highly doubt its the return line theyre the exact same size 3/4 of an inch..

I might rebuild it or move on from holsets, everything was on spec according to holset not sure.

Did you buy it used or new? Maybe you just got a bad used turbo. Seems like the best way to go would be to have it rebuilt - likely form someone on this site - at much cheaper than going a different route.

 

[DSMsOwnYourV8]

Finally decided to take the turbo apart and I highly doubt its the return line theyre the exact same size 3/4 of an inch..

I might rebuild it or move on from holsets, everything was on spec according to holset not sure.

Did you buy it used or new? Maybe you just got a bad used turbo. Seems like the best way to go would be to have it rebuilt - likely form someone on this site - at much cheaper than going a different route.

Well that's exactly what happened to my turbo. Bought it used from someone off of craigslist, didn't rebuild it before slapping it on, and it went out on me going down the track. Big mistake.

I'm going to have mine rebuilt. I hope you do the same, so we can see that car make the power that it should've made with a good working turbo.

 

[MY1GDSM]

Isn't this getting a bit off topic? This left anything Dyno related about 10-15 posts back.... .

 

[nfernotalon]

Isn't this getting a bit off topic? This left anything Dyno related about 10-15 posts back.... .

I dont think so, theyre possibilities of my low dyno numbers, plus nobody is complaining.

 

[MY1GDSM]

I just mean that the discussion would be better suited to another forum for that topic... But, what ever...

 

[DSMsOwnYourV8]

I just mean that the discussion would be better suited to another forum for that topic... But, what ever...

When he gets the turbo rebuilt, and re-tuned properly, it will be a good bump and a solid reference for people moving forward.

Thanks for your contributions though. It's much appreciated!

 

[nfernotalon]

Little update I took the engine out to do a full rebuild with forged internals today, first about the clutch Im surprised it was still holding up all the pads were almost broken off on both sides.

Number 3 piston had a broken ring land in 3 pieces. Crank was fine along with everything else the block is getting cleaned and honed at the machine shop monday.

Still havent decided what turbo but its probably going to be an h1c with an hx40 wheel up grade maybe a batmowheel.

 

[livedsm4g63]

Those wheels are sick! What kind of money would that run you?

 

[nfernotalon]

Those wheels are sick! What kind of money would that run you?

Talk to Austin he quoted me 400 I believe for the batmowheel.

 

[turboglenn]

WOW, a 2g oil return with a HOLSET>? Really? I'm sorry but am I the only one who sees this as a horrible idea with the oiling needs that holsets require? God, you are either going to be really lucky that only the turbo died and not the motor after that tune.

Stuff like this with tune shops makes me sick. I hope you can sort this mess out. Just take your time with things and double check everything (also be conservative like others have mentioned) Good luck man, we're all here to help and support. > for you sir.

Hey now, I use a 2g return cut in half with a garrett t3/4 flangeand fitting on turbo cnnecting them with rubber hose, it's just as large as some of the AN setups are internally (easily the same as -10) and doesn't cost 125 bucks to make like AN one does (and that's the cheap end, some fittings in the -10/12 size are 50 bucks each and then you need the fitting that attach to them so you cna easily put aalmost 200 bucsk into an AN style return thats no better than what you can make with the parts i used )

what matters is oil volume going in and it being not only enough but having enough return line to let it drain efficiently.. You know my car, and i'm not rigging or leaving anything to chance on it or i just won't do it and wait till i can do it right. but the holset oiling mistique is so far out there these days no wonder half the people who want themn won't run them.. the only important parts are not too high of pressure, but over 30 on load, and being able to drain what goes in.. Plus the holsets have such a small hole internally that feeding themt too much volume is almost impossible unless youre feeding atpressures above 100psi

Just dont' feed them from head location, i think a lot of people who've had drain issues didn't address the feed problem as well as they should have, I run -4 unrestricted to mine off the OFH and use the 2g drain with no problems at all

 

[50trimgst]

Any updates??