Ground Control CoilOVers

[g0tEclipseD]

Anyone using them? Opinions? Experiences?

Im thinking of running them with KYB AGX's

Thanks

ERic

 

[kiakarimi]

wow, if you searched that you would fine SO many results that answer your EXACT question

 

[g0tEclipseD]

wow. if you werent a dick, you could have provided me a link or just told me.

dumbass.

 

[EclipseDuDeGST]

wouldnt it be faster and easier to just give him the answer rather than ripping on him?

 

[Ludachris]

Neither response here was appropriate. Next time I'd appreciate if you both would refrain from being a smart ass here on our site. kiakarimi, you obviously missed the portion of the reply box that says not to flame people for not searching... and g0tEclipseD, you missed the part of the rules that says not to respond to flamebait posts.

Now, to answer the question that was originally asked - I have a set of Ground Controls. I am using them with KYB AGX in the rear and GR2 in the front. Neither shock is really ideal for the spring rate of the Ground Control kit. For best results, you should opt for the Konis, as their shorter travel is better for the application. However, if you have to save the money, AGXs will be better than the GR2s. Personally, I'd say go with GC and Konis, or just save up for some true coilovers like Tein or JIC. The only real reason to go with any coilover is for hard driving or occasional track/autox use. If you don't plan to do any of that, just get a set of lowering springs with AGXs and save yourself a lot of money. Height adjustability alone is pretty overrated.

 

[jtmcinder]

Originally posted by Ludachris
...you obviously missed the portion of the reply box that says not to flame people for not searching...

Chris -

It's your sandbox, but this is the one policy that I would change. I take a lot of time trying to make my posts informative and relatively easy to read. There is no way that I'm going to repeat the process every other day because some bozo couldn't be bothered to search. And I'm not really in the mood (most of the time) to perform the search and paste in the pointers to the previous threads.

Going farther, I think that people who are too lazy to do a search deserve a slap. And I think that a few clear and public slaps would help prevent others from being lazy, as well. Humans don't just learn through operant conditioning; they can also learn by seeing other people being conditioned.

But, as I said, it's your sandbox and my plan is to try to play by your rules. Therefore, I try to ignore repeated question unless and until someone answers it incorrectly.

- Jtoby

 

[Siberian]

Originally posted by Ludachris
The only real reason to go with any coilover is for hard driving or occasional track/autox use.

Coilovers also guarantee you'll (eventually) be happy with your ride height - even if you never adjust them again

 

[Ludachris]

Originally posted by jtmcinder
Chris -

It's your sandbox, but this is the one policy that I would change. I take a lot of time trying to make my posts informative and relatively easy to read. There is no way that I'm going to repeat the process every other day because some bozo couldn't be bothered to search. And I'm not really in the mood (most of the time) to perform the search and paste in the pointers to the previous threads.

Going farther, I think that people who are too lazy to do a search deserve a slap. And I think that a few clear and public slaps would help prevent others from being lazy, as well. Humans don't just learn through operant conditioning; they can also learn by seeing other people being conditioned.

But, as I said, it's your sandbox and my plan is to try to play by your rules. Therefore, I try to ignore repeated question unless and until someone answers it incorrectly.

- Jtoby

We can discuss this offline or in the Site Feedback forum in an effort not to take away from this thread... I'll PM you my response.

 

[14.5 drift]

are they streetable? I have lots of potholes around me so, with a pair of konis will we (me and my car) make it through with out any damage?

 

[Dallas J]

Koni's are stiff and the whole streetable factor is really on how cushy you want your ride. My friend got GC's with 550f/450r springs and koni's and I love the ride. It can get a little bumpy on rough roads, but it hold awsomly in the turns.
My GC/koni setup is on its way.

-Dallas J

 

[jtmcinder]

I've said this before, I know....

If you get the replacement upper front plates from GC (to get even more travel than what the Konis give), DO NOT USE THE LITTLE BLACK UPPER SHOCK BUSHINGS THAT GC SENDS YOU. These will kill your shocks.

- Jtoby

 

[kiakarimi]

Originally posted by g0tEclipseD
wow. if you werent a dick, you could have provided me a link or just told me.

dumbass.

I'm not a dick, nor am i a dumbass, and my post was not a flame. I'm simply directing your attention to a resource you quite obviously overlooked on this forum which could be just as easily used to answer your question. And this is not an attempt to add to the flamewar, i'm just letting everyone know my intention was not to offend.

 

[14.5 drift]

Originally posted by Dallas J
Koni's are stiff and the whole streetable factor is really on how cushy you want your ride. My friend got GC's with 550f/450r springs and koni's and I love the ride. It can get a little bumpy on rough roads, but it hold awsomly in the turns.
My GC/koni setup is on its way.

-Dallas J

but when you hit a bump in a hard turn do you bounce across the lane? And does the car have alot of rattles now? Are these cars known for rattling apart? Just asking, I havn't heard any thing so...

 

[kiakarimi]

Originally posted by 14.5 drift
but when you hit a bump in a hard turn do you bounce across the lane? And does the car have alot of rattles now? Are these cars known for rattling apart? Just asking, I havn't heard any thing so...

It can be bouncy but not THAT bouncy. At first i had both my front and rear Konis dampening turned up all the way, and something like what you were talking about would happen, like the car bouncing through rough turns. But then i turned the back down a tiny bit and it doesn't do it anymore. The ride is kind of stiff but definately tolerable, and it all depends on your taste. I enjoy having a stiff ride because i'm driving a sports car and its supposed to be stiff and handle well.

 

[jtmcinder]

I would not set a Koni to be within a half-turn of full stiff on the street.

- Jtoby

 

[kiakarimi]

jtoby, do you think its bad for me to have my fronts up all the way?

 

[jtmcinder]

Bad? No. Unless you have GC plates with those rock-hard bushings, you're probably not hurting anything. It's just giving you a bumpier ride with little to no gain.

I also found the best handling with our setup at 3/4 off in the front and 1/2 or 1/4 off in the rear, depending on surface.

- Jtoby

 

[MNGSX]

I just installed mine...


In fact it was too dark out for me to play around with setting heights exactly...

It's KYB AGX's... Unlike what VFAQ says about KYB's Vs coni's with GC's you don't use the spring perches that come on the KYB's. You knock of the KYB perches (just pressed on anyway) and just use an internal stop ring like the GC's for koni...

I cut alot off the bump stops up front.. I also have my own upper plate I made.... It uses the stock style bushings but moves the shock rod end up in the frame.. So bump travel is just like the shortened koni's on std mounts... I'm running the bushings from my ES master kit.

I have ST sway bars front and rear and most of the ES master kit in.... It's kind of a pain... I do a bit at a time... Honestly installing the entire bushing kit is harder than just doing the coil overs...

I always thought the rear sat a bit high so that may get droped a bit more than the front...

Oh well I'll know more tomarrow....

 

[14.5 drift]

sweet, let us know

 

[jtmcinder]

Originally posted by MNGSX
I always thought the rear sat a bit high so that may get droped a bit more than the front...

The car will handle better with the tail in the air. I call this "stink-bug" mode.

- Jtoby

 

[MNGSX]

Originally posted by jtmcinder
The car will handle better with the tail in the air. I call this "stink-bug" mode.

- Jtoby

I think that depends on what handeling traits you are looking for and the weight distrubution of the car..... Like transitional moves... Load the front a bit.... There is alot to suspension tuning... For skid pad numbers and sweepers leveler may be better... Also a given swaybar, shock and spring rate combo may not need any help and in fact lowering the rear a bit may produce a more balanced car... I'll have to see... I have'nt put any time on the new suspension with the new sways and the new rubber baby buggy bumpers (ES Bushings)completely installed either...

If it were an all out auto-x car I'd have tein flex or something.... It is probably going to be a good drag car with street manners that can also do alright at the auto-x...


GC VFAQ

The only change with the AGX's is to knock off the perches and slide the collar down on the shock just like the Konis...

I got my GC's used and they said they were for KYB's... They did'nt drop down on the shocks perch like this guy said... I looked at the perch and notcied it was just pressed on so I wacked it towards the shock rod with the handle end of a big nut driver... (a small hammer would suffice) Pop.... off it went and the collars slid right on.... There were two different sized adapter bushings since the front and rear shocks are different diameters... The bushing goes on the shock and the collar bottoms out 3/4 of the way down on the bushing. You will need to sand/scrape some of that paint dip of the area where the bushing fit so they will drop down all the way.

Ended up looking just like this except red not yellow...

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Also see this stupid rubber cap?

You must be logged in to view this image or video.

If you have ever driven in a nasty climate you are in for a treat...

It just trapped moisture in there... The rear upper mount was rusted much nastier than the front.... I cleaned it up but for something that high on the chassis and enclosed it was a shocker...

Toss those caps and dril a small hole in the plastic outer cover just big enough for the adj tool... Small sloted scredriver....

I usually have room in the garage but furniture and stuff was displaced there from a remodel... So I'm wrenching in the great outdoors...

I went out with the flood light on and fiddled a bit... The ft pass side was way too low... I just matched the other side for now... I have my pointer finger wheel gap on both front sides now... I may bring that up to a full inch... I'll see how it drives.. The upper control arm was'nt level but not pointed up that much either.

In the back I have about 2.5-3 fingers with a ton of adjustment left on the collars..

As for upper shock bushings just run OE or the energy suspension ones.

The guys at ES must be smart... Their shock bushings are made of poly but they used a different formula.. softer.. than their control arm and sway bar bushings.. Possibly only slightly harder than OE but IMHO they are the same stiffness as the OE mounts but definately a longer lasting material than OE... They are solid as in lacking the grove that is in the bottom half of the shock bushing... It seems they were thinking when they came up with them...


...

 

['96_Talon_TSi]

Originally posted by jtmcinder
I've said this before, I know....

If you get the replacement upper front plates from GC (to get even more travel than what the Konis give), DO NOT USE THE LITTLE BLACK UPPER SHOCK BUSHINGS THAT GC SENDS YOU. These will kill your shocks.

- Jtoby

not to jack the thread...

I;m thinking of going with the GD/Koni setup this summer. You're saying to get the upper front plates from koni, as opposed to the GC ones that come with the springs?

 

[MNGSX]

He is saying that if you use the GC upper plate to not use the bushings that come with it...

Koni does not make a plate just shocks...

The GC upper mount they are talking about is an optional accessory..

They can be installed without it but travel is limited..


I'd just get the collars and adjustable perch rings from GC and run hypercoils...


I got my GC set used and cheap...

One problem... One front spring seems to be a bit saggy... I can adjust it level but that is just a band aid.. I'm going to go with stiffer hypercoils for the front.


Update

Anyone looking into doing coilovers via a GC route...

1. Get GC perches and collars...
2. Get hypercoils or QA1 springs.

The ERS's blow...

QA1 is local for me... It looks like I'm going to get some progressive rate QA1 springs...

QA1

 

[jtmcinder]

Originally posted by MNGSX
He is saying that if you use the GC upper plate to not use the bushings that come with it...

Exactly. Those bushings are way too stiff and don't allow the shock to pivot. Think of them as "anti-pillowballs."

The one thing that I would disagree with in MNGSX' post is the suggestion of Teins for autoXing. We never see surfaces that are as smooth as a Japanese Gymkhana lot, so we cannot run the levels of compression that Teins force you to have when you crank up the rebound. They would have to revalved. Therefore, I'd say that Konis are a much better choice.

- Jtoby

 

[MNGSX]

Yes what he said

All I know is what I have was affordable and better than stock...

Good enough for building a mostly drag car that can handle IMHO...