2G Evo 3 16g Help?

[RockSolidGST]

Alright guys i know this is KNOWN problem of these turbos. I did all the porting thats reccommended. to prevent creep. As of right now the wastegate is hooked directly to the compressor housing. Car will hold 9-10 psi till about 5,500, then all of a sudden it spikes way the hell up to 18+.

My SAFC was defective so I had to take my 550's out as well as the SAFC. I have all other supporting mods. AFPR , pump etc.

Is this normal of the Evo3 turbo or am I missing something here?

My 2nd question is on the SAFC 2, I would set my fuel trims, free rev to 1.5k , 2k 3k everything would be perfect. Idles perfect. Then as sooooon as I go for a ride, 3-5min later, AF Ratio Shoots to 17.1+. Car go's super lean and starts to run like death. So I repeat the process, same thing happens. Logger is telling me too lean, while my wideband is reading 17.1afr. So I pulled the 550's out put the 450's in, and zero out the SAFC and i got the same problem.

Then i disconnected the SAFC w/the 450's in and the car ran perfect no problem. I just don't want to send the SAFC back if its truly not defective.

Thanks in advance guys.

 

[elfroggo]

I'm not sure what you mean. Your logger and wideband are correct. 17.1+ is super lean.

lower AFR is rich, higher is lean

 

[fourreGsixty3]

Check your timing, check the afpr and make sure its set to 43psi. Psot up some readings. when you take it out, and it all goes back to normal, perhaps the safc is messing with the mas? For your creeping problem get a 38mm flapper...or pull the internal flapper, and do the SBR 38mm external WG'd o2 housing that has a dump tube. Oh yeah what was your AFR while it was running nicely, before it jumped to 17:1?

Dustin

 

[RockSolidGST]

It was idling right around 14.2-14.7

This is at 43psi W/ vacume off.

I dont understand why it would keep jumping back and forth

 

[ikickuintheball]

With the fuel problem, I'd check all of your wiring. Check the wideband power wiring and the s-afc installation wiring. That could be the problem.

With the turbo, why not just run 18psi? If you have the supporting mods, why not? Also, have you tried to see if it will creep when you run 18psi?

 

[RockSolidGST]

Well you see right now I don't have the 550's in, 18psi wouldn't be safe would it?
Also all the wiring is right, I've checked it many many times.

By the way the turbo holds 9-10 psi till 5.2k, Then it spikes almost instantly up to 18ish (don't know due to fuel cut) Is this normal? Usualy creep, Actually Creeps?

 

[ikickuintheball]

Yea.. that wouldn't be safe at all. Missed that par.

Yea, the turbo will creep. My evo 3 16g crept to 17-18psi so I just ran 20psi dail and had no problems. It would hold nice an steady. Get those 550's back in and have some fun.

 

[RockSolidGST]

Alright Guys So i have the INFAMUS , Evo 3 Big 16g , ( the real deal )


I have a ported GT manifold ( turbochargers.com kit )
Tublar o2 manifold
3'' Downpipe/catback


Every Port mod on the evo3 was done , and done correctly

Now This is my question , When i go WOT , ( wastage , to turbo ) It will pin at 11 ,

Then gradually Creep up till about 18-20

Now Vacume sorce is comming off the turbo , Right behind where it connect to the j-pipe
could this be the problem ( the niple is somewhat on the housing. ) For some reason i thought this could possibly be the problem of why it wont hold.

Im tempted to Cap the nipple , and run the T the wastgate line with the BOV just to see if that possibly changes anything. because i read that doing that will hold lower boost pressure's better , but i dont understand why that would be the case


Any other thoughts let me know ...

 

[DGajre777]

The correct way to install a boost controller to prevent boost spike is to Tee off your intake side pressure nipple/port on your turbo or j-pipe.

As for boost creep, you can try porting your turbo some more. Other options include running an o2 dump or running an external wastegate.

 

[grnchevyz]

Nipple on the J-Pipe on one side on controller, the other side should be to your wastegate actuator vaccuum nipple.

ABOSLUTELY DO NOT 'T' THE BOV LINE.

You're only looking for trouble if you do.

 

[RockSolidGST]

Yes the nipple is on the turbo housing , Like right where it meets the j-pipe flange .......Picture evo3 turbo , Then go about an inch or 2 back from the actual flange on the turbo , and thats where the nipple is.

Is that okay , or should it be farther up towards the j-pipe , or on the j-pipe itself.

 

[No_Skillz]

Or you can tune to boost 18-20 psi... no more creep issues.

Other than that, maybe try porting your O2 housing also. A properly ported Evo3 will not creep, so maybe it's not done as right as you think.

 

[grnchevyz]

I have mine right at the bend on the J-Pipe immediately after the turbo flange and it give me no issues

 

[shleppy]

Running low boost on the evo3 is very hard, I ported the heck out of mine and had a external dump and still couldn't get less than 17-18 psi at 7000rpms with the mbc turned all the way out. You could do it with a large external wastegate off the manifold, or you can simply run a minimum of 18psi-either will eliminate the creep. I see that you don't have the supporting mods for the evo3 turbo, with not having bigger injectors, fuel pump or any tuning device at all. This means that you shouldn't go full throttle at all until you get the supporting mods you need to run that turbo-doing so is just inviting disaster. And if you just don't have your mods in your profile up to date and have the supporting mods, then why are you running such low boost?

 

[Jetblack]

Nipple on the J-Pipe on one side on controller, the other side should be to your wastegate actuator vaccuum nipple.

ABOSLUTELY DO NOT 'T' THE BOV LINE.

You're only looking for trouble if you do.

Can you explain why not?

 

[thekellbeast]

Can you explain why not?

You're bleeding pressure away from the BOV line, which could cause problems when it needs to open.

 

[DGajre777]

Can you explain why not?

http://www.dsmtuners.com/forums/showthread.php?t=237982

 

[DGajre777]

Other than that, maybe try porting your O2 housing also.

You can't port a tubular o2 housing.

 

[RockSolidGST]

I have all the supporting mods

550's
safc II
wideband
logger
etc
afpr
255 pump


I had a problem with my safc , and i dont have the 550's in right now , there for i cant run 18psi.... I was bassiccly just checking where i tapped the turbo for pressure was correct , Just checking and double checking


Thanks for all the response's

 

[Kevin Jewer]

Every Port mod on the evo3 was done , and done correctly

Then why is it creeping? I find the arrogance in this statement amusing. What is the definition of "correctly?" If it's not creeping to more boost than you can safely run, then it wasn't done "correctly." Not trying to bust your balls, just thinking out loud...

You can get it down to 14-15 psi with proper turbine housing porting. I went through this before, and on the 14b as well. I found the 14b to be even harder to get boost down on because of the more restrictive 6cm housing. I didn't port a whole lot of material, but you have to take it out in the right places. The WG "exit area" is extremely important. You have to take this out until there is almost nothing left between it and the main exhaust passage, and modify the gasket to accomodate it. That should get you down to 15-16 psi. IF you need to go further, you can start to cut in a "trench" leading to the back side of the flapper. There is some theory that says this may hurt max flow, but if it did, I was unable to measure the loss. This got it down another couple psi. Port the gasket to match the work in the WG exit area, and use that as a template to gasket match the os housing to it. I had no trouble with a 2g O2 housing, but the 2g housing puts the o2 sensor in a bad place. The 1g should actually be better, in this regard. With a tubular housing you may be SOL, or at the very least have a hell of a time trying to port the much harder material.

Actually, all of my 14b porting ramblings are here. The vfaq makes some of the same points as well. Both my posts linked to here and the vfaq are at least 4 years old, this is nothing new. You should be able to apply all of this to the 16g and achieve similar results. Good luck.

 

[zippyshoe]

One other item you could check, besides the proper porting of the turbo's wastegate passage, is to make sure that there is nothing preventing the wastegate flapper from opening fully (lower heat shield, bent wastegate actuator arm, etc.) If the flapper is unable to open fully, this could contribute to boost creep. Hope this helps.

 

[No_Skillz]

You can't port a tubular o2 housing.

Whoops. Glazed over the "tubular O2 manifold" and just presumed it was tubular manifold.

 

[RockSolidGST]

Then why is it creeping? I find the arrogance in this statement amusing. What is the definition of "correctly?" If it's not creeping to more boost than you can safely run, then it wasn't done "correctly." Not trying to bust your balls, just thinking out loud...

You can get it down to 14-15 psi with proper turbine housing porting. I went through this before, and on the 14b as well. I found the 14b to be even harder to get boost down on because of the more restrictive 6cm housing. I didn't port a whole lot of material, but you have to take it out in the right places. The WG "exit area" is extremely important. You have to take this out until there is almost nothing left between it and the main exhaust passage, and modify the gasket to accomodate it. That should get you down to 15-16 psi. IF you need to go further, you can start to cut in a "trench" leading to the back side of the flapper. There is some theory that says this may hurt max flow, but if it did, I was unable to measure the loss. This got it down another couple psi. Port the gasket to match the work in the WG exit area, and use that as a template to gasket match the os housing to it. I had no trouble with a 2g O2 housing, but the 2g housing puts the o2 sensor in a bad place. The 1g should actually be better, in this regard. With a tubular housing you may be SOL, or at the very least have a hell of a time trying to port the much harder material.

Actually, all of my 14b porting ramblings are here. The vfaq makes some of the same points as well. Both my posts linked to here and the vfaq are at least 4 years old, this is nothing new. You should be able to apply all of this to the 16g and achieve similar results. Good luck.

I had my father do all the porting , Who happen to used to own a machine shop. And He is a Huge perfectionest. So im assuming that all the porting was done right. ( By him )

I even looked it over. he did the wastgate porting like you said. Its not really a big deal because once i get the injectors in. Im going to be running 20

As i said my main concern was where i was tapping for pressure on the turbo housing If that could be the problem. But , i did the wastgate could be getting caught on the lower heat sheild , Going to have to check that

 

[oldman]

If your father didn't follow this thread, he probably didn't port it "correctly". Porting for flow and porting for creep are completely different animals, like 95GSXracer said, it's where you port and not how much you port, this is why a vendor port job will do very little for creep. 12 psi to reline through proper porting has been done many times, keyword being proper.

The WG "exit area" is extremely important. You have to take this out until there is almost nothing left between it and the main exhaust passage, and modify the gasket to accomodate it. That should get you down to 15-16 psi.

Essential to a completely port job but he can't port it like the VFAQ because of the tubular o2 which can not be port matched to both the turbine housing and gasket.

 

[RockSolidGST]

He did follow that thread , Im the one that said "FOLLOW THIS THREAD" to him , not really a big deal anymore , 550s are going in today, im not worried about it anymore