Ceramic coatings vs. Jet Hot 2000 coating

[Ludachris]

After reading a number of threads that talk about the appearance of the coatings, I'd like to have a discussion about its functionality in relation to road racing and open tracking. I've used the Jet Hot 2000 coating in the past and was happy with it but never did any temp testing. I'm considering getting my FP manifold re-coated this winter and was going to go with Jet Hot, but I know some of our supporting vendors do ceramic coatings and figured it might be worth looking into.

From what I've read, it seems the Jet Hot 2000 option will hold up to the highest temps (around 2400 degrees) where the ceramic coatings are said to hold up to around 2000 degrees. However, I haven't been able to find much info comparing the two coatings in terms of how effective each coating is for reducing underhood temps. Jet Hot mentions that their 2000 degree coating isn't as effective an insulator as their Sterling/Extreme Sterling coating (1300 degree coating), even though it can withstand higher overall temps. So does that mean ceramic coatings would be more effective below 2000 degrees as well? Anyone find any good data on this?

I'd like to keep this discussion specific to these two coating options, without bringing up thermal wrapping. Please chime in if you have any data.

 

[aaronmatusz]

The main advantage of these coatings to me is it looks good and keeps rust under control when you cover the hot bits with real insulators like inconel foil.

I'm sure this ceramic stuff is very impressive, but it IS making full contact with the offending part (no low-density barrier like air) and it's mighty thin...it can only do so much.

The inconel foil service I speak of may be very pricey, but it is the highest level of thermal managment...many times more effective than coatings.

For details and maybe pics, contact the guys at: Beyond Redline :: Performance Center

 

["G"]

Swain Tech owns all. Swain Tech Coatings for engine piston coatings, race engine coatings, ceramic header coating, carbide metal coatings, thermal spray plasma coating, metalizing closures, spray welding Read about their White Lightning coating here > White Lightning Exhaust by Swain Tech for Automotive Coatings including engine piston coatings, ceramic coating services engine, automotive ceramic coating, ceramic header coating, dry film lubricant, race engine coatings, exhaust header coating It's much better than anything from Jet Hot.

 

[Ludachris]

[QUOTE="G";152086098]Swain Tech owns all. Swain Tech Coatings for engine piston coatings, race engine coatings, ceramic header coating, carbide metal coatings, thermal spray plasma coating, metalizing closures, spray welding Read about their White Lightning coating here > White Lightning Exhaust by Swain Tech for Automotive Coatings including engine piston coatings, ceramic coating services engine, automotive ceramic coating, ceramic header coating, dry film lubricant, race engine coatings, exhaust header coating It's much better than anything from Jet Hot.[/QUOTE]
Okay.... have you had experience with them? I'm looking for more input than a simple "x coatings ownz everyone" type of reply. I'm trying to get some real world feedback and some detailed technical discussions going on specific points that will not only help me with my decision, but also help others who are considering coatings for road racing applications. Please re-read my original post and see if you can contribute something more a little in depth than this.

 

["G"]

Yes I have used both on different applications for the last 15 years or so and Swain Tech is the best at keeping heat in check. It works so well you don't need heat shields though for a road racing application it wouldn't hurt. If you want to get real crazy do the swaintech & then heat wrap everything, this would be the best imo.

For the "in depth" info you seek "READ" the links I posted.

Here it is on one of my builds.

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[Scott McIntyre]

I had my exhaust parts ceramic coated with the "chrome" type coating. It looked awesome!

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But after only a week or so, the shine turned into a dull grey. Oh well, I wasn't doing it for cosmetics anyway.

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But then after a full summer of racing, the coating started to buble and flake off. Not good!

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Luckily the coater gives a 1 year warranty, so I'm getting it redone over winter; this time with their black coating which they claim holds up to heat better. We shall see...

 

[fwdmaster]

I also had my Fp manifold, evo 3 hotside, o2 housing coated from swain tech,it was coated with white lighting and finished with a coat of black, been holding up really well with no chips or discoloration.

 

[snowborder714]

Is the black paint or more coating?

 

[Ludachris]

[QUOTE="G";152086401]For the "in depth" info you seek "READ" the links I posted.[/QUOTE]
I've read several coating vendor sites, including this one. They all talk the talk. I'm looking for real world info from someone who isn't trying to sell the coating. Someone who has used them and has in depth info. I realize not many DSMers will have this insight, especially road racing DSMers, but I figured it was worth a try.

 

["G"]

My real world info is that I have used both coatings & the Swain is superior. I do not work for Swain. If you don't believe me then go ahead & waste your money on Jet-hot & see how far that gets you.

 

[DGajre777]

I had mine coated in gloss black from Bonehead Performance, this one is most probably my manifold before they shipped it out to me.

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BoneHead Performance -- Ceramics

When I was following the curing procedure, there was a small patch where the coating turned to powder and then fell off the manifold. Overall, it is holding up good, no issues with the coating itself, other than rust all over the manifold.

If I get it coated again, I will make sure that someone cures it in an oven for me or I'll be going with JetHot. Not sure if this helps since my car is a street car.

 

["G"]

Your wasting time & $ with anything else but Swain tech. If you want to actually use your coated part don't send it to bonehead. If you want it to just "look" nice when you take it out of the box then send me the $ instead. Remember the coating fp did ?

 

[JEFFREYCASTGSX]

We used the jet hot coating on my fp race manifold and on my friends exhaust manifold too, we coated it with the jet hot, and we coated his exhaust housing with some other coating that was cheaper. The cheap coating changed colors and seems to have peeled a bit, but the jet hot looks the same as when it sprayed and has NO signs fading or peeling.

 

[fergulus]

I also had bonehead ceramic coat my FP manifold, and there was absolutely no difference in underhood temps before and after. The coating has discolored, and I am seriously considering swain tech because I wanted a coat for thermal properties.

 

[Ludachris]

[QUOTE="G";152087204]My real world info is that I have used both coatings & the Swain is superior. I do not work for Swain. If you don't believe me then go ahead & waste your money on Jet-hot & see how far that gets you.[/QUOTE]
Superior how? Lower temps? Better durability? That's the info I'm looking for. I'm not saying you work for Swain - I simply said I was looking for more real world feedback beyond the tech info found on the coating sites who are trying to sell their coatings.

I've used JetHot in the past on a tubular manifold and can't say I had complaints. But back then I wasn't able to do any temp testing. That's why I'm bringing this up now.

 

["G"]

Superior to all of the above. I mentioned that the heat control is so good "you won't need a heat shield". I had a jethot coating fail on a rotary exhaust manifold, & a swain coating hold up for 3 years on the same rotary engine exhaust manifold. A turbo rotary exhaust mani produces some serious heat. Like already stated above, my real world experience over the last 15 years or so has been swaintech is worth the investment.

 

[SpeedAddict62]

Besides durability, did you do any temperature testing to quantitatively measure thermal effects of the coating?

 

["G"]

No, I am not a scientist. All I did was observe the lower under hood temps as well as feel the heat difference by hand. Also running no heat shield next to my alternator never caused it to fail like they do when you run no heat shield.

 

[Ludachris]

[QUOTE="G";152087741]No, I am not a scientist. All I did was observe the lower under hood temps as well as feel the heat difference by hand. Also running no heat shield next to my alternator never caused it to fail like they do when you run no heat shield.[/QUOTE]
How did you observe the lower under hood temps exactly? Pyrometer? Or did you have some type of gauge you were using? And you're saying those temps were lower than when you used a JetHot coating?

Just trying to get some good data, that's all.

 

[slowgsr]

I had jet hot coating on my sls t3 manifold, it was OK, I didn't like it though, it wore off to easily.

I then re-coated it with just a DIY VHT ceramic coating paint, I did however bake it on in an oven after applying it, it held up AMAZING, both I Noticed similar results as far as heat, I actually think the vht was slightly better.

For the price, can't beat the VHT diy ceramic coating as long as you do it properly its really good stuff.

 

[907gs-t]

I got Jet-Hot coated headers on my Camaro & they still look good & I've had them on my Camaro for over 8 years so I stand by there product no doubt.

 

[red_devil]

I had my holset turbine housing done by bonehead. I noticed that the under hood temps have dropped a little and it still looks new after 10k miles. I'm going to try and get a temprature reading on the housing later on in the week. Just wish I had tested the housing before I had it coated.

 

[greengoblin]

Ludachris you should ask Andrew (gixxerdrew) about it. He is using a product that I believe is very similar to the swain tech product and if anyone has good data, I would think he does.

From all the data I have read on-line I do feel the swain tech product or equivalent (Zirconia based) is a very good product.

Zircotec has good stuff too. again it what I have read. It's just to give you somethings to look into.


I'm going to be running either Swaintech or Zircotec coating on my build.

Kevin

 

[AndrewD5418]

I'd like to know whether this is the same "ceramics" that my mother uses? Is this stuff basically clay watered down into a spray form? Maybe with a few other chemicals added? In order for that clay to harden and fully cure it has to be put into a kiln at about 2,500-3,000+ degrees for quite some time. Some of the paint she uses is even required to be heated on the stuff called glaze seems to be somewhat glass like.

 

[pboglio]

Jet hot had some interesting test data regarding outside manifold runner skin temperatures with their coating side by side with an uncoated runner. I'm sure I copied the webpage but I can't find it at the moment and jethot doesn't seem to have that data posted anymore.

The standard paper thin ceramic coatings everyone is using plain don't work effectively. Measured MAF intake temps were still as high as an uncoated manifold according to EVOSCAN and the only solution was to reinstall the heatshields. A sure sign the coating isn't working is when your MAF intake temps skyrocket when going WOT, then plummet when getting off the throttle. Thats what I've seen with these thin coatings.

I cannot imagine running unshielded on a roadcoarse in temps approaching 100*F with these coatings.